# I have decided to Rob my own Gun Shop **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [July 21, 2017, 11:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-have-decided-to-rob-my-own-gun-shop/791792 "2017-07-21T11:43:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Larry\_Borgia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/larry_borgia/32/156_2.png) [@Larry\_Borgia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Borgia)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2017, 10:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-have-decided-to-rob-my-own-gun-shop/791792/41 "2017-07-23T22:48:09Z")
> [@Derleth](#): > > OK, you’re selling guns to criminals. Let’s do a step-by-step, shall we? > > [list=#] > [li]You have guns, they have money.[/li][li]You exchange guns for money.[/li][li]They have guns, you have money.[/li][/list] > > Now… when you’re a criminal, with guns, near someone who has money, your immediate impulse is… take your time… > > (I bet there are people who still won’t get to step 4, “They have guns _and_ money.” I don’t _try_ to be obscure, really, I don’t.) > > I know you’re not serious. Just struck me as funny. You bring your men to the meet. They have loaded guns, as do you. The guns you sell your customers are not loaded. Also, criminals might find knowing a guy who can sell them good weapons on a regular basis is better than the short term gain they would make if they robbed the guy. Illegal weapons sales happen all the time, as do sales of large quantities of drugs and other contraband. Criminals seem to have found a way to make these sales go smoothly, at least most of the time. ---
**Author:** ![ZurBob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/71e660/32.png) [@ZurBob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZurBob)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2017, 11:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-have-decided-to-rob-my-own-gun-shop/791792/42 "2017-07-23T23:19:03Z")
Ya know… If the OP’s question is inane based upon his/her subsequent correspondence, need anyone go any further? ---
**Author:** ![pkbites](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pkbites/32/204_2.png) [@pkbites](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pkbites)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2017, 11:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-have-decided-to-rob-my-own-gun-shop/791792/43 "2017-07-23T23:33:54Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > They don’t have to be all that involved, just give a bit of information on the usual police response time to the alarm, point out where the guns that are easiest to carry off are, and then lock up for the night. And, like Daffy Ducks trick, this will work a maximum of once. Like I said, guns stolen from a licensed dealer are going to involve the feds, possibly the media, and related circus acts. It would be an absolute tar baby. If I was going to channel guns to the black market one method would be to use a straw buyer with alternate ID. He buys multiple guns at cost, passes the background with his alternate ID, and then he distributes in another city, preferably another state. When crime guns are found and serial numbers are traced backwards, all that comes up is someone bought multiple guns over time. The dealer did all the paperwork, including a 3310.4. They don’t find the actual buyer as he didn’t really exist. The dealer may eventually face a bit of heat in this scheme, but nothing like he will faking/aiding burglaries. There are a couple of easier ways to get guns on the black market @ wholesale cost, but I’m not going to post them. Any dealer that’s doing any of this is rather short sighted. Overall it’s not that profitable of a proposition compared to the risk involved. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2017, 11:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-have-decided-to-rob-my-own-gun-shop/791792/44 "2017-07-23T23:46:13Z")
> [@ZurBob](#): > > Get your FFL, and you will understand pkbites reasoned perspective. Then again, perhaps you wouldn’t. > [@ZurBob](#): > > You\*\* assume\*\* too much. > Actually, I do know. > And you have been told by others, you simply won’t listen. > [@ZurBob](#): > > Ya know… If the OP’s question is inane based upon his/her subsequent correspondence, need anyone go any further? **Moderator Warning** **gogogophers** , these posts are out of line for GQ. This is an official warning for being a jerk. Do not do this again. Colibri General Questions Moderatro ---
**Author:** ![ZurBob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/71e660/32.png) [@ZurBob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZurBob)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2017, 12:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-have-decided-to-rob-my-own-gun-shop/791792/45 "2017-07-24T00:04:28Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > **Moderator Warning** > > **gogogophers** , these posts are out of line for GQ. This is an official warning for being a jerk. Do not do this again. > > Colibri > General Questions Moderatro Don’t understand, but if you say so…😕 ---
**Author:** ![pkbites](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pkbites/32/204_2.png) [@pkbites](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pkbites)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2017, 12:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-have-decided-to-rob-my-own-gun-shop/791792/46 "2017-07-24T00:26:02Z")
> [@ZurBob](#): > > Don’t understand:confused: Me either. For the most part people on these boards are not federally licensed gun dealers nor members of the black market. Yet they act like they know all about both and the conspiracy that exists between the two. I get the same attitude when a law enforcement question comes up. Been on the job (TWICE! Retired in '07 after 25 years and started a second career with another agency) for 35 years yet get blow back like I don’t know WTF I’m talking about. The knowitallism on these boards is ridiculous but strictly enforced by the Mods. ---
**Author:** ![ZurBob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/71e660/32.png) [@ZurBob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZurBob)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2017, 12:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-have-decided-to-rob-my-own-gun-shop/791792/47 "2017-07-24T00:33:05Z")
Please and thank you with sugar on top… No idea what I did wrong… Compared to others. ---
**Author:** ![ZurBob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/71e660/32.png) [@ZurBob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZurBob)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2017, 12:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-have-decided-to-rob-my-own-gun-shop/791792/48 "2017-07-24T00:51:59Z")
> [@pkbites](#): > > The knowitallism on these boards is ridiculous but strictly enforced by the Mods. I tend to be a leftist gun control advocate who knows the ropes… But when nitwit lefties bark nonsense, I bark back. I look forward to arguing with you in the future… If allowed here.🙂 ---
**Author:** ![ZurBob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/71e660/32.png) [@ZurBob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZurBob)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2017, 1:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-have-decided-to-rob-my-own-gun-shop/791792/49 "2017-07-24T01:34:54Z")
> [@Paul\_in\_Qatar](#): > > I have been reading about a lot of gun store burglaries. With no proof at all, I suspect some of these are cases where the shop owner cooperates with (or is himself) the burglar. Such guns would of course find there way into illegal channels. > So, OK I have a thousand dollars worth of guns. If I arrange to sell them illegally to a trafficker would I get more or less than their legitimate value? Less because I most likely only know one buyer, or more because illegal guns are worth more? > > Seeing the quality of guns taken off the streets in New York (the NYPD twitter feed), they seem to be of very low-quality. I cannot imagine many Bad Guys paying big bucks for a gun. So, you cannot “imagine” Bad Guys paying big bucks for a gun… So\*\* what\*\* of your imagination… Is your imagination actually relevant to reality here? ---
**Author:** ![Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ccd318/32.png) [@Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Paul_in_Qatar)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2017, 1:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-have-decided-to-rob-my-own-gun-shop/791792/50 "2017-07-24T01:41:11Z")
Gosh, this is disappointing. The mods can go ahead and close the thread as far as I am concerned. ---
**Author:** ![pkbites](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pkbites/32/204_2.png) [@pkbites](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pkbites)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2017, 1:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-have-decided-to-rob-my-own-gun-shop/791792/51 "2017-07-24T01:52:22Z")
> [@Paul\_in\_Qatar](#): > > Seeing the quality of guns taken off the streets in New York (the NYPD twitter feed), they seem to be of very low-quality. I cannot imagine many Bad Guys paying big bucks for a gun. The reason many of those guns are of low quality (Hi Point, Jennings, etc) is because many of them were stolen from other people in the hood. Poor people buy what they can afford. Nobody can throw rocks @ 1200 FPS so it’s better to have a junk gun than nothing. A Hi Point goes for about $150+ retail. A Criminal can easily come up with $500 or more for a stolen one on the street. people in the hood generally aren’t buying $1000 Sigs to protect their crib. So when their crib gets burglarized Sigs aren’t what’s ending up on the street. ---
**Author:** ![Isamu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/7c8e57/32.png) [@Isamu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Isamu)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2017, 1:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-have-decided-to-rob-my-own-gun-shop/791792/52 "2017-07-24T01:57:59Z")
> [@watchwolf49](#): > > The OP won’t get much money at all … he’s hired Rob to take all the risk and leave the OP with an alibi … Rob is going to realize most of the profit … Rob…are you Robbing me? ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2017, 3:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-have-decided-to-rob-my-own-gun-shop/791792/53 "2017-07-24T03:01:57Z")
> [@ZurBob](#): > > But when nitwit lefties bark nonsense, I bark back. You really shouldn’t continue to make insulting remarks after receiving a warning. > [@](#): > > I look forward to arguing with you in the future… If allowed here.🙂 Arguing is allowed. Just do it in a civil fashion without making personal remarks about the person you are arguing with. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2017, 1:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-have-decided-to-rob-my-own-gun-shop/791792/54 "2017-07-24T13:36:38Z")
I think we can all agree that it would be exceedingly foolish for a gun dealer to stage a robbery, since it’s likely to get severe consequences dropped on his head (much more severe than whatever he’s hoping to avoid with the robbery). But the fact that it would be extremely foolish doesn’t prove that it doesn’t happen. People do similarly-foolish things all the time. In fact, most crimes fall into this category. And yet, we do still have crime. ---
**Author:** ![md2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/73ab20/32.png) [@md2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md2000)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2017, 4:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-have-decided-to-rob-my-own-gun-shop/791792/55 "2017-07-24T16:10:18Z")
> [@pkbites](#): > > And, like Daffy Ducks trick, this will work a maximum of once. > > Like I said, guns stolen from a licensed dealer are going to involve the feds, possibly the media, and related circus acts. It would be an absolute tar baby. > > If I was going to channel guns to the black market one method would be to use a straw buyer with alternate ID. He buys multiple guns at cost, passes the background with his alternate ID, and then he distributes in another city, preferably another state. > When crime guns are found and serial numbers are traced backwards, all that comes up is someone bought multiple guns over time. The dealer did all the paperwork, including a 3310.4. They don’t find the actual buyer as he didn’t really exist. > > The dealer may eventually face a bit of heat in this scheme, but nothing like he will faking/aiding burglaries. > > There are a couple of easier ways to get guns on the black market @ wholesale cost, but I’m not going to post them. > > Any dealer that’s doing any of this is rather short sighted. Overall it’s not that profitable of a proposition compared to the risk involved. But… won’t it be obvious to the authorities when one gun after another traces back to a single shop where a string of fake ID’s were used to purchase them? Again, too many times sets off alarms. (What was the Ian Fleming quote: “once is an accident, twice is coincidence. Three times is enemy action.”) ---
**Author:** ![pkbites](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pkbites/32/204_2.png) [@pkbites](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pkbites)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2017, 9:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-have-decided-to-rob-my-own-gun-shop/791792/56 "2017-07-24T21:03:40Z")
> [@md2000](#): > > But… won’t it be obvious to the authorities when one gun after another traces back to a single shop where a string of fake ID’s were used to purchase them? Again, too many times sets off alarms. Possibly. But not in the way staging multiple burglaries would. And I did say it may generate heat. None of the things posted on this thread are going to make it easy on the dealer in the long run. There are 2 ways to get guns wholesale to black market that are much better than anything posted here. But I’m not posting them. There already seems to be a suspicion of FFL holders here. Which is odd as it is a heavily regulated business. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2017, 10:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-have-decided-to-rob-my-own-gun-shop/791792/57 "2017-07-24T22:38:48Z")
> [@md2000](#): > > (What was the Ian Fleming quote: “once is an accident, twice is coincidence. Three times is enemy action.”) Once was “happenstance.” (ref: _Goldfinger_) ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2017, 11:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-have-decided-to-rob-my-own-gun-shop/791792/58 "2017-07-24T23:07:42Z")
> [@thelurkinghorror](#): > > One “common” method is to wait until the store closes, then crash a (stolen) vehicle in the front and grab what you can and load it into a second vehicle. E.g. [earlier this year](http://kdvr.com/2017/04/09/guns-stolen-in-smash-and-grab-at-gun-store-in-arvada/). Some stores have concrete or metal bollards out front to limit this. > > I call BS on the “causing the ammunition to explode” part, unless it means that the cardboard boxes got wrecked. The physics don’t work that way. > > As for the OP, the reward/risk ratio is probably very low. You would have to contend with multiple law enforcement agencies. That doesn’t meant that it’s never happened, but the chances of it working are low. Some of the shady shops that get shut down do have unaccounted guns that could’ve been sold illegally, but without a declared theft. When I was in college they did this to the sporting goods store I worked at, drove a truck thru the metal gate in the wee hours. Loaded it up. The alarm, both signal and audible was going off. Within earshot there was a LAPD substation. The crooks left a bloody palm print, and maybe finger prints (I saw the palm print). The LAPD didnt get there for quite some time after they drove off. Multiple witness statements Id’ed the basic type and number of the (three) guys and the make and color of the truck. No guns were recovered & no one was arrested. CSI my ass. ---
**Author:** ![pkbites](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pkbites/32/204_2.png) [@pkbites](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pkbites)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2017, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-have-decided-to-rob-my-own-gun-shop/791792/59 "2017-07-25T00:07:16Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > CSI my ass. If none of those guys had prints on file (arrest records/military/professional licenses, etc) nothing would come up. Same with DNA from blood. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2017, 4:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-have-decided-to-rob-my-own-gun-shop/791792/60 "2017-07-25T04:36:41Z")
> [@pkbites](#): > > If none of those guys had prints on file (arrest records/military/professional licenses, etc) nothing would come up. Same with DNA from blood. Since they didnt bother with prints, it would be hard to check on that file, eh? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-have-decided-to-rob-my-own-gun-shop/791792.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-have-decided-to-rob-my-own-gun-shop/791792.md?page=4)