# I hated Zombieland **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [June 24, 2015, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hated-zombieland/723406 "2015-06-24T23:11:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2015, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hated-zombieland/723406/41 "2015-06-25T19:52:12Z")
> [@Disgruntled\_Penguin](#): > > When I think about Spider-Man I think of a nerdy kid who gets bitten by a radioactive spider. I grew up reading the comic book, so I think of Peter Parker, specifically the slightly more mature John Romita version. So I have a _very_ specific programmed view of Spiderman. Doesn’t mean a re-boot couldn’t work of course, but I’ll always have a little cognitive dissonance there. Heck _Tobey Maguire_ gave me a little cognitive dissonance :D. No big deal in the scheme of things. Now for the _opposite_ we have the Le Guin Earthsea debacle, where Le Guin’s very specifically dark-skinned protagonist was white-washed for TV. Might have been tolerable if the show was any good, but sadly… 😉 ---
**Author:** ![outlierrn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/outlierrn/32/3005_2.png) [@outlierrn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/outlierrn)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2015, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hated-zombieland/723406/42 "2015-06-25T20:06:19Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > Not particularly, no. This is a joke, right? You can’t possibly really believe Zombieland was meant as a straight ahead horror flick, can you? ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2015, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hated-zombieland/723406/43 "2015-06-25T20:15:44Z")
> [@outlierrn](#): > > This is a joke, right? You can’t possibly really believe Zombieland was meant as a straight ahead horror flick, can you? It kind of felt like it didn’t really know what genre it was supposed to be. It was a sendup in places and then it tried to be really serious in others, and it just didn’t gel well. ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2015, 8:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hated-zombieland/723406/44 "2015-06-25T20:21:44Z")
> [@outlierrn](#): > > This is a joke, right? You can’t possibly really believe Zombieland was meant as a straight ahead horror flick, can you? It’s a comedy but it’s not specifically a zombie parody. The zombies operate about the same as they do in most films with “fast mode” zombies versus shamblers. They’re zombies due to a stock “infection” style excuse. It doesn’t set out to lampoon the idea of zombies or talk about how silly zombie movies are. It’s just a zombie movie with comedy elements. Shaun of the Dead was much the same. Pegg said that he wasn’t trying to mock or riff off of zombie movies, he wanted to make a comedy with zombies in it that stood on its own. ---
**Author:** ![FuriousGeorge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ecae2f/32.png) [@FuriousGeorge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FuriousGeorge)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2015, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hated-zombieland/723406/45 "2015-06-25T20:25:16Z")
> [@Anaamika](#): > > It kind of felt like it didn’t really know what genre it was supposed to be. It was a sendup in places and then it tried to be really serious in others, and it just didn’t gel well. I’m confused how you can get a sense of what it was supposed to be if you fast forward through most of it. This also doesn’t help a movie “gel well” either. I liked the movie. I’m not an uber fan of it, but it worked well enough for me. ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2015, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hated-zombieland/723406/46 "2015-06-25T20:28:24Z")
> [@FuriousGeorge](#): > > I’m confused how you can get a sense of what it was supposed to be if you fast forward through most of it. This also doesn’t help a movie “gel well” either. > > I liked the movie. I’m not an uber fan of it, but it worked well enough for me. Not exactly: > [@me](#): > > From then on I fast forwarded just fast enough to be able to see the subtitles, so I still caught most of the movie, just on 2x fast. I never skipped any parts completely, and sometimes I still slowed it down to regular speed (mostly when Harrelson was doing his antics). I did in fact watch the whole movie, but I saw no reason to watch it on normal speed. ---
**Author:** ![Disgruntled\_Penguin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a8b319/32.png) [@Disgruntled\_Penguin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Disgruntled_Penguin)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2015, 8:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hated-zombieland/723406/47 "2015-06-25T20:31:41Z")
> [@TBG](#): > > [Because Stan Lee said so.](http://www.newsarama.com/24901-stan-lee-talks-big-screen-spider-man-depiction.html) No, the decision did not come from Stan Lee. He simply agreed with the decision. I can understand that from an artistic point of view. We’re discussing altering his artistic vision and this makes him uncomfortable. There’s nothing wrong with him feeling this way but it is supremely hypocritical to argue for the sanctity of the original character when they change backstories all the freaking time. Stan said “I don’t see any reason to change that”. Of course, he really doesn’t offer any compelling reason to not change that either. ---
**Author:** ![FuriousGeorge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ecae2f/32.png) [@FuriousGeorge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FuriousGeorge)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2015, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hated-zombieland/723406/48 "2015-06-25T20:32:03Z")
> [@Anaamika](#): > > Not exactly: Ok so you watched the movie “just fast enough to be able to see the subtitles”. Fair enough. My point stands. It seems you watched it for the Harrelson highlights. I’m not sure that’s giving it a fair shake. It seems you watched it like a teenager watches porn. Just fast enough to slow down at the shagging bits. Which, ya know, OK, fair enough. I’m, just, not sure that really allows you to get a sense for the direction or the gelling. ---
**Author:** ![Disgruntled\_Penguin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a8b319/32.png) [@Disgruntled\_Penguin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Disgruntled_Penguin)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2015, 8:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hated-zombieland/723406/49 "2015-06-25T20:36:11Z")
> [@Jophiel](#): > > Spider-Man doesn’t exist in a vacuum. Even setting aside the cinematic versions from the past 15 years or so, I assume most people think of him (assuming they do at all) based on decades of comics and newspaper comics depicting him as white. I understand that there’s some Revamped Ultimate Split Dimension What-If Alternate Universe Foil Edition version where he’s some other race but most people don’t know or care about that. > > Thinking about Peter Parker (or Bruce Wayne or Clark Kent) as white doesn’t indicate some sort of weird race obsession. I’m not saying it does; this is why I was asking. I don’t think of characters races when I’m reading or watching movies. I just don’t. I think it’s because I realize that to me, the real story is going on in my mind and since I don’t particularly think visually I don’t image the characters as any race unless it’s important to the story like American History X. ---
**Author:** ![Disgruntled\_Penguin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a8b319/32.png) [@Disgruntled\_Penguin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Disgruntled_Penguin)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2015, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hated-zombieland/723406/50 "2015-06-25T20:38:15Z")
> [@Anaamika](#): > > Spiderman, I believe, is contractually obligated to always be Caucasian. Or so I saw on the Internet, and we know we can always trust the Internet. > > But yes, you make my point for me. “Nerdy kid who gets bit by a radioactive spider” is all I think about too. > > But I really just answered to say how much I love! your username. I love penguins. Disgruntled ones are even better. Thanks. I’ve always been a fan of penguins but when I met a penguin who let me pet him I’ve really been a fan. Fantastic creatures in my mind. The disgruntled part, well, that’s just me. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2015, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hated-zombieland/723406/51 "2015-06-25T20:56:50Z")
> [@outlierrn](#): > > This is a joke, right? You can’t possibly really believe Zombieland was meant as a straight ahead horror flick, can you? No, I don’t think that. I said it wasn’t a parody. There’s a difference between a movie that doesn’t take itself too seriously, and a parody. Heck, there’s a difference between an outright comedy, and a parody. _Zombieland_ was sort of an action-comedy with a lot of gore, but very little of it was parodic, particularly when it came to the standard zombie movie tropes, which by and large, it played entirely straight. ---
**Author:** ![EllisDee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellisdee/32/4531_2.png) [@EllisDee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EllisDee)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2015, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hated-zombieland/723406/52 "2015-06-25T21:37:45Z")
> [@Anaamika](#): > > For all of you focusing solely on my complaint about the white characters, fair enough, but I did make five points in my OP! Frankly I think I have explained myself pretty well on the white/nonwhite angle, so I am not going to rehash it over and over again. It’s one of my complaints, not the sole one. Is it just the one that bothers people most? Personally I thought Woody Harrelson practically fellating Bill Murray was pretty annoying, too, especially since I like both actors pretty well. I thought all five of your reasons were silly, but I particularly didn’t like the direction you seem to be going with the racial criticism. But sure, I’ll give you my thoughts on all five: \>\>1. Only white people apparently can survive the zombie apocalypse! With a cast of six, and based on the geographic setting, this is a pretty reasonable casting choice. This objection reads like a knee-jerk political correctness. \>\>2. The girls exist literally to be a) conniving little bitches who steal from the main characters b) love interests (at least the elder) c) to be rescued by the guys. The two women in the movie are major characters with their own motivations (which they discuss with each other, among other non-boy topics they talk to each other about), virtually never talk to each other about the men in the movie, and demonstrate clear agency in determining their own fate. This complaint is a major reach. \>\>3. Bill Murry appears on screen just long enough for Woody Harrelson to go crazy over him and then to get shot while being an asshole. Which admittedly is probably true to form (and I like Bill Murray) Zombieland is a comedy. That was supposed to be funny. \>\>4. Jesse Eisenberg is the hero! Who would make this kid a hero? He’s terrible. I am sorry now he is going to be Lex Luthor but he just can’t act. He didn’t change his expression once during the movie. That guy with an oscar nomination for best actor? Yep, total hack. Not that oscar noms are the be-all-end-all measuring stick, but you lose credibility when you say he can’t act at all. \>\>5. Jesse gets the girl in the end! Who in their right mind would look at Woody Harrelson and Jesse Eisenberg and think…uh let me pick the guy that can barely face up to a clown to get to me as opposed to the guy who is mowing down tons of zombies. Maybe the better thread topic would have been “I hate Jesse Eisenberg” (which is a perfectly reasonable opinion to have) instead of trying to shoehorn in racism and sexism where it really doesn’t apply. No surprise that the racist angle is what people picked up on. (Not you being racist; your assertion that the movie is.) ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2015, 9:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hated-zombieland/723406/53 "2015-06-25T21:59:53Z")
> [@EllisDee](#): > > (Not you being racist; your assertion that the movie is.) That’s not an assertion that’s been made in this thread. ---
**Author:** ![EllisDee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellisdee/32/4531_2.png) [@EllisDee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EllisDee)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2015, 10:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hated-zombieland/723406/54 "2015-06-25T22:08:31Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > That’s not an assertion that’s been made in this thread. Maybe not, but that’s how “Only white people apparently can survive the zombie apocalypse!” reads. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2015, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hated-zombieland/723406/55 "2015-06-25T22:15:33Z")
> [@EllisDee](#): > > Maybe not, but that’s how “Only white people apparently can survive the zombie apocalypse!” reads. Can’t say I agree with you there. “I wish this movie were more diverse,” isn’t even remotely the same thing as “This movie is racist.” Also, while I’m here, “It’s totally reasonable that the only five people to survive the zombie apocalypse were white,” is not actually a rebuttal to, “I wish this movie were more diverse.” Yes, it’s realistic that such a small group could be so homogenous, but the complaint had nothing to do with realism. ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2015, 10:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hated-zombieland/723406/56 "2015-06-25T22:51:44Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > Also, while I’m here, “It’s totally reasonable that the only five people to survive the zombie apocalypse were white,” is not actually a rebuttal to, “I wish this movie were more diverse.” Yes, it’s realistic that such a small group could be so homogenous, but the complaint had nothing to do with realism. It is a reasonable rebuttal to “Only white people apparently can survive the zombie apocalypse!” which is what was actually said. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2015, 11:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hated-zombieland/723406/57 "2015-06-25T23:12:16Z")
> [@Jophiel](#): > > It is a reasonable rebuttal to “Only white people apparently can survive the zombie apocalypse!” which is what was actually said. I thought that was pretty clearly snark on the lack of diversity, but yeah, taken literally, that is a fair rebuttal. ---
**Author:** ![outlierrn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/outlierrn/32/3005_2.png) [@outlierrn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/outlierrn)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2015, 12:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hated-zombieland/723406/58 "2015-06-26T00:40:43Z")
> [@Jophiel](#): > > It’s a comedy but it’s not specifically a zombie parody. The zombies operate about the same as they do in most films with “fast mode” zombies versus shamblers. They’re zombies due to a stock “infection” style excuse. It doesn’t set out to lampoon the idea of zombies or talk about how silly zombie movies are. It’s just a zombie movie with comedy elements. > > Shaun of the Dead was much the same. Pegg said that he wasn’t trying to mock or riff off of zombie movies, he wanted to make a comedy with zombies in it that stood on its own. Fair to say, but it misses the point. They did something stupid isn’t suddenly a more valid complaint because of the distinction between comedy and parody,IMHO. ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2015, 1:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hated-zombieland/723406/59 "2015-06-26T01:30:27Z")
Oh, I don’t agree with **Miller** ’s assessment of the film as a whole. I just agree with him that it wasn’t parody, it was an action-comedy set in a zombie apocalypse. Bill Murray’s decision to scare Columbus was stupid but, in the context of the film, it worked fine for me. They came across Murray’s mansion, they all have this party montage sort of moment like everything is great in the world then – oops! – oh, that’s right we’re back to zombies and guns and danger. If it didn’t work for someone, cool, but I got what the film was trying to do there and it worked for me. As I said, Wichita and Little Rock’s initial plan was way stupider in my opinion (even as a contrivance to get them together it could have been better) but that doesn’t stop me from enjoying the movie. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2015, 2:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hated-zombieland/723406/60 "2015-06-26T02:28:19Z")
> [@outlierrn](#): > > Fair to say, but it misses the point. They did something stupid isn’t suddenly a more valid complaint because of the distinction between comedy and parody,IMHO. Are you suggesting that comedies, by their nature, are immune to the standard criticisms of plot and characterization that apply to other genres? Because that’s not an idea I can really get behind. Certainly, it’s true for some comedies - any one criticizing _Dumb and Dumber_ because the characters are morons is clearly missing the point. On the other hand, something like _Real Genius_ relies very much on presenting its characters as smart and competent, regardless of the amount of farce contained in the movie, and if the protagonists were regularly acting like morons, it would have damaged the overall film. Where _Zombieland_ failed for me was in the way it was unable to resolve the tension between the genres it was straddling. The scene where Bill Murray gets killed would have worked fine in a movie that did not expect us to care about the consequences of its plot. But the film also wanted us to be emotionally invested in the characters and their plight. We’re meant to care about Jesse Eisenberg’s obviously futile quest to find his parents, or be moved by Woody Harralson’s revelation about his son. And in general, it expects us to take the danger presented by the zombies as legitimate. I can’t do that when you have things like one of the protagonists taking a movie break in the middle of sweeping a house for zombies, or the jaded, street smart grifters getting stranded at the top of a Ferris wheel. These are characters that the script was plainly expecting us to take as smart, competent survivors, but couldn’t be bothered to actually write them as either. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hated-zombieland/723406.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hated-zombieland/723406.md?page=4)