# I disagree with Jonathan chance's warning **URL:** \ **Category:** About This Message Board\ **Created:** [December 11, 2013, 2:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-disagree-with-jonathan-chances-warning/676043 "2013-12-11T02:52:15Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Aji\_de\_Gallina](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aji_de_gallina/32/260_2.png) [@Aji\_de\_Gallina](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aji_de_Gallina)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2013, 2:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-disagree-with-jonathan-chances-warning/676043/1 "2013-12-11T02:52:15Z")
On the [Judge orders Colorado baker to serve gay couples](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=709846), Una Persson made a post (after a similar one) which was basically extreme, and only-marginally relevant, post about apparent-gender work-realted discrimination which I considered to be a simple appeal to pity to boast her side of the debate. You warned me because of an “attempt to read Una’s mind with your bit about her wanting to simply get support with her story”. Does it mean I (or anyone) cannot glean such (clear for me) information from a post? ---
**Author:** ![PlainJain](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/5daacb/32.png) [@PlainJain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PlainJain)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2013, 3:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-disagree-with-jonathan-chances-warning/676043/2 "2013-12-11T03:09:27Z")
Having just read the thread, I have to go along with JC on this one. A little harsh maybe (probably should have been a note) but he’s technically right about the poster/post thing, IMHO. ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2013, 4:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-disagree-with-jonathan-chances-warning/676043/3 "2013-12-11T04:07:49Z")
If you would like, **Ají** , I will rescind **Jonathan** ’s Warning–replacing it, of course, with one for direct insults for > [@Judge orders Colorado baker to serve gay couples](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/judge-orders-colorado-baker-to-serve-gay-couples/675792/188): > > “Bronze Age goatherds”? Really? So can I go with “guys with their dick cut off” for MTF trans people? I imagine you were aiming for “100% scientific accuracy”. (And please, for your own sake, do not attempt to defend the false equivalence you set in that post.) ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2013, 4:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-disagree-with-jonathan-chances-warning/676043/4 "2013-12-11T04:30:39Z")
As a moderator I would say that the “guys with their dicks cut off” remark was extremely obnoxious, especially in the context of the person it was addressed to, and well deserving of a warning aside from anything else in the post. I certainly would have issued one. “Bronze age goatherds” in contrast was not nearly so offensive, and more to the point was not directed at any other poster participating in the thread (at least, I assume not…). ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2013, 4:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-disagree-with-jonathan-chances-warning/676043/5 "2013-12-11T04:46:29Z")
I disagree too – I don’t think his warning was harsh enough. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2013, 11:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-disagree-with-jonathan-chances-warning/676043/6 "2013-12-11T11:58:00Z")
I think Tom’s right, and Jonathan ought to be right. Your insult toward Una was nasty and out of line, and there’s clear history of Great Debates not allowing such behavior. Your pitiful attempt at mindreading Una’s motivations was also nasty and out of line, but there’s not a clear history of Great Debates not allowing such behavior. I hope that becomes the rule, because GD would only be improved by forcing people to focus on the argument. But the rule against insults is clear, and I’m glad you got called on it. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2013, 1:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-disagree-with-jonathan-chances-warning/676043/7 "2013-12-11T13:00:37Z")
In a thread devoted to debating, in part, whether laws should protect people from discrimination based on sexual orientation, **Una** posted an example from real life of what could happen where such laws do not apply. I thought it was highly relevant to the thread. ---
**Author:** ![Debaser](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/3da27b/32.png) [@Debaser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Debaser)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2013, 1:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-disagree-with-jonathan-chances-warning/676043/8 "2013-12-11T13:50:13Z")
The “Bronze age goat herder” thing was an insult, yes. But it was directed at Jesus, not another poster. I’m certain that Jesus doesn’t post here because every time I run into him I keep pestering him to, but he says he’s too busy. By responding as he or she did, **Ají de Gallina** should have expected a warning. The post was more of a rhetorical question than a direct insult, but when discussing something so personal you should err on the side of caution if you don’t want to accumulate warnings from the mods. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2013, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-disagree-with-jonathan-chances-warning/676043/9 "2013-12-11T14:38:15Z")
> [@Debaser](#): > > The “Bronze age goat herder” thing was an insult, yes. But it was directed at Jesus, not another poster. > > I’m certain that Jesus doesn’t post here because every time I run into him I keep pestering him to, but he says he’s too busy. Yeah, but in catechism, we learned that God is in all of us, so each one of us posting here could be considered God posting. And we all know that Jesus is God, so there you go! > [@](#): > > By responding as he or she did, **Ají de Gallina** should have expected a warning. The post was more of a rhetorical question than a direct insult, but when discussing something so personal you should err on the side of caution if you don’t want to accumulate warnings from the mods. Yeah, I have to say the warning was justified. The poster could have gotten his point across without the nasty tone and personal insults. ---
**Author:** ![Aji\_de\_Gallina](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aji_de_gallina/32/260_2.png) [@Aji\_de\_Gallina](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aji_de_Gallina)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2013, 3:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-disagree-with-jonathan-chances-warning/676043/10 "2013-12-11T15:19:43Z")
> [@PlainJain](#): > > Having just read the thread, I have to go along with JC on this one. A little harsh maybe (probably should have been a note) but he’s technically right about the poster/post thing, IMHO. I hope the whole “not reading a poster’s mind” is evenly applied. If that is so, then, no complaints. > [@tomndebb](#): > > If you would like, **Ají** , I will rescind **Jonathan** ’s Warning–replacing it, of course, with one for direct insults for (And please, for your own sake, do not attempt to defend the false equivalence you set in that post.) Whom did I insult? Which poster? I’ll set the equivalences I want, thankyouverymuch. It’s not your job to tell me which equivalences I can set as long as I’m not breaking any rules by doing so. > [@Colibri](#): > > As a moderator I would say that the “guys with their dicks cut off” remark was extremely obnoxious, especially in the context of the person it was addressed to, and well deserving of a warning aside from anything else in the post. I certainly would have issued one. “Bronze age goatherds” in contrast was not nearly so offensive, and more to the point was not directed at any other poster participating in the thread (at least, I assume not…). Isn’t it technically true? Assholish? Sure, but so was “bronze age goat herd”, which, apparently, is a group of people that can be belittled. In my country we still have palaolithic hunter-gatherers, can we call them stupid? Don’t I always here that I don’t have the rigth to not get offended? > [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > I think Tom’s right, and Jonathan ought to be right. > > Your insult toward Una was nasty and out of line, and there’s clear history of Great Debates not allowing such behavior. > > Your pitiful attempt at mindreading Una’s motivations was also nasty and out of line, but there’s not a clear history of Great Debates not allowing such behavior. > > I hope that becomes the rule, because GD would only be improved by forcing people to focus on the argument. But the rule against insults is clear, and I’m glad you got called on it. I did not insult the poster. > [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > In a thread devoted to debating, in part, whether laws should protect people from discrimination based on sexual orientation, **Una** posted an example from real life of what could happen where such laws do not apply. I thought it was highly relevant to the thread. I disagree on the relevance, which is OK in a debate. > [@Debaser](#): > > The “Bronze age goat herder” thing was an insult, yes. But it was directed at Jesus, not another poster. > > I’m certain that Jesus doesn’t post here because every time I run into him I keep pestering him to, but he says he’s too busy. > > By responding as he or she did, **Ají de Gallina** should have expected a warning. The post was more of a rhetorical question than a direct insult, but when discussing something so personal you should err on the side of caution if you don’t want to accumulate warnings from the mods. It wasn’t directed at Jesus, unless the poster was spectacularly misisformed as to Jesus’s time period and profession. It’s the typical playground-level put-down towards Christians. I did not insult the poster. > [@John\_Mace](#): > > Yeah, but in catechism, we learned that God is in all of us, so each one of us posting here could be considered God posting. And we all know that Jesus is God, so there you go! > > Yeah, I have to say the warning was justified. The poster could have gotten his point across without the nasty tone and personal insults. Before I’m warned again for trying to read a poster’s mind, were you trying to be funny? ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2013, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-disagree-with-jonathan-chances-warning/676043/11 "2013-12-11T15:53:46Z")
> [@Aji\_de\_Gallina](#): > > Whom did I insult? Which poster? > > … > I did not insult the poster. > > … > I did not insult the poster. Not only don’t I believe you, I’m far from convinced, given the rest of your post, that you’re sincere. Of course you insulted the poster, and your initial question about whom you insulted is belied by your later claims that you did not insult “the poster.” If you genuinely don’t see what you wrote as an insult, regard this as a learning opportunity: now you know what’s considered insulting on this board. ---
**Author:** ![Aji\_de\_Gallina](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aji_de_gallina/32/260_2.png) [@Aji\_de\_Gallina](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aji_de_Gallina)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2013, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-disagree-with-jonathan-chances-warning/676043/12 "2013-12-11T16:03:26Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > Not only don’t I believe you, I’m far from convinced, given the rest of your post, that you’re sincere. Of course you insulted the poster, and your initial question about whom you insulted is belied by your later claims that you did not insult “the poster.” > > If you genuinely don’t see what you wrote as an insult, regard this as a learning opportunity: now you know what’s considered insulting on this board. Do show where I insulted Una. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2013, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-disagree-with-jonathan-chances-warning/676043/13 "2013-12-11T16:11:40Z")
> [@Aji\_de\_Gallina](#): > > I did not insult the poster. The consensus of the board (and more importantly the moderators) disagrees with you. Whether you intended to or not, you did. Deal with it and the consequences. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2013, 4:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-disagree-with-jonathan-chances-warning/676043/14 "2013-12-11T16:14:44Z")
> [@Aji\_de\_Gallina](#): > > Do show where I insulted Una. You’ve already been shown, and you’ve denied that it is an insult. Why would showing the same thing to you again bring a different response from you? If you want to see it again, just re-read this thread. ---
**Author:** ![Aji\_de\_Gallina](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aji_de_gallina/32/260_2.png) [@Aji\_de\_Gallina](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aji_de_Gallina)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2013, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-disagree-with-jonathan-chances-warning/676043/15 "2013-12-11T16:15:49Z")
> [@Telemark](#): > > The consensus of the board (and more importantly the moderators) disagrees with you. Whether you intended to or not, you did. Deal with it and the consequences. > [@Czarcasm](#): > > You’ve already been shown, and you’ve denied that it is an insult. Why would showing the same thing to you again bring a different response from you? If you want to see it again, just re-read this thread. Do show the exact quote where I insulted her personally. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2013, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-disagree-with-jonathan-chances-warning/676043/16 "2013-12-11T16:26:03Z")
> [@Aji\_de\_Gallina](#): > > Do show the exact quote where I insulted her personally. It’s been quoted for you multiple times; quoting it again isn’t going to change your mind or ours. Either accept that you’re at odds with the board on this issue or don’t, it’s not really my concern. ---
**Author:** ![Aji\_de\_Gallina](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aji_de_gallina/32/260_2.png) [@Aji\_de\_Gallina](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aji_de_Gallina)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2013, 4:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-disagree-with-jonathan-chances-warning/676043/17 "2013-12-11T16:28:01Z")
> [@Telemark](#): > > It’s been quoted for you multiple times; quoting it again isn’t going to change your mind or ours. Either accept that you’re at odds with the board on this issue or don’t, it’s not really my concern. Do show me where it’s been quoted or do show the quote yourself. ---
**Author:** ![LibrarySpy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f9ae1b/32.png) [@LibrarySpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LibrarySpy)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2013, 4:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-disagree-with-jonathan-chances-warning/676043/18 "2013-12-11T16:36:21Z")
Since you asked SO nicely, [here you go](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=16919795&postcount=4). And [here](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=16920716&postcount=10) you admitted that it was Assholish. And on a technical note: > [@Aji de Gallina](#): > > Isn’t it technically true? No. ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2013, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-disagree-with-jonathan-chances-warning/676043/19 "2013-12-11T17:06:59Z")
> [@Aji\_de\_Gallina](#): > > I’ll set the equivalences I want, thankyouverymuch. It’s not your job to tell me which equivalences I can set as long as I’m not breaking any rules by doing so. And it is my job to hand out Warnings when you do break the rules, so it is all good. As to your repeated claim of not having insulted a poster: disingenuousness is never a good defense and you are simply burrowing down into a position that is causing the staff to review your posting privileges. ---
**Author:** ![scabpicker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/scabpicker/32/8268_2.png) [@scabpicker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scabpicker)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2013, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-disagree-with-jonathan-chances-warning/676043/20 "2013-12-11T17:19:16Z")
I’m not here to try to say the warning wasn’t warranted, but I think I might have a guess as to why Aji doesn’t understand how they insulted the poster. I think they don’t know that Una is not only an advocate for trans-gendered persons, but that Una is (I am assuming here, I could be wrong) a trans-gendered person themselves. So they could not understand that they were insulting Una directly, maybe? But, I could be completely ignorant of facts that make my guess the trademark of an idiot. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-disagree-with-jonathan-chances-warning/676043.md?page=2)