# "i" before "e" except after "c"...and... **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [April 1, 2002, 9:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-before-e-except-after-c-and/101269 "2002-04-01T21:20:38Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 15\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Niobium\_Knight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/bc8723/32.png) [@Niobium\_Knight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Niobium_Knight)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2002, 9:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-before-e-except-after-c-and/101269/1 "2002-04-01T21:20:38Z")
weird, beige…any other exceptions to the rule? ---
**Author:** ![kniz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/c37758/32.png) [@kniz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kniz)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2002, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-before-e-except-after-c-and/101269/2 "2002-04-01T21:31:12Z")
Two others are:[ul] [li] neither[/li][li]either[/ul][/li] And then there is my last name that contains “nei”. ---
**Author:** ![Loopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loopus/32/15343_2.png) [@Loopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loopus)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2002, 9:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-before-e-except-after-c-and/101269/3 "2002-04-01T21:40:19Z")
The whole rule is “I before E execpt after C, except when sounded like ‘ay’ as in neighbor and weigh.” But, of course, there are exceptions to that too. -Loopus ---
**Author:** ![Niobium\_Knight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/bc8723/32.png) [@Niobium\_Knight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Niobium_Knight)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2002, 9:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-before-e-except-after-c-and/101269/4 "2002-04-01T21:45:03Z")
Yeah, like weird. ---
**Author:** ![CookingWithGas](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cookingwithgas/32/485_2.png) [@CookingWithGas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CookingWithGas)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2002, 10:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-before-e-except-after-c-and/101269/5 "2002-04-01T22:06:01Z")
seismology prescient science height counterfeit ---
**Author:** ![ultrafilter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/3d9bf3/32.png) [@ultrafilter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ultrafilter)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2002, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-before-e-except-after-c-and/101269/6 "2002-04-01T22:07:29Z")
Neither leisured foreign counterfeiter could attain either weird height without forfeiting protein. My neighbor’s eight beige reindeer weight too much to be sent by freight. Those are the only ones I know. ---
**Author:** ![Koth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/a8b319/32.png) [@Koth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Koth)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2002, 1:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-before-e-except-after-c-and/101269/7 "2002-04-02T01:22:22Z")
THANK YOU. That has always bugged me. All these silly little rules in the English language that don’t make any sense because there are always exceptions. I’m just glad to see someone else is bothered enough by them to point it out. ---
**Author:** ![Koth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/a8b319/32.png) [@Koth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Koth)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2002, 1:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-before-e-except-after-c-and/101269/8 "2002-04-02T01:23:27Z")
PS -\> I’m not crazy… anymore. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2002, 4:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-before-e-except-after-c-and/101269/9 "2002-04-02T04:48:23Z")
I might note, by the way, that **ultrafilter** ’s second example sentence does not contain any exceptions to the rule, since all of those "ei"s are sounded as “a”. ---
**Author:** ![weeds](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/5e9695/32.png) [@weeds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/weeds)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2002, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-before-e-except-after-c-and/101269/10 "2002-04-02T14:28:40Z")
There are only feisty exceptions to this rule ---
**Author:** ![ultrafilter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/3d9bf3/32.png) [@ultrafilter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ultrafilter)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2002, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-before-e-except-after-c-and/101269/11 "2002-04-02T14:38:02Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Chronos \* > \*\*I might note, by the way, that **ultrafilter** ’s second example sentence does not contain any exceptions to the rule, since all of those "ei"s are sounded as “a”. \*\* To be honest, I’d never really heard that part of the rule before. Guess my grade school education needed some work. ---
**Author:** ![glilly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/48db29/32.png) [@glilly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/glilly)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2002, 2:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-before-e-except-after-c-and/101269/12 "2002-04-02T14:52:09Z")
In a high-school English class, we were taught a longer version of the “I before E” that listed several more types of exceptions (covering almost all of them). At the time I thought it was easy to remember…but now I don’t. Does anyone know the long version of this rhyme? ---
**Author:** ![Beruang](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/77aa72/32.png) [@Beruang](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beruang)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2002, 3:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-before-e-except-after-c-and/101269/13 "2002-04-02T15:00:48Z")
We discussed this a couple years ago, but apparently the archives no longer go back that far. I kept a list for a while, which I can no longer find. But some other examples which I don’t believe have been mentioned include: their heir conscience seize – Beruang ---
**Author:** ![handy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b5a626/32.png) [@handy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/handy)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2002, 3:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-before-e-except-after-c-and/101269/14 "2002-04-02T15:29:36Z")
A great book on this is: A MANUAL OF EMAIL STYLE. It has quite a list of this & also other weird english things we were taught & why & the exceptions. ---
**Author:** ![SavageNarce](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5e925/32.png) [@SavageNarce](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SavageNarce)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2002, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-before-e-except-after-c-and/101269/15 "2002-04-02T15:35:03Z")
This, of course, is why God gave us spell check software - and, I trust, dictionary editors who know all these rules and exceptions…😕