# I call bullshit on John McCain's purely political "suspension" tactic. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [September 24, 2008, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-call-bullshit-on-john-mccains-purely-political-suspension-tactic/465046 "2008-09-24T19:32:40Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 10
**Author:** ![Gala\_Matrix\_Fire](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/4da419/32.png) [@Gala\_Matrix\_Fire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gala_Matrix_Fire)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2008, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-call-bullshit-on-john-mccains-purely-political-suspension-tactic/465046/181 "2008-09-25T21:17:19Z")
McCain: Lying Equals Leadership I just saw some McCain functionary or other defending McCain’s lie to David Letterman by saying, “He didn’t _lie_, he was being a leader.” ---
**Author:** ![Thom\_Yorke\_s\_Left\_Eye](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b5a626/32.png) [@Thom\_Yorke\_s\_Left\_Eye](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thom_Yorke_s_Left_Eye)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2008, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-call-bullshit-on-john-mccains-purely-political-suspension-tactic/465046/182 "2008-09-25T21:31:43Z")
> [@Clothahump](#): > > Well stated. But of course, that’s fact and it has no bearing whatsoever on DTC’s rants. > > What McCain did was honorable and correct. And please note that Obama didn’t do it. Whoaaa. How did Trig Palin learn to use a computer so quickly? ---
**Author:** ![The\_Tooth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c67d28/32.png) [@The\_Tooth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tooth)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2008, 9:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-call-bullshit-on-john-mccains-purely-political-suspension-tactic/465046/183 "2008-09-25T21:41:59Z")
> [@Jolly\_Roger](#): > > What was honorable and correct about it? You don’t think it’s right for McCain to be afraid to debate Obama? I do. ---
**Author:** ![sinjin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ebca7d/32.png) [@sinjin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sinjin)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2008, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-call-bullshit-on-john-mccains-purely-political-suspension-tactic/465046/184 "2008-09-25T22:41:14Z")
Just as a data point, I had the day off today and saw many McCain ads on TV in the St. Louis area. So suspending the campaign only means no debate right? ---
**Author:** ![wring](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/838e76/32.png) [@wring](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wring)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2008, 10:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-call-bullshit-on-john-mccains-purely-political-suspension-tactic/465046/185 "2008-09-25T22:48:34Z")
> [@The\_Tooth](#): > > You don’t think it’s right for McCain to be afraid to debate Obama? I do. I know that folks believe that JFK won because of his debates, but, IIRC, t’was more 'cause of how he looked vs. Nixon, not 'cause of how they performed. I just don’t see that folks who’re rabidly pro Obama will suddenly switch to McCain 'cause he stumbles in a debate. Same, if not more so, w/McCain. Hell, I didn’t see anyone switching loyalties when McCain kept needing Leiberman’s prodding to get the answer right. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2008, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-call-bullshit-on-john-mccains-purely-political-suspension-tactic/465046/186 "2008-09-25T23:20:03Z")
> [@wring](#): > > I know that folks believe that JFK won because of his debates, but, IIRC, t’was more 'cause of how he looked vs. Nixon, not 'cause of how they performed. I just don’t see that folks who’re rabidly pro Obama will suddenly switch to McCain 'cause he stumbles in a debate. Same, if not more so, w/McCain. Hell, I didn’t see anyone switching loyalties when McCain kept needing Leiberman’s prodding to get the answer right. But there are still a lot of undecided voters. ---
**Author:** ![wring](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/838e76/32.png) [@wring](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wring)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2008, 11:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-call-bullshit-on-john-mccains-purely-political-suspension-tactic/465046/187 "2008-09-25T23:23:01Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > But there are still a lot of undecided voters. Is there a large contingent of voters who make their decisions based on the results of the debates? ---
**Author:** ![tnetennba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tnetennba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tnetennba)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2008, 11:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-call-bullshit-on-john-mccains-purely-political-suspension-tactic/465046/188 "2008-09-25T23:27:17Z")
> [@wring](#): > > Is there a large contingent of voters who make their decisions based on the results of the debates? Gallup polls usually show a swing towards one candidate of about 4 points, particularly the first debate. I guess there are crazy people out there who make up their mind by how well the candidates explain their positions on key issues. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2008, 11:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-call-bullshit-on-john-mccains-purely-political-suspension-tactic/465046/189 "2008-09-25T23:32:04Z")
> [@Squink](#): > > [McCain Campaign Still Active Across The Country](http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/09/25/mccain-campaign-still-act_n_129327.html) Well, what do you expect. It takes time for all those letters telling them to stop to get to the campaign headquarters. Now, if there was only some way to communicate with them nearly instantaneously … ---
**Author:** ![wring](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/838e76/32.png) [@wring](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wring)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2008, 11:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-call-bullshit-on-john-mccains-purely-political-suspension-tactic/465046/190 "2008-09-25T23:36:26Z")
> [@cricetus](#): > > Gallup polls usually show a swing towards one candidate of about 4 points, particularly the first debate. I guess there are crazy people out there who make up their mind by how well the candidates explain their positions on key issues. 4 points is about the margin of error. I repeat, Is there a large contingent of voters who make their decisions based on the results of the debates? ---
**Author:** ![The\_Tooth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c67d28/32.png) [@The\_Tooth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tooth)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2008, 11:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-call-bullshit-on-john-mccains-purely-political-suspension-tactic/465046/191 "2008-09-25T23:50:48Z")
> [@wring](#): > > I know that folks believe that JFK won because of his debates, but, IIRC, t’was more 'cause of how he looked vs. Nixon, not 'cause of how they performed. I just don’t see that folks who’re rabidly pro Obama will suddenly switch to McCain 'cause he stumbles in a debate. I don’t either. If I were faced with having to defend Republican policies in public I’d run away too is what I’m saying. McCain is scared because he doesn’t have a leg to stand on, so off he goes making excuses not to debate his opponent. It seems pretty simple to me, and I am but a naive waif of a Canadian who is likely as not to be overwhelmed by the graceful intellectual ballet that is American politics. ---
**Author:** ![tnetennba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tnetennba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tnetennba)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2008, 11:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-call-bullshit-on-john-mccains-purely-political-suspension-tactic/465046/192 "2008-09-25T23:51:58Z")
> [@wring](#): > > 4 points is about the margin of error. I repeat, Is there a large contingent of voters who make their decisions based on the results of the debates? I’m not sure what you want here. “No”? OK. No! Everyone has already made up their mind! Any difference in polls is an anomaly. The debates are dumb! Nobody cares what the candidates have to say, they just want to see melodramatic ads. ---
**Author:** ![An\_Arky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/87869e/32.png) [@An\_Arky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/An_Arky)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2008, 11:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-call-bullshit-on-john-mccains-purely-political-suspension-tactic/465046/193 "2008-09-25T23:56:38Z")
The debates so overanalyzed and spun that it’s virtually impossible for there to be much movement. As someone said before, it’s about performing against (highly managed) expectations, not whether they make better arguments. It would be really cool if we could have a real debate, where points are scored, with no spectators, no talking heads or spin jockeys. Just the candidates, a moderator, and a camera. ---
**Author:** ![wring](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/838e76/32.png) [@wring](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wring)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2008, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-call-bullshit-on-john-mccains-purely-political-suspension-tactic/465046/194 "2008-09-26T00:09:55Z")
> [@cricetus](#): > > I’m not sure what you want here. “No”? OK. No! Everyone has already made up their mind! Any difference in polls is an anomaly. The debates are dumb! Nobody cares what the candidates have to say, they just want to see melodramatic ads. I’m not claiming that no one cares, that everyone has made up their minds. I just don’t see any real evidence that performance at the debates have any real effect on the outcome - Bush won. Twice. See? ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2008, 12:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-call-bullshit-on-john-mccains-purely-political-suspension-tactic/465046/195 "2008-09-26T00:19:11Z")
> [@wring](#): > > I’m not claiming that no one cares, that everyone has made up their minds. I just don’t see any real evidence that performance at the debates have any real effect on the outcome - Bush won. Twice. See? A major fuckup could make a difference. Remember Jerry Fird insisting that Poland wasn’t a puppet of Russia? ---
**Author:** ![wring](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/838e76/32.png) [@wring](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wring)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2008, 12:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-call-bullshit-on-john-mccains-purely-political-suspension-tactic/465046/196 "2008-09-26T00:23:08Z")
> [@Boyo\_Jim](#): > > A major fuckup could make a difference. Remember Jerry Fird insisting that Poland wasn’t a puppet of Russia? Ok - except that in that sense, McCain’s been in major fuck up mode for the past year and yet won his party’s nomination. ---
**Author:** ![TVeblen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/4bbf92/32.png) [@TVeblen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TVeblen)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2008, 12:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-call-bullshit-on-john-mccains-purely-political-suspension-tactic/465046/197 "2008-09-26T00:23:59Z")
[QUOTE=The Tooth] I don’t either. If I were faced with having to defend Republican policies in public I’d run away too is what I’m saying. McCain is scared because he doesn’t have a leg to stand on, so off he goes making excuses not to debate his opponent. [/QUOTE] McCain is in the hideous position of trying to pretend he’s a maverick, a beltway denizen of 26 years, who somehow amassed experience at comfortable distance from a whole hell of a lot of bad GOP baggage, e.g. Shrub’s war in Iraq, the economy in free fall, etc. His big risk with Palin is fraying at the seams too. She’s ludicrously unqualified to be Veep, much less understudy-maybe-the-fucking-_President_ to a very old guy who’s showing dire signs of wear himself. Her recent tentative forays with the press were fiascos, even though they were stringently controlled by the campaign’s handlers. Those interviews were actively painful to watch. The economic meltdown could not have come at a worse time for Maverick Johnny Mac. His whole schtick is conservatism, fiscal responsiblity, accountablity, all that high-falutin’ stuff the GOP systematically shat on for the past decade. What’s he left to argue with? I’m not suprised he _wants_ to dodge the debate; I am floored that he’s stupid enough to actually try it. Or arrogant enough, perhaps. But look at how many people still defend those two clowns, and are prepared to vote for them. Scarier than hell, actually. ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2008, 12:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-call-bullshit-on-john-mccains-purely-political-suspension-tactic/465046/198 "2008-09-26T00:31:15Z")
Yes, it seems my [earlier post](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10239147&postcount=96) is coming true. From this [NY Times](http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09/26/business/26bush.html?partner=rssyahoo&emc=rss) article: > [@](#): > > The status of a rescue plan for the nation’s financial system was in doubt on Thursday, at least for the moment, as lawmakers emerged from a meeting with President Bush to say that negotiations had a ways to go… > > One critical snag seems to be last-minute opposition to the $700 billion plan by conservative House Republicans. > > “My hope is that we can get a deal,” said Senator Christopher J. Dodd, chairman of the Senate Banking Committee, hours after House and Senate negotiators had announced that an accord was at hand. President Bush had hoped that an agreement could be announced after the late-afternoon meeting. > > Mr. Dodd, looking tired and annoyed, complained that the late complications were making the episode sound more like “a rescue plan for John McCain,” the Republican presidential candidate, than one for the financial system. ---
**Author:** ![tnetennba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tnetennba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tnetennba)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2008, 12:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-call-bullshit-on-john-mccains-purely-political-suspension-tactic/465046/199 "2008-09-26T00:38:23Z")
Well it depends on what you mean by “won.” The memorable debate moments aren’t good arguments, but good one-liners. Unfortunate, but I still think they make a difference. I wasn’t sure about Clinton’s chances, for example, until the debates. I remember Clinton saying, “The guy who invented the term ‘voodoo economics’ is now its biggest practitioner,” and the look on Bush’s face. Then in the town hall debate, some lady asked about health care stuff and the moderator asked Clinton if he wanted to elaborate on some attack on Bush and Clinton said, “I’d rather answer her question,” and the lady teared up gratefully. Those were moments that sealed the deal for Clinton. Debates don’t necessarily make a difference in every election, but they do in close ones. Hell, Bush won in 2000 just by surpassing expectations. He still “lost” if you were keeping score, but he got a bounce because he didn’t puke all over himself. I think they could make a difference in this one, but I see potentially helping or not helping Obama more than helping McCain. The best he can hope for is they don’t sink him. (That was supposed to come after wring’s comment several posts back. I spent a hella long time composing my response.) ---
**Author:** ![pepperlandgirl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/f17d59/32.png) [@pepperlandgirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pepperlandgirl)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2008, 12:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-call-bullshit-on-john-mccains-purely-political-suspension-tactic/465046/200 "2008-09-26T00:42:12Z")
John McCain’s plan to save John McCain’s Political Career includes more tax breaks and more deregulation according to [Bob Orr.](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J0663DHLr58) What the fuck, dude? What the fuck? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-call-bullshit-on-john-mccains-purely-political-suspension-tactic/465046.md?page=9) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-call-bullshit-on-john-mccains-purely-political-suspension-tactic/465046.md?page=11)