# I feel like I am the victim of my own education **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [May 25, 2012, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-feel-like-i-am-the-victim-of-my-own-education/623095 "2012-05-25T19:29:20Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Ambivalid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a5b964/32.png) [@Ambivalid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ambivalid)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2012, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-feel-like-i-am-the-victim-of-my-own-education/623095/41 "2012-05-26T18:33:32Z")
I am not in the habit of challenging a poster’s credibility but I simply don’t believe this poster has attained the level of education that she claims. Her posting history belies this notion; quite starkly, if you ask me. ---
**Author:** ![SecretaryofEvil](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e95f7d/32.png) [@SecretaryofEvil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SecretaryofEvil)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2012, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-feel-like-i-am-the-victim-of-my-own-education/623095/42 "2012-05-27T17:06:04Z")
> [@Diamonds02](#): > > Education has not benefitted me. I’m shocked. Given your posting history, I always assumed you were extremely well educated and applied this education intelligently in your daily life. ---
**Author:** ![Astroboy14](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/df705f/32.png) [@Astroboy14](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Astroboy14)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2012, 6:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-feel-like-i-am-the-victim-of-my-own-education/623095/43 "2012-05-27T18:03:24Z")
[QUOTE=Dean Wormer] Fat, drunk and stupid is no way to go through life, son. [/QUOTE] So far, so good. ---
**Author:** ![Silophant](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a698b9/32.png) [@Silophant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Silophant)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2012, 11:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-feel-like-i-am-the-victim-of-my-own-education/623095/44 "2012-05-27T23:46:55Z")
> [@Ambivalid](#): > > I am not in the habit of challenging a poster’s credibility but I simply don’t believe this poster has attained the level of education that she claims. Her posting history belies this notion; quite starkly, if you ask me. I agree. For reference, [here’s](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=12145779&postcount=3) the post **Marley** was referring to upthread. On the other hand, maybe it’s [this kind of situation](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=653211). ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2012, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-feel-like-i-am-the-victim-of-my-own-education/623095/45 "2012-05-28T22:18:05Z")
Google “Joe Green Harvard”. He wisely decided to complete his education instead of tagging along with his dropout roomate. ---
**Author:** ![guizot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guizot/32/3636_2.png) [@guizot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/guizot)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2012, 10:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-feel-like-i-am-the-victim-of-my-own-education/623095/46 "2012-05-28T22:52:11Z")
> [@even\_sven](#): > > For the love of god, if you are at the graduate level and you are not sure what you are getting out of education, you are doing it wrong. A graduate education is a tool- And you have to figure out how to use it to your own ends. The attitude of the OP–and all the others who come here all the time to post this same sentiment–is that going to college is like going to City Hall to get a permit, where you pay your fee, they give you a piece of paper, and instantly you’re transformed into a business or an operator or something. It’s a perfunctory, one-dimensional view of the whole process. Really, if that’s how you really think it works, then no wonder it hasn’t gotten you anywhere. > [@olivesmarch4th](#): > > The idea of getting an education for its own sake is increasingly becoming the prerogative of the privileged. That’s how higher education originally was two or three hundred years ago–a past-time. The real problem here has nothing to do with education itself, and everything to do with its inflated costs. ---
**Author:** ![Dangerosa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Dangerosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dangerosa)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2012, 1:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-feel-like-i-am-the-victim-of-my-own-education/623095/47 "2012-05-29T13:07:06Z")
> [@guizot](#): > > And you have to figure out how to use it to your own ends. > > The attitude of the OP–and all the others who come here all the time to post this same sentiment–is that going to college is like going to City Hall to get a permit, where you pay your fee, they give you a piece of paper, and instantly you’re transformed into a business or an operator or something. It’s a perfunctory, one-dimensional view of the whole process. Really, if that’s how you really think it works, then no wonder it hasn’t gotten you anywhere. > That’s how higher education originally was two or three hundred years ago–a past-time. > > The real problem here has nothing to do with education itself, and everything to do with its inflated costs. I wonder when education for the sake of education was not a privilege of the rich? Most of us poor schlubs through history had to learn to do something we could apply towards making a living. And, yes, that education did tend to enrich us in other ways, even if your education was being apprenticed to a shoemaker. But the luxury to study something with no practical application has always meant you need wealth, or a patron. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2012, 1:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-feel-like-i-am-the-victim-of-my-own-education/623095/48 "2012-05-29T13:26:20Z")
As other have said, I’d like to hear some details about what disasterous results the OP got from using her education. But in general, I’d say that education is like a lot of things - it’s a tool not a servant. You can use education to do something but education won’t do something for you. I don’t like bringing in things from other threads but the OP has indicated she’s looking for an easy shortcut to success. Education isn’t that. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2012, 1:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-feel-like-i-am-the-victim-of-my-own-education/623095/49 "2012-05-29T13:47:49Z")
> [@EmAnJ](#): > > I have a feeling the OP was referring to high school, to be honest.\ > [@Ambivalid](#): > > I am not in the habit of challenging a poster’s credibility but I simply don’t believe this poster has attained the level of education that she claims. Her posting history belies this notion; quite starkly, if you ask me. I was going to ask if anyone else was in shock at the idea that **diamonds02** has any higher education at all, but I see I am not alone. ---
**Author:** ![phall0106](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/phall0106/32/5934_2.png) [@phall0106](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/phall0106)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2012, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-feel-like-i-am-the-victim-of-my-own-education/623095/50 "2012-05-29T15:28:42Z")
> [@Dr.Drake](#): > > That’s because an education isn’t really about the stuff you learn, it’s about the process of learning it. While you were learning subject matter that likely you won’t use much again, you were also learning how to think critically, motivate yourself, navigate uncaring bureaucracies, write better, and tons of other things. No, your professors didn’t lecture on these subjects, but in order to complete university (much less graduate school), you must have learned them. THAT’S what you apply in the real world, not the subject matter unless you happen to be pursuing that as a career path. Thank you, Dr. Drake. I’ve been trying to convey this to my mother (who doesn’t have any college experience), however, she fails to grasp why going to college was so important for me. ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2012, 3:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-feel-like-i-am-the-victim-of-my-own-education/623095/51 "2012-05-29T15:33:00Z")
If he pays as much attention to his working life as he does to the threads he starts, I’m not surprised that things aren’t going so well. If he’s a victim, it’s a self-inflicted gunshot wound. ---
**Author:** ![cmyk](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmyk/32/3353_2.png) [@cmyk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmyk)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2012, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-feel-like-i-am-the-victim-of-my-own-education/623095/52 "2012-05-29T16:03:10Z")
_sigh_ What, did you expect school to make you intelligent? What you get out of an education is what you bring to it. In fact, I’d generally advise against it, unless you’re bent on becoming a career academic, or delving into some serious specialty, like law, physics or medicine. Is it just me, or is being an autodidact (or shoot, learning/apprenticing in a trade you love) frowned upon or largely underestimated? I find the people I like working with most in my trade are the self-learners. They seem more hungry for knowledge, obsessed with mastering skills or techniques and, in general, seem to be natural problem solvers; which 9 times out of 10 goes a lot farther than a nicely framed and expensive Masters Degree. ---
**Author:** ![overlyverbose](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/9dc877/32.png) [@overlyverbose](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/overlyverbose)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2012, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-feel-like-i-am-the-victim-of-my-own-education/623095/53 "2012-05-29T16:29:30Z")
Being a victim of your education depends heavily on the work you’re attempting to get or what you’re trying to do with your education. For example, when I was fresh out of my master’s program and a relative rookie at trying to get a job, I kept my master’s degree on my resume when applying for administrative positions. Shockingly (or not), I didn’t get anything resembling a job until I removed it. However, when I was no longer entry level, my education went right back on my resume because then it started to open doors for me. At that point, it wasn’t something that employers saw and assumed I was too qualified; rather, it was icing on the cake. So, what is it you’re trying to use your education for? ---
**Author:** ![Diamonds02](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b5a626/32.png) [@Diamonds02](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diamonds02)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2012, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-feel-like-i-am-the-victim-of-my-own-education/623095/54 "2012-05-29T17:42:06Z")
Get me a damn job. Any job, even a barista at Starbucks. Not even a job really. I know there’s tons of competition and the economy is bad, so I’m not expecting to get every job I apply for. I’m expecting for my education to open some doors for me. At least a freaking job interview. I’ve put in nearly 100 applications/resumes and only got four interviews since I graduated in 2009. I also expected my education to help me understand the world better. It seems that I wasn’t taught the important things, and the things I did learn now appears to be misinformation ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Drake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ad7895/32.png) [@Dr.Drake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Drake)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2012, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-feel-like-i-am-the-victim-of-my-own-education/623095/55 "2012-05-29T17:57:18Z")
> [@Diamonds02](#): > > I’ve put in nearly 100 applications/resumes and only got four interviews since I graduated in 2009. Assume graduation = June 2009. Assume well-earned summer holiday following. September, October, November, December 2009 + 2010 + 2011 + Jan – May 2012 = 33 months. 100 applications / resumes ÷ 33 = 3.33 per month; there are 4.33 weeks per month, so you’re telling us you average one application every nine days. I’m sorry you’re discouraged, but: 1. A 25:1 application:interview ratio is actually pretty good these days, especially when you’re starting out and competing against people with more connections and experience in a tough economy. 2. You should be sending out 5–10 applications a week, assuming it takes a couple to a few hours to research and put together a package. 3. Do not confine your applications to advertised jobs: send applications and letters of enquiry in to ANYPLACE you’d like to work; what have you got to lose? 4. Adjust the attitude, pronto. The world doesn’t owe you shit. 5. Learn more effective job-seeking strategies (networking, volunteering, temping, etc.) Your current strategies are, by definition, not effective. ---
**Author:** ![overlyverbose](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/9dc877/32.png) [@overlyverbose](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/overlyverbose)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2012, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-feel-like-i-am-the-victim-of-my-own-education/623095/56 "2012-05-29T17:58:08Z")
In that case, I’d recommend taking your higher ed off your application for those positions that don’t require it. In an ideal world, higher ed would mean higher likelihood of employment. But right now, higher ed for entry-level and service positions translates to, “Likely to leave soon or be completely unsatisfied with this job.” What really blows about employment, though, is that even for entry-level, a lot of people don’t want to hire the inexperienced, but you have to be hired to, you know, get experience. It sucks, but there you go. Anyway, I’m sorry you’ve had so much trouble getting a job. I’m guessing you’ve submitted some apps to a temp agency? If not, that could be a good place to start, at least until you have some experience under your belt and can move on up. For what it’s worth, my master’s taught me a few things (which I think have been most important to my career success): how to research, how to communicate what I research and most importantly that I don’t know shit. ---
**Author:** ![DiosaBellissima](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a8b319/32.png) [@DiosaBellissima](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DiosaBellissima)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2012, 6:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-feel-like-i-am-the-victim-of-my-own-education/623095/57 "2012-05-29T18:28:50Z")
> [@Diamonds02](#): > > Get me a damn job. Any job, even a barista at Starbucks. > > Not even a job really. I know there’s tons of competition and the economy is bad, so I’m not expecting to get every job I apply for. I’m expecting for my education to open some doors for me. At least a freaking job interview. I’ve put in nearly 100 applications/resumes and only got four interviews since I graduated in 2009. > > I also expected my education to help me understand the world better. It seems that I wasn’t taught the important things, and the things I did learn now appears to be misinformation I assume you want to go into teaching. Have you considered moving to a state with higher demand for teachers, so you can get your foot in the door? Granted, I don’t know where you live now, but I’m guessing by what you’re saying that you can’t get hired on to the district there. A second option is to befriend teachers who work where you want to work. A good word goes a long way in that industry. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2012, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-feel-like-i-am-the-victim-of-my-own-education/623095/58 "2012-05-29T19:16:27Z")
> [@Dr.Drake](#): > > That’s because an education isn’t really about the stuff you learn, it’s about the process of learning it. While you were learning subject matter that likely you won’t use much again, you were also learning how to think critically, motivate yourself, navigate uncaring bureaucracies, write better, and tons of other things. No, your professors didn’t lecture on these subjects, but in order to complete university (much less graduate school), you must have learned them. THAT’S what you apply in the real world, not the subject matter unless you happen to be pursuing that as a career path. I’ve made the point in the past that the value of having a degree is that it shows you can get a degree. And I don’t mean that as a joke. Look at obtaining a college degree as a process. You’re basically entering a program where you’re going to spend several years going through a series of intermediate steps and working with a number of different people with the purpose of obtaining a singular established goal. Consider all the skills that are necessary to do this. Now think about the business environment and notice the skills you need there. You’re also going to be involved in long-term projects that’ll have to be broken up into manageable steps. And you’re going to have to work with a variety of people. The skills you learn in obtaining a degree - independant of the content of the coursework - are valuable in a business environment. Having a degree essentially shows an employer that you can successfully complete a major project. ---
**Author:** ![even\_sven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/dfb087/32.png) [@even\_sven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/even_sven)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2012, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-feel-like-i-am-the-victim-of-my-own-education/623095/59 "2012-05-29T19:51:24Z")
> [@Diamonds02](#): > > Not even a job really. I know there’s tons of competition and the economy is bad, so I’m not expecting to get every job I apply for. I’m expecting for my education to open some doors for me. At least a freaking job interview. I’ve put in nearly 100 applications/resumes and only got four interviews since I graduated in 2009. My MA program is a well known school in a very targeted field, and we average a 1 in 10 interview rate on job applications- your numbers are not too far off even for a job searcher in a perfect situation. A job search is not a hit or miss thing where you send resumes off into the void. To be done well, it needs to be done systematically using a variety of approaches. Are you able to meet with a career counselor at your school? I am starting a job search right now, and I have a multi-pronged approach: 1. I’ve got a list of around 50 targeted organizations. I check their websites once or twice a week for appropriate positions, sort them onto a spreadsheet by application close date, and work through that list throughout the week. I know my industry inside and out, and I keep track of who is expanding, who is doing projects I’m qualified for, and what trends I should keep up on. 2. When I go to job fairs, I apply ahead of time for jobs that the organizations there have open. I use my time at the career fair to ask specific questions about specific positions with the recruiters. I prepare a short dossier of the organizations there so I am prepared to ask them intelligent questions. 3. I am leveraging all of my networks- this means I am hanging out on industry blogs and twitter streams getting my name out there, I am meeting several times a week with people who work in the industry, I am staying present in industry events, and I am hanging out at industry happy hours. I’ve got a well organized rolodex of people I’ve met at job fairs, classes, talks, etc. so that when I apply for a job at an organization, I have someone with a personal contact in it to drop a line to. 4. I’ve done a ton of research on job progression, including informational interviews and reading tons of LinkedIn profiles to learn what the career paths of people in positions I aspire to have looked like. And all of this is on a carefully prepared ground of internships, targeted classes (I asked organizations at the beginning of my degree what classes they would value most in a candidate) and working my ass off taking all the responsibilities I can get on the job so I have a very nice resume. Any grad students needs to realize their job search starts on the first day of class, and they need to realize that they have to pull out all of the stops throughout their years in school to put themselves in the best position in terms of skills, networks, and work experience, to meet their job search with full force when it’s time. ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2012, 10:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-feel-like-i-am-the-victim-of-my-own-education/623095/60 "2012-05-29T22:44:43Z")
> [@Diamonds02](#): > > Get me a damn job. Any job, even a barista at Starbucks. > > Not even a job really. I know there’s tons of competition and the economy is bad, so I’m not expecting to get every job I apply for. I’m expecting for my education to open some doors for me. At least a freaking job interview. I’ve put in nearly 100 applications/resumes and only got four interviews since I graduated in 2009. > > I also expected my education to help me understand the world better. It seems that I wasn’t taught the important things, and the things I did learn now appears to be misinformation So join the military and learn something practical, and get paid while doing it. Use your education to leverage your new skills into a supervisory role. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-feel-like-i-am-the-victim-of-my-own-education/623095.md?page=2)