# I don't understand holocaust denial **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [March 11, 2017, 11:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-dont-understand-holocaust-denial/781963 "2017-03-11T23:15:19Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 19
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2017, 1:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-dont-understand-holocaust-denial/781963/361 "2017-05-01T13:00:21Z")
> [@Chen019](#): > > As would coming up with an argument rather than name-calling, which is always a good sign someone can’t defend their position with logic or evidence. Presumably you believe that Buchenwald inmate Professor Paul Rassinier, or medics like Dr Charles Larson, Dr Russell Barton & Dr John E Gordon who inspected camps all think “Hitler was right”. Moronic. Do you need me to provide cites for things repeatedly cited by me and multiple others participating in this thread? Very well… [here is my evidence](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=821342). As cited, there is an abundance of evidence for my position. It’s overwhelming in scope and detail and corroboration by independent sources. What you have on your side is denial bordering on anti-semitic sentiment and conjecture which has been repeatedly debunked. So I ask again, Chen019: **What do you hope to achieve with your continued counterfactual holocaust denial efforts?** ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2017, 2:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-dont-understand-holocaust-denial/781963/362 "2017-05-01T14:12:16Z")
> [@Chen019](#): > > Rudolf, here is referring to the the numbers and quantities of cyanide, which he points out keep [getting revised](http://www.vho.org/GB/Books/dth/fndgcger.html): Like if there is no evidence that show that not only is Rudolf a lair, but that also that he was already discredited many times over. > **[Holocaust Denier Jailed – DW – 03/16/2007](https://www.dw.com/en/german-holocaust-denier-imprisoned-for-inciting-racial-hatred/a-2386563)** > > A German court sentenced Holocaust denier Germar Rudolf to two and a half years in prison for inciting racial hatred in publications and Web sites which "systematically" called into question the Nazi genocide. > [@](#): > > A German court sentenced Holocaust denier Germar Rudolf to two and a half years in prison for inciting racial hatred in publications and Web sites which “systematically” called into question the Nazi genocide. > default > > Rudolf said he had found no evidence that camps like Auschwitz ever existed > > The court in Mannheim in southern Germany on Thursday found that Rudolf, 42, had contested the murder of six million Jews in Europe during World War II in propaganda on the Internet and in various publications. > > Rudolf, a trained chemist who once worked at the renowned Max Planck Institute in Stuttgart, described the Holocaust as “a gigantic fraud” during his trial. He published pseudo-scientific claims that it was impossible that Zyklon-B poison was used in the gas chambers at the Nazis’ Auschwitz death camp. > > He also said that he had found no evidence that the gas chambers used to kill hundreds of thousands of Jews ever existed. > > Deportation after escape to US > > Rudolf’s defense team Sylvia Stolz and NPD lawyer Horst Mahler > > Rudolf fled from Germany to the United States in 1995 after a court handed him a suspended sentence of 14 months for whipping up anti-Semitic sentiment. > > He applied for political asylum in the US in 2000, but was rejected. He was deported in 2005 to serve the 1995 sentence. Rudolf was arrested when he appeared at an immigration office in Chicago to apply for a green card based on his marriage to a US citizen. > > He was charged again in April 2006 with “systematically” denying or playing down the Nazi genocide of Europe’s Jews in documents and on the Internet and of stirring anti-Semitic hatred. > > “He presented the Holocaust as invention,” prosecutor Andreas Grossmann told the court in his closing speech. And with that note, I formally report the post I replied to. ---
**Author:** ![Urbanredneck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ea5d25/32.png) [@Urbanredneck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urbanredneck)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2017, 3:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-dont-understand-holocaust-denial/781963/363 "2017-05-01T15:21:58Z")
> [@Dissonance](#): > > It pisses me off that Holocaust deniers have managed to hijack and taint the term historical revision. Revisionist history didn’t used to mean lying about the past or have a negative connotation. The Institute for Historical Review doesn’t review anything; it knowingly ignores mountains of evidence. Revisionist history isn’t what Holocaust deniers actually do. Revisionist history is taking a fresh look at the past using previously unknown evidence, it isn’t pretending the pre-existing mountain of evidence isn’t there. This is what I would like to do, be a revisionist on the holocaust. Point to the other countries and people involved plus point out the many who did try and help. However how to do that without being associated with the deniers is the problem. How can I object to blanket statements like “Hitler killed 6 million Jews” without making it sound like I’m a denier? I want to say “6 million Jews and other persons were killed by this and that means and these countries all contributed”. Also some people and some countries did try to save many. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2017, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-dont-understand-holocaust-denial/781963/364 "2017-05-01T15:35:21Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > This is what I would like to do, be a revisionist on the holocaust. Point to the other countries and people involved plus point out the many who did try and help. > > However how to do that without being associated with the deniers is the problem. How can I object to blanket statements like “Hitler killed 6 million Jews” without making it sound like I’m a denier? I want to say “6 million Jews and other persons were killed by this and that means and these countries all contributed”. Also some people and some countries did try to save many. What makes you think that people are not aware that, for example, some Poles and Ukrainians assisted Germans in killing Jews while others resisted and helped hide them? And what about acknowledging either/both makes one a revisionist in the sense that holocaust denial and revisionism is commonly understood? ---
**Author:** ![Peter\_Morris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peter_morris/32/359_2.png) [@Peter\_Morris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peter_Morris)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2017, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-dont-understand-holocaust-denial/781963/365 "2017-05-01T17:34:19Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > I can’t tell if your argument is “it didn’t happen” or “it happened, but the number of victims is exaggerated”. See these two posts for a summary. [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=20091903&postcount=256](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=20091903&postcount=256) [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=20125307&postcount=300](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=20125307&postcount=300) ---
**Author:** ![Dissonance](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/85f322/32.png) [@Dissonance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dissonance)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2017, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-dont-understand-holocaust-denial/781963/366 "2017-05-01T17:49:43Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > This is what I would like to do, be a revisionist on the holocaust. Point to the other countries and people involved plus point out the many who did try and help. > > However how to do that without being associated with the deniers is the problem. How can I object to blanket statements like “Hitler killed 6 million Jews” without making it sound like I’m a denier? I want to say “6 million Jews and other persons were killed by this and that means and these countries all contributed”. Also some people and some countries did try to save many. What **QuickSilver** said, there is nothing remotely revisionist or controversial about this. This is commonly accepted history. For example, [US Holocaust Memorial Museum](https://www.ushmm.org/wlc/en/article.php?ModuleId=10007178): > [@](#): > > SECOND LARGEST GROUP OF NAZI VICTIMS > > The brutal treatment of Soviet POWs by the Germans violated every standard of warfare. Existing sources suggest that some 5.7 million Soviet army personnel fell into German hands during World War II. As of January 1945, the German army reported that only about 930,000 Soviet POWs remained in German custody. The German army released about one million Soviet POWs as auxiliaries of the German army and the SS. About half a million Soviet POWs had escaped German custody or had been liberated by the Soviet army as it advanced westward through eastern Europe into Germany. The remaining 3.3 million, or about 57 percent of those taken prisoner, were dead by the end of the war. Second only to the Jews, Soviet prisoners of war were the largest group of victims of Nazi racial policy. [The Treatment of Soviet POWs: Starvation, Disease, and Shootings, June 1941–January 1942](https://www.ushmm.org/wlc/en/article.php?ModuleId=10007183) > [@](#): > > The Auschwitz-Birkenau and Majdanek extermination camps had originally been constructed for the Soviet POWs that Heinrich Himmler had claimed for himself. The POWs were to be put to work in the huge industrial conglomerates that the SS was planning to set up together with firms such as I.G. Farben. But in January 1942, only a few hundred of the Soviet prisoners who had originally been brought to Auschwitz—out of a total of 10,000—were still alive, and no further influx was expected. For this reason Himmler decided, in the week following the Wannsee Conference, to fill the camps with 150,000 Jews. In this manner the SS camps for POWs became part of the infrastructure for the murder of the Jews. > > It was when dealing with Soviet POWs at Auschwitz that camp commandant Rudolf Hoess and his assistants experimented with the means of killing that has since become the symbol of Nazi genocide: Zyklon B. In early September 1941, 600 Soviet POWs were selected for execution. Hoess decided to gas them with Zyklon B, also known as hydrogen cyanide, in the Auschwitz I gas chamber. The experimental gassing here also included 250 inmates who had been designated unfit for work. The Nazis had already experimented with gassing as the means to kill people they considered disabled beginning in October 1939. A method was thereby found that would kill millions of people with minimal effort. Those lessons were subsequently applied first to Soviet POWs and then to Jews. By February 1942, 2,000,000 of the 3,300,000 Soviet soldiers in German custody up to that point had died from starvation, exposure, disease, or shooting. [The German Army and the Racial Nature of the War against the Soviet Union](https://www.ushmm.org/wlc/en/article.php?ModuleId=10007182): > [@](#): > > According to Nazi ideology, Slavs were useless subhumans. As such, their leaders, the Soviet elite, were to be killed and the remainder of the population enslaved or expelled further eastward. As a result of these racist fantasies, millions of Soviet civilians were deliberately killed, starved, or worked to death. Millions of others were deported for forced labor in Germany or enslaved in the occupied eastern territories. German planners called for the ruthless exploitation of Soviet resources, especially of agricultural produce. This was one of Germany’s major war aims in the east. > … > In the context of this brutal war of annihilation, German forces in 1941 had little regard for the Soviet civilian population. This was the result not only of Nazi propaganda —in which the Soviet population was portrayed as subhuman—but also of the basic orders issued by the military leadership. Hitler’s directive for the attack on the Soviet Union, the “Barbarossa” decree, called on the German troops to react to any type of resistance, even passive resistance, with shooting. German forces burned entire villages and shot the rural population of whole districts in retaliation for partisan attacks. On the other hand, military authorities made it clear that crimes committed by German soldiers were not to be punished if they claimed to have ideological considerations as their motive. This was an open invitation for soldiers to behave brutally. This of course brings us back to chen’s continued ignoring of such things as the Einsatzgruppen, the Jäger Report, Heydrich’s decree that all Jews were to be regarded as partisans and all male Jews between the ages of 15 and 45 were to be shot, the Wannsee Conference, and Generalplan Ost. My own question for chen at this point is why do you continue to bump this thread about once a week to post some already thoroughly debunked nonsense? ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2017, 1:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-dont-understand-holocaust-denial/781963/367 "2017-05-02T01:13:25Z")
Chen019, you keep digging holes. Your links are not valuable. For example, Rudolf claims that "_According to Pressac, there is no material or documentary evidence for the existence of a homicidal ‘gas chamber’ in the crematorium of the Main Camp; . . ._ " which Pressac did write, before he actually visited the camps and was given the opportunity to review the documents that he claimed did not exist. Citing Pressac from the period when he was a disciple of Faurisson, (or citing Rudolf citing earlier claims by Pressac), simply indicates a willingness to use discredited testimony. Pressac was a denier, working with Faurisson who, when Pressac actually reviewed evidence came to the conclusion that the gas chambers had really been execution chambers. What is the point of posting that sort of nonsense? Citing Rudolf relying on the wholly discredited claims by Leuchter does nothing to support either Rudolf’s claims or yours. Leuchter claimed to be an engineer, although his degree, (B.A., only), was in history. The “samples” he took from the camps were not taken with the correct care to maintain their provenance. He then sent the samples to a lab for analysis to test for cyanide without explaining their purpose, so the lab ground up the samples to be tested, mixing and diluting the surface of the cyanide imbued surfaces, where the cyanide would extend only ten micrometres into the wall, with several inches of brick and mortar from the stolen samples. While cyanide is a component of Zyklon B, it is not the sole or primary agent. Leuchter claimed that the higher presence of cyanide in the delousing chambers than the extermination chambers proved that the extermination chambers were not used for that purpose. However, one needs more cyanide to kill insects than to kill humans and his “evidence” regarding the level of cyanide actually contradicts his claim. Leuchter made a number of “engineering” claims (despite his lack of an engineering education) about the construction of the extermination chambers that are directly contradicted by the actual architectural drawings from their construction. Any reliance on the lies of Leuchter, (such as Rudolf’s persistent quoting of them), discredits anyone who uses them. ---
**Author:** ![naita](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naita/32/5862_2.png) [@naita](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/naita)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2017, 8:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-dont-understand-holocaust-denial/781963/368 "2017-05-02T08:32:22Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > However how to do that without being associated with the deniers is the problem. How can I object to blanket statements like “Hitler killed 6 million Jews” without making it sound like I’m a denier? I want to say “6 million Jews and other persons were killed by this and that means and these countries all contributed”. Also some people and some countries did try to save many. What do you think is generally meant by “Hitler killed 6 million Jews”? It’s rather obvious no one who write or say that phrase mean it as “Hitler personally killed 6 million Jews”, so what commonly held interpretation are you objecting too? ---
**Author:** ![Chen019](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f19dbf/32.png) [@Chen019](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chen019)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2017, 10:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-dont-understand-holocaust-denial/781963/369 "2017-05-02T10:46:03Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > I can’t tell if your argument is “it didn’t happen” or “it happened, but the number of victims is exaggerated”. Hi Bryan, I’ve been saying that the homicidal gas chambers, along with mass killing using electrical current, hot steam, electricity, fire, acids, pneumatic hammers, quicklime, combat gasses, Diesel exhaust gases, boiling water, blood poisoning, conveyor belt shooting, are war propaganda, on a par with atrocity propaganda employed in WWI and more recently in relation to Iraq. For example, in WWI it was claimed that German soldiers, on the instruction of the Kaiser, were hacking the hands of children, had a corpse factory to turn enemy soldiers in soap and pig food, and that the Austrians had killed 700,000 Serbs using asphyxiating gas. Even in 1991 there are some headlines that [“Iraqis have gas chambers for all Jews”](http://www.vho.org/GB/Books/tfh/Image203.gif) and “[Iraq’s German Made Gas Chambers - Germans Produce Zyklon B in Iraq](https://encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQAp977ehyy3EagJ4_kaYAmbXrCQ0WIoCdbeROsNqxXC04PXZaG)”. I also consider the numbers of deaths in the camps are likely exaggerated, although I’ve noted this could be clarified by the International Tracing Service. Why I think this is discussed in more detail in my earlier posts eg. here and [here](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=20067642&postcount=146). ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2017, 10:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-dont-understand-holocaust-denial/781963/370 "2017-05-02T10:52:52Z")
[Here is a bit of advice in the BBQ Pit](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=20176916) for those vainly trying to educate TGWATY and chen019. Sorry about the misspelling of “attention” in the Pit thread title (I reported it and perchance a mod or admin will fix it). ---
**Author:** ![naita](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naita/32/5862_2.png) [@naita](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/naita)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2017, 12:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-dont-understand-holocaust-denial/781963/371 "2017-05-02T12:02:58Z")
> [@Chen019](#): > > For example, in WWI it was claimed that German soldiers, on the instruction of the Kaiser, were hacking the hands of children, had a corpse factory to turn enemy soldiers in soap and pig food, and that the Austrians had killed 700,000 Serbs using asphyxiating gas. How many thousands eye-witness reports were recorded for those after the war? No thousands? Not comparable then. The existence of war propaganda doesn’t negate the existence of atrocities and using it as an argument shows a lack of understanding of the worlds of fact and logic. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2017, 12:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-dont-understand-holocaust-denial/781963/372 "2017-05-02T12:50:33Z")
It’ll be interesting to see if Cambodian holocaust denial (yes, [it’s a thing](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cambodian_genocide_denial))\* increases in coming years as memories fade (or at least the deniers hope that’s the case). In [this loathsome example](http://www.counterpunch.org/2012/09/18/pol-pot-revisited/), the author cites Noam Chomsky as an authority, not bothering to tell us that Chomsky walked back his claims nearly two decades before the article appeared. That tactic of citing denier views that the deniers themselves no longer hold, should be quite familiar to readers of this thread. \*the big difference of course is that such denialism is based on politics and not ethnic hatred. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2017, 1:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-dont-understand-holocaust-denial/781963/373 "2017-05-02T13:01:44Z")
> [@Chen019](#): > > … Answer the question, chen019: **What do you hope to achieve with your continued counterfactual holocaust denial efforts?** ---
**Author:** ![Chen019](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f19dbf/32.png) [@Chen019](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chen019)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2017, 11:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-dont-understand-holocaust-denial/781963/374 "2017-05-07T11:13:46Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > Answer the question, chen019: **What do you hope to achieve with your continued counterfactual holocaust denial efforts?** Hi Quicksilver, I thought I answered this [earlier](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=20137378&postcount=320). This is a debate thread by someone who is seeking discussion about how anyone could deny or dispute aspects of this part of WWII. I’ve answered with why I think it’s no surprise there is debate on this topic. After all, the official narrative itself has changed dramatically from what was claimed at Nuremberg. I don’t think anyone is going to call Dr Martin Broszat or even those who revised the number of deaths at Auschwitz "deniers’. It’s just a smear designed to stop any discussion. What do I hope to achieve? Nothing more than anyone else in this thread. I’m just offering my two cents. ---
**Author:** ![Chen019](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f19dbf/32.png) [@Chen019](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chen019)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2017, 11:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-dont-understand-holocaust-denial/781963/375 "2017-05-07T11:14:49Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > Answer the question, chen019: **What do you hope to achieve with your continued counterfactual holocaust denial efforts?** Hi Quicksilver, I thought I answered this [earlier](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=20137378&postcount=320). This is a debate thread by someone who is seeking discussion about how anyone could deny or dispute aspects of this part of WWII. I’ve answered with why I think it’s no surprise there is debate on this topic. After all, the official narrative itself has changed dramatically from what was claimed at Nuremberg. I don’t think anyone is going to call Dr Martin Broszat or even those who revised the number of deaths at Auschwitz "deniers’. It’s just a smear designed to stop any discussion. What do I hope to achieve? Nothing more than anyone else in this thread. I’m just offering my two cents. I thought that was the point of a debate section. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2017, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-dont-understand-holocaust-denial/781963/376 "2017-05-07T18:33:50Z")
> [@Chen019](#): > > I don’t think anyone is going to call Dr Martin Broszat (a denier). Perhaps that’s because Broszat has not substantially or completely denied the toll of the Holocaust (to my knowledge, he’s argued that Hitler didn’t direct it – but not that it occurred). > [@Chen019](#): > > What do I hope to achieve? Obfuscation, for starters. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2017, 8:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-dont-understand-holocaust-denial/781963/377 "2017-05-07T20:17:28Z")
> [@Chen019](#): > > Hi Quicksilver, > > I thought I answered this [earlier](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=20137378&postcount=320). This is a debate thread by someone who is seeking discussion about how anyone could deny or dispute aspects of this part of WWII. I’ve answered with why I think it’s no surprise there is debate on this topic. Your understanding of this period of history is incorrect and your sources have been debunked, time and time again. I’m not going spend additional time debunking them if you refuse to read and understand why your conclusions are wrong. > [@Chen019](#): > > After all, the official narrative itself has changed dramatically from what was claimed at Nuremberg. I don’t think anyone is going to call Dr Martin Broszat or even those who revised the number of deaths at Auschwitz "deniers’. It’s just a smear designed to stop any discussion. Asked and answered. > [@Chen019](#): > > What do I hope to achieve? Nothing more than anyone else in this thread. I’m just offering my two cents. What you’ve offered, at best, is conjecture, at worst, distortions and falsehoods. Please don’t insult people’s intelligence in claiming that these are simply your two cents worth of opinions. Most informed people know denial and revisionism when they hear it. You’re hardly the first to come along bearing alternative facts as evidence. The reason we’re able to judge your opinion as factually incorrect is because there is an overwhelming abundance of debunking that’s been done to show it is in fact factually incorrect. I suspect you know this to be true. So the only question that remains un-answered, Chen019, is: What do you hope to achieve with your continued counterfactual holocaust denial efforts? ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2017, 9:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-dont-understand-holocaust-denial/781963/378 "2017-05-07T21:16:05Z")
> [@Chen019](#): > > Hi Quicksilver, > > I thought I answered this [earlier](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=20137378&postcount=320). This is a debate thread by someone who is seeking discussion about how anyone could deny or dispute aspects of this part of WWII. I’ve answered with why I think it’s no surprise there is debate on this topic. No there is not, (and not where it counts, among academia and historians) there could be if evidence from the holocaust deniers was not as debunked or itself as controversial as it is. The evidence is not on your side at all. As it was the climate change denial and scientific racism that you pointed at in the past. ---
**Author:** ![Chen019](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f19dbf/32.png) [@Chen019](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chen019)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2017, 7:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-dont-understand-holocaust-denial/781963/379 "2017-06-02T07:53:41Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > Your understanding of this period of history is incorrect and your sources have been debunked, time and time again. I’m not going spend additional time debunking them if you refuse to read and understand why your conclusions are wrong. Sorry for the delayed response - I’ve been on holiday and travelling. What specifically has been debunked? I responded in some detail earlier. Perhaps you could address this if you’re serious about debating the subject. ---
**Author:** ![Chen019](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f19dbf/32.png) [@Chen019](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chen019)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2017, 8:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-dont-understand-holocaust-denial/781963/380 "2017-06-02T08:13:38Z")
> [@Jackmannii](#): > > Perhaps that’s because Broszat has not substantially or completely denied the toll of the Holocaust (to my knowledge, he’s argued that Hitler didn’t direct it – but not that it occurred).Obfuscation, for starters. Dr Broszat conceded in 1960 that the claims made at Nuremberg that their was gassing or mass extermination in German camps like Dachau, Buchenwald & Bergen-Belsen, were incorrect. He noted that inmates who died in the German camps had succumbed to catastrophic hygienic and supply conditions. Broszat didn’t explain why the eye-witness evidence that had been relied on at Nuremberg was no longer reliable. It would be interesting to know how he reached his conclusions & why the eye-witness evidence from Polish camps could be relied upon. As I have pointed out above, the reality is that the testimonies about the Polish camps is no more reliable than the testomonies about Buchenwald or other German camps. Indeed, it is directly contradicted by British Intelligence intercepts, inmate records & forensic evidence. In both cases, it IS consistent with atrocity propaganda that was spread during the war. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-dont-understand-holocaust-denial/781963.md?page=18) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-dont-understand-holocaust-denial/781963.md?page=20)