# I believe Jose Canseco **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [February 8, 2005, 10:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-believe-jose-canseco/289071 "2005-02-08T22:46:50Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2005, 10:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-believe-jose-canseco/289071/1 "2005-02-08T22:46:50Z")
I’m no fan of Canseco’s. From everything I’ve heard and read he’s one of most gigantic assholes ever to make a Sportscenter highlight package. I think his motives are purely pecuniary. I don’t think he’s brave or heroic or worthy of praise. But I think he’s telling the truth about steroids in MLB. I believe him that McGuire was juiced (have you seen him lately? He’s shrunk _ala_ Giambi). I believe that Canseco shot up with Palmeiro and Pudge Rodriguez. I think steroid use is widespread and rampant in MLB and that all those gaudy homerun records are taunted by it. I’m getting just a bit sick of all the hypocritical indignation and moral outrage I’ve heard coming from players and the sports media about Canseco “selling out” his teammates and “betraying their loyalties.” Fuck that. They’re CHEATERS and, cheaters need to be exposed, not protected. It’s too bad that somebody as disreputable as Jose Canseco has to be the one to do this…I’d prefer come from somebody with the credibility and clean reputation of a Tony Gwynn but even so, I think Canseco is telling the truth. I think the use of steroids in baseball has been painfully obvious to the public for years and that repeated denials by players just insults our intelligence. As far as I’m concerned the record is still 61. ---
**Author:** ![World\_Eater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f04885/32.png) [@World\_Eater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/World_Eater)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2005, 10:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-believe-jose-canseco/289071/2 "2005-02-08T22:53:10Z")
I believe him too. ---
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2005, 10:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-believe-jose-canseco/289071/3 "2005-02-08T22:55:47Z")
I couldn’t care less if they were juicing or not. I think this is much ado about nothing. ---
**Author:** ![Ilsa\_Lund](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/a6a055/32.png) [@Ilsa\_Lund](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ilsa_Lund)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2005, 11:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-believe-jose-canseco/289071/4 "2005-02-08T23:12:52Z")
Without the native talent, steroid use is meaningless. ---
**Author:** ![andros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@andros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andros)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2005, 11:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-believe-jose-canseco/289071/5 "2005-02-08T23:15:55Z")
I couldn’t care less if they were shaving points or not. ---
**Author:** ![World\_Eater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f04885/32.png) [@World\_Eater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/World_Eater)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2005, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-believe-jose-canseco/289071/6 "2005-02-08T23:22:14Z")
> [@Ilsa\_Lund](#): > > Without the native talent, steroid use is meaningless. Hey dude, LTNS. ---
**Author:** ![andros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@andros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andros)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2005, 11:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-believe-jose-canseco/289071/7 "2005-02-08T23:27:12Z")
> [@Ilsa\_Lund](#): > > Without the native talent, steroid use is meaningless. Well, yeah, **Ils**. But . . . so? ---
**Author:** ![andros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@andros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andros)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2005, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-believe-jose-canseco/289071/8 "2005-02-08T23:28:17Z")
I couldn’t care less if they used Vaseline on the ball or not. ---
**Author:** ![Ilsa\_Lund](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/a6a055/32.png) [@Ilsa\_Lund](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ilsa_Lund)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2005, 11:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-believe-jose-canseco/289071/9 "2005-02-08T23:32:53Z")
> [@World Eater](#): > > Hey dude, LTNS. What up? I was without a connection for two months. ---
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2005, 11:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-believe-jose-canseco/289071/10 "2005-02-08T23:42:17Z")
> [@andros](#): > > I couldn’t care less if they used Vaseline on the ball or not. They do. Just because Gaylord Perry, Joe Niekro, Kevin Gross, and a few others were caught doesn’t mean that it doesn’t happen. Don’t kid yourself. Everyone cheats. Even the groundskeepers. ---
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2005, 11:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-believe-jose-canseco/289071/11 "2005-02-08T23:42:50Z")
> [@andros](#): > > I couldn’t care less if they used Vaseline on the ball or not. They do. Just because Gaylord Perry, Joe Niekro, Kevin Gross, and a few others were caught doesn’t mean that it doesn’t still happen. Don’t kid yourself. Everyone cheats. Even the groundskeepers. ---
**Author:** ![andros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@andros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andros)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2005, 11:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-believe-jose-canseco/289071/12 "2005-02-08T23:46:57Z")
So why, assuming you’re a baseball fan, don’t you care? Or do you draw a distinction between a spitball and juicing? They’re both cheating, no? ---
**Author:** ![alterego](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/6bbea6/32.png) [@alterego](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alterego)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2005, 11:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-believe-jose-canseco/289071/13 "2005-02-08T23:59:54Z")
I was at an As game when I was a tyke and I saw a pop fly bounce off of Canseco’s head and bounce over the fence for a home run. I honestly don’t think the guy is intelligent enough to lie 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2005, 12:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-believe-jose-canseco/289071/14 "2005-02-09T00:06:32Z")
> [@alterego](#): > > I was at an As game when I was a tyke and I saw a pop fly bounce off of Canseco’s head and bounce over the fence for a home run. Canseco must be more talented than we thought considering he was playing for the Rangers at the time. ---
**Author:** ![Agent\_Foxtrot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9fc29f/32.png) [@Agent\_Foxtrot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Agent_Foxtrot)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2005, 12:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-believe-jose-canseco/289071/15 "2005-02-09T00:10:18Z")
> [@Airman Doors](#): > > They do. Just because Gaylord Perry, Joe Niekro, Kevin Gross, and a few others were caught doesn’t mean that it doesn’t still happen. Don’t kid yourself. Everyone cheats. Even the groundskeepers. Even Bernie Williams? I’d like to think he’s of the cleanest-cut players we have today. ☹ Adam ---
**Author:** ![alterego](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/6bbea6/32.png) [@alterego](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alterego)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2005, 12:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-believe-jose-canseco/289071/16 "2005-02-09T00:14:08Z")
ahhh, was Nolan Ryan with the rangers then? because I lived in the bay area and Nolan was my idol ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2005, 12:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-believe-jose-canseco/289071/17 "2005-02-09T00:15:27Z")
> [@Airman Doors](#): > > They do. Just because Gaylord Perry, Joe Niekro, Kevin Gross, and a few others were caught doesn’t mean that it doesn’t happen. Don’t kid yourself. Everyone cheats. Even the groundskeepers. And if they get caught they get in trouble - fined and possibly suspended. Just 'cause it happens doesn’t make it right, or acceptable. Do you believe cheating is acceptable, or merely unstoppable? ---
**Author:** ![Duke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e8c25b/32.png) [@Duke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duke)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2005, 12:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-believe-jose-canseco/289071/18 "2005-02-09T00:16:04Z")
> [@Airman Doors](#): > > Everyone cheats. Even the groundskeepers. I knew it! No chemically-unenhanced groundskeeper could have cut that Red Sox logo into the outfield! Seriously, though, put me down as a “not buying the whole story.” Canseco claims he was injecting stuff into Mark McGwire’s butt. (Pause while we get that one out of our system.) Even Canseco’s defenders say he was hated in the clubhouse. Do you think McGwire would let himself get juiced by Canseco? (I know…sorry.) ---
**Author:** ![Rufus\_Xavier](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/eada6e/32.png) [@Rufus\_Xavier](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rufus_Xavier)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2005, 12:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-believe-jose-canseco/289071/19 "2005-02-09T00:18:20Z")
> [@Justin\_Bailey](#): > > Canseco must be more talented than we thought considering he was playing for the Rangers at the time. In Cleveland. On May 26th, 1993. The ball was hit by Carlos Martinez. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2005, 12:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-believe-jose-canseco/289071/20 "2005-02-09T00:20:49Z")
> [@Airman Doors](#): > > They do. Just because Gaylord Perry, Joe Niekro, Kevin Gross, and a few others were caught doesn’t mean that it doesn’t still happen. Don’t kid yourself. Everyone cheats. Even the groundskeepers. Even if we were to place the use of anabolic steroids on the same level as “wink wink” ball doctoring (which I don’t), I still think it’s insulting and hypocritical for the players to react with such phony “how dare you” shock and indignation whenever they get accused of it. Did anybody NOT know Giambi was on the juice? Does anyone not know Bonds was on it? Cheating is one thing but they don’t need act like the whistleblowers are the assholes when the truth comes out. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-believe-jose-canseco/289071.md?page=2)