# I find it ironic (abortion and freedom) **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [July 19, 2003, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-find-it-ironic-abortion-and-freedom/189532 "2003-07-19T02:59:38Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 3\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![The\_Ryan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7feea3/32.png) [@The\_Ryan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Ryan)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2003, 8:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-find-it-ironic-abortion-and-freedom/189532/141 "2003-07-24T20:11:16Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Shodan \* > You claimed that those who opposed abortion would refer to themselves as “anti-choice”. More precisely, I claimed that I was sure that some would refer to themselves thusly, after you claimed that none would. Seeing as you brought up the issue, and made the stronger claim, it seems to me that the burden of proof lies on you. BTW, there **are** those that say that they are opposed to choice, even if they don’t use the exact term “anti-choice”. > [@](#): > > And people who want to keep abortion legal are against allowing fetuses to live. Therefore, “anti-life” is accurate. I am quite tired of your insistence on such an absurd position, despite repeated statements that it is false. That is a completely unfounded, unwarranted, and insulting charge, and I demand that you take it back. > [@](#): > > If being pro-choice means that you have to support any and all choices, including the choice to attack another, then calling someone pro-choice means that they must support the right to attack another person. I don’t see how that bears any resemblance to what I quoted. > [@](#): > > Just as obvious, and just as tenable, as referring to abortionists as “baby-killers”. Again, I demand that you take that back. People who are opposed to legal abortion are opposed to choice. People who are for it are not baby-killers, and your implying that they are is simply unconscionable. > [@](#): > > Precisely as **Bob Cos** stated - your entire position consists of repeatedly stating “but it’s OK for me to call you names, because I’m right and you’re wrong”. You know, repeating that over and over again doesn’t make it true. > [@](#): > > The whole point of labelling the other side as “anti-choice” is to avoid the question of “how do we know you are right?” No, it’s not. I have already explained what the point is. Why don’t you deal with the points I have brought up, rather than contiuning your ignorant statements? > [@](#): > > Fetuses are alive. Abortion involves their destruction. Therefore, all abortion supporters are anti-life. That is a complete non sequitor. Not all pro-choice advocates are abortion supportes, and even those that are aren’t anti-life. Promoting abortion is no more anti-life than promoting amputation is ant-leg. > [@](#): > > They don’t oppose all choice either, just the choice that involves the destruction of innocent life (by their lights). So you admit that they are against choice? ---
**Author:** ![Stratocaster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stratocaster/32/16393_2.png) [@Stratocaster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stratocaster)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2003, 11:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-find-it-ironic-abortion-and-freedom/189532/142 "2003-07-24T23:40:49Z")
Shodan, I strongly urge you to stop wasting any more time on this. I no longer will. The Ryan lacks the capacity and/or the inclination to engage in a meaningful debate, at least as far as this topic goes. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Ryan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7feea3/32.png) [@The\_Ryan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Ryan)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2003, 12:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-find-it-ironic-abortion-and-freedom/189532/143 "2003-07-25T00:38:23Z")
“The Ryan lacks the capacity and/or the inclination to engage in a meaningful debate, at least as far as this topic goes.” I’m not the one calling my opponents muderers. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-find-it-ironic-abortion-and-freedom/189532.md?page=7)