# I don't want stupid fucks defending my country!! **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [December 15, 2004, 4:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-dont-want-stupid-fucks-defending-my-country/279929 "2004-12-15T04:36:03Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![tnetennba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tnetennba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tnetennba)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2004, 12:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-dont-want-stupid-fucks-defending-my-country/279929/21 "2004-12-15T12:24:55Z")
I can’t criticize the decision to give finger for ring. It’s exactly the kind of foolish sentimental thing a 19-year-old SHOULD do when separated from his woman. He won’t be the first GI to lose a digit for love while in combat, but it will be a lesser digit and a better story. My only complaint is that the GI inspired a bit of glurge that will eventually end up in my e-mail in box, complete with embellishments and jingoism. That, like the war, is not his fault. ---
**Author:** ![RTA](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/b4bc9f/32.png) [@RTA](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTA)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2004, 1:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-dont-want-stupid-fucks-defending-my-country/279929/22 "2004-12-15T13:50:53Z")
A story custom-fit for making right-wing eyeballs well up with patriotic crocodile tears: it minimizes the hardships of “the troops” while touting the bedrock institution of Judeo-Christian marriage. ---
**Author:** ![Chairman\_Pow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/838e76/32.png) [@Chairman\_Pow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chairman_Pow)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2004, 1:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-dont-want-stupid-fucks-defending-my-country/279929/23 "2004-12-15T13:55:11Z")
> [@Liberal](#): > > The soldiers are brave, and those who call them stupid fucks are nothing more than nebbish and shadowy vestiges of man’s evolution, doomed by their own cowardice to become extinct. Except that there those same dudes standing between you and the bullets are standing between them and the bullets. Unfortunately, it appears that people with conviction are always under the hammer while people who only care for self-preservation and anonymous mocking are nowhere to be found. ---
**Author:** ![gobear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/8dc957/32.png) [@gobear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gobear)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2004, 2:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-dont-want-stupid-fucks-defending-my-country/279929/24 "2004-12-15T14:04:01Z")
While I agree that the soldier’s romantic gesture was not clearly thought out, mocking a guy who made a bad decision under stress while wounded is scummy. And let’s not confuse the bullshit nature of this war with the characters of the men sent to fight in it. ---
**Author:** ![tnetennba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tnetennba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tnetennba)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2004, 2:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-dont-want-stupid-fucks-defending-my-country/279929/25 "2004-12-15T14:05:19Z")
> [@gobear](#): > > While I agree that the soldier’s romantic gesture was not clearly thought out, mocking a guy who made a bad decision under stress while wounded is scummy. > > And let’s not confuse the bullshit nature of this war with the characters of the men sent to fight in it. Then let’s no sentimentalize and romanticize the character of the men who were sent to fight it. ---
**Author:** ![gobear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/8dc957/32.png) [@gobear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gobear)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2004, 2:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-dont-want-stupid-fucks-defending-my-country/279929/26 "2004-12-15T14:11:16Z")
> [@cricetus](#): > > Then let’s no sentimentalize and romanticize the character of the men who were sent to fight it. I’m not. I noted the kid made a bad decision, but seeing the stress he was under at the time and his age, I’m not going to fault him for it. Given the statistical likelihood of his getting a divorce from his wife (married young and military are two high-risk factors for divorce), he’ll be kicking himself plenty later on. ---
**Author:** ![tnetennba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tnetennba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tnetennba)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2004, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-dont-want-stupid-fucks-defending-my-country/279929/27 "2004-12-15T14:15:49Z")
> [@gobear](#): > > I’m not. I noted the kid made a bad decision, but seeing the stress he was under at the time and his age, I’m not going to fault him for it. Given the statistical likelihood of his getting a divorce from his wife (married young and military are two high-risk factors for divorce), he’ll be kicking himself plenty later on. I agree with that. He’s probably a nice kid, but he is a teenager. Back on topic. Indeed, if there’s anything left in it. What I would love is for a bit of glurge to come from Iraq about a bona fide hero sacrificing a limb to save his wedding wing… which is from his husband. Set the Republican heads spinning. ---
**Author:** ![pkbites](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pkbites/32/204_2.png) [@pkbites](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pkbites)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2004, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-dont-want-stupid-fucks-defending-my-country/279929/28 "2004-12-15T15:01:41Z")
Ok, lets step away from my rant on the soldier. What about the “Doctor” :dubious: who agreed to take his finger off to save a ring? What’s wrong with THAT guy? If this kid was indeed under stress, shouldn’t that “Doctor”:dubious: have made a more rational decision than to cut off a finger to save a piece of jewlery? Whatever happened to “First do no harm”? ---
**Author:** ![World\_Eater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f04885/32.png) [@World\_Eater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/World_Eater)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2004, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-dont-want-stupid-fucks-defending-my-country/279929/29 "2004-12-15T15:14:27Z")
> [@RTA](#): > > A story custom-fit for making right-wing eyeballs well up with patriotic crocodile tears: it minimizes the hardships of “the troops” while touting the bedrock institution of Judeo-Christian marriage. **RTA** wins! ---
**Author:** ![tnetennba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tnetennba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tnetennba)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2004, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-dont-want-stupid-fucks-defending-my-country/279929/30 "2004-12-15T15:17:54Z")
> [@pkbites](#): > > Ok, lets step away from my rant on the soldier. > > What about the “Doctor” :dubious: who agreed to take his finger off to save a ring? What’s wrong with THAT guy? If this kid was indeed under stress, shouldn’t that “Doctor”:dubious: have made a more rational decision than to cut off a finger to save a piece of jewlery? Whatever happened to “First do no harm”? Well, the article did say the option was to “try” and save “most” of the finger. I think we need to suspend judgment and get more information, get clarity on what it means to try and save most of something. ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2004, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-dont-want-stupid-fucks-defending-my-country/279929/31 "2004-12-15T15:32:42Z")
> [@RTA](#): > > A story custom-fit for making right-wing eyeballs well up with patriotic crocodile tears: it minimizes the hardships of “the troops” while touting the bedrock institution of Judeo-Christian marriage. That’s exactly why I don’t want communist jackasses like you doing your central planning, and why the choice between your tyranny and that of the right is the frying pan versus the fire. You see all of life as symbols and hypostatized abstractions. For you, there is no man here, just a prosopopoeia; no deeply felt love, just an institution you hate; no empathy with his plight, just an opportunity for you to deliver a tedious platitude. You leftists are such idiots — you have allowed the right to steal everything you once championed. You’ve become authoritarian troglodytes, emptying yourselves of humanity while fancying yourselves to be some sort of Vulcan thinking machines. It is sad that by your ineptitude, you are assisting the tight-ass moralists in their quest to take power. ---
**Author:** ![Metacom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ecae2f/32.png) [@Metacom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Metacom)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2004, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-dont-want-stupid-fucks-defending-my-country/279929/32 "2004-12-15T15:45:11Z")
> [@cricetus](#): > > Well, the article did say the option was to “try” and save “most” of the finger. I think we need to suspend judgment and get more information, get clarity on what it means to try and save most of something. What’s there to judge? He’s voluntarily risking his life to serve his country, and it’s no ones place to ridicule him for making a romantic gesture towards his wife. He obviously considers the ring an important symbol of a treasured relationship. He only had one ring, but he had 10 fingers. The only person who can decide how valuable his wedding ring to him is him, likewise for his finger. If the OP doesn’t want stupid fucks defending his country, I’d advise him not to enlist. ---
**Author:** ![tnetennba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tnetennba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tnetennba)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2004, 3:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-dont-want-stupid-fucks-defending-my-country/279929/33 "2004-12-15T15:56:59Z")
> [@Metacom](#): > > What’s there to judge? He’s voluntarily risking his life to serve his country, and it’s no ones place to ridicule him for making a romantic gesture towards his wife. He obviously considers the ring an important symbol of a treasured relationship. He only had one ring, but he had 10 fingers. The only person who can decide how valuable his wedding ring to him is him, likewise for his finger. > > If the OP doesn’t want stupid fucks defending his country, I’d advise him not to enlist. Read the post I quoted in my own post – we were talking about the doctor, not the soldier. ---
**Author:** ![BubbaDog](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bubbadog/32/333_2.png) [@BubbaDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BubbaDog)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2004, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-dont-want-stupid-fucks-defending-my-country/279929/34 "2004-12-15T16:01:43Z")
> [@cricetus](#): > > Well, the article did say the option was to “try” and save “most” of the finger. I think we need to suspend judgment and get more information, get clarity on what it means to try and save most of something. And that lack of “clarity” is where most of ammo for this debate lies. It is possible that the soldier looked at his finger and thought, “it’s mostly just a stub left anyway. Might as well remove the last 1/2 inch and save the ring.” ---
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2004, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-dont-want-stupid-fucks-defending-my-country/279929/35 "2004-12-15T16:05:05Z")
You don’t want supid fucks defending your country, eh? So that means that you, with all of your wisdom and intelligence, will be beating feet to the nearest recruiting station to volunteer, right? It’s amazing how you can criticize what this guy did. You have some nerve. > [@](#): > > _From the article…_ > > The 19-year-old suffered a mangled left hand and serious wounds to his legs in a November 13 fire fight in Falluja. Battle, who is recovering at his parents’ home in this desert city 130 kilometers (80 miles) northeast of Los Angeles, came under attack as he and fellow Marines entered a building. Eleven other Marines were wounded. How about you, hero? What have you done? ---
**Author:** ![tdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/94ad74/32.png) [@tdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tdn)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2004, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-dont-want-stupid-fucks-defending-my-country/279929/36 "2004-12-15T16:23:12Z")
> [@Liberal](#): > > That’s exactly why I don’t want communist jackasses like you doing your central planning, and why the choice between your tyranny and that of the right is the frying pan versus the fire. You see all of life as symbols and hypostatized abstractions. For you, there is no man here, just a prosopopoeia; no deeply felt love, just an institution you hate; no empathy with his plight, just an opportunity for you to deliver a tedious platitude. You leftists are such idiots — you have allowed the right to steal everything you once championed. You’ve become authoritarian troglodytes, emptying yourselves of humanity while fancying yourselves to be some sort of Vulcan thinking machines. It is sad that by your ineptitude, you are assisting the tight-ass moralists in their quest to take power. **Lib** , I’ve long ago stopped taking you seriously, but this time curiousity has got the better of me. What in the name of Og’s little green apples are you babbling about this time? ---
**Author:** ![pkbites](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pkbites/32/204_2.png) [@pkbites](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pkbites)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2004, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-dont-want-stupid-fucks-defending-my-country/279929/37 "2004-12-15T16:23:55Z")
> [@Airman Doors](#): > > It’s amazing how you can criticize what this guy did. You have some nerve. How about you, hero? What have you done? In 20 years of LE I’ve done quite a few things. But who cares. I’m not talking about what he did in action. I’m talking about the strange decision to have his digit (not limb like I mistakenly posted) cut off to save a piece of metal. I’ve been wearing a platinum ring for 25 years as of next month. I wouldn’t cut my finger off to save it. It’s replaceable. Is cutting off body parts the new romantic gesture of the 21st century? But, like I previously posted, lets step back from my rant about the soldier. Perhaps I didn’t take into account the stress this man was under. He may not have been thinking rationally. But what about the “doctor”? What doctor agress to cut off body parts to save replaceable jewlery? It just doesn’t seem professional. ---
**Author:** ![Metacom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ecae2f/32.png) [@Metacom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Metacom)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2004, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-dont-want-stupid-fucks-defending-my-country/279929/38 "2004-12-15T16:27:22Z")
> [@cricetus](#): > > Read the post I quoted in my own post – we were talking about the doctor, not the soldier. My apologies. ---
**Author:** ![tnetennba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tnetennba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tnetennba)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2004, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-dont-want-stupid-fucks-defending-my-country/279929/39 "2004-12-15T16:34:42Z")
> [@pkbites](#): > > What doctor agress to cut off body parts to save replaceable jewlery? It just doesn’t seem professional. The doctor agreed not to “try” and save “most” of the finger, because he respected the will of his patient. This was in the article, and has already been discussed here. ---
**Author:** ![pkbites](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pkbites/32/204_2.png) [@pkbites](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pkbites)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2004, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-dont-want-stupid-fucks-defending-my-country/279929/40 "2004-12-15T16:54:25Z")
> [@cricetus](#): > > because he respected the will of his patient. That soldier may not have been thinking clearly. It’s possible my original rant upon the soldier was inappropriate, as he may have been suffering from a high degree of stress. I’m highly suspicious of any doctor who removes body parts that could have been spared because the patient requested it. At what point does “respecting the will of the patient” cross over into gross unprofessionalism? Cutting off a clitoris for religious reasons? Cutting off a penis to save a metal stud? Cutting off a finger to save a ring? What is the cut off [no pun intended] point? Why didn’t this doctor say “no, we’re not going to do that. Your ring can be replaced”? Perhaps this doctor isn’t qualified to be caring for our fighting men. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-dont-want-stupid-fucks-defending-my-country/279929.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-dont-want-stupid-fucks-defending-my-country/279929.md?page=3)