from Elvis Costello in the liner notes of the 2002 Rhino reissue regarding “Man out of Time”:
[QUOTE=Elvis Costello]
"Disgusted, disenchanted, and occasionally in love, “Man Out of Time” was the product of a troubling dialogue with myself that continued through my more regretful moments. I recall looking at my reflection in the frozen window of a Scandinavian tour bus without any idea who the hell I was supposed to be. I was trying to think or feel my way out of a defeated and exhausted frame of mind to something more glorious.
This was resolved in song, one shivering, hungover morning in the manicured gardens of a remote Scottish hotel. The house which we were staying had played a very minor part in one of Britain’s most notorious political scandals, apparently serving briefly as a bolt-hole for one of the disgraced protagonists. I actually delighted at the thought of this sordid history; it suited my mood. I can’t say that the words and ideas that emerged from these experiences were exactly welcome news to some of the band members. Like I could give a damn."
[/QUOTE]
It’s the last two sentences that kind of sum up the EC experience for me. There’s a pomposity, an air, a hipster douche hautiness about him that is inescapable. That’s what turns me off from him as a person.
As a songwriter, he is good, in fact, covers of his songs, like Naked Eyes version of “Man Out of Time” is much better than EC’s. Why? Well that leads me to my third point.
His voice. Yes it’s nasally but the fact that he likes to slide up to notes often is as irritating as Tori Amos’ breathing. It’s fine until you notice it, then that’s all you notice.
The thing is I should like Elvis Costello. He has all the ingredients of the music I generally like. In fact, one of my favorite artists, John Wesley Harding (now going by his real name: Wesley Stace) has been compared favorably to him a lot. So much so that I sought out all of EC’s music after hearing “Veronica” on MTV’s 120 Minutes too. Maybe it was the fact that JWH is, imo, a better singer. Or that his lyrics, while serious, didn’t take themselves so seriously. But I just can’t get into EC at all.
I this the history of my opinion in the OP makes it clear that this isn’t the case. To review: I like the song Alison, didn’t know much about his music overall, felt I needed to fill in that gap, and have been displeased with what I’ve found. If anything, I visited the EC library with a mildly positive opinion.
I’ve made points that other people have agreed with and/or augmented, so I seem to be saying something that makes sense.
I think the ways in which EC succeeds and fails (to me) is a lot more interesting than just an artist that “teh suxx.” That’s why I started this thread, to see what other people think. There are a lot of artists that “teh suxx” who aren’t interestingly sucky. To take the example of Sting again, I think his solo work is just garbage and I don’t think a lot of rock critics really dig his stuff, and I don’t think he has a strong fan base of intelligent listeners. Back in the 80s when his private effluent was first forced upon us, it seemed like only youngish chicks dug it. I like a lot of his work with the Police, but Sting really is “teh suxx” in my book. Not an interesting failure, just a failure (IMHO).
I do not think Costello is some talentless dumbass. I think he’s a smart guy, an able musician, and clearly very driven and prolific. I think he put a lot of energy and thought into his songs. In my view, he fails in the area of taste and performance. And I also don’t think he wrote a lot of great songs that could be covered better by others. To me, the music is pretty flat.
I don’t think Sting is a talentless dumbass, either. In the Police, he was a very good bass player, singer, and songwriter. But I think once he started his solo career, he went completely off the rails. There are a lot of artists who are good at once point in their career but eventually are not good. Heck, that’s the vast majority. That to me is why Sting is not an interesting failure as a solo performer. EC, in my view, had the same problems from the beginning.
I disagree with your post above, but at least you make a decent argument. Up to that point, you’ve had “whatEVerrrr” which wasn’t really working for you…
I was in high school and college when his first albums came out, and have always liked him, especially his earlier work. His distinctive voice, grim lyrics, interesting melodies, and arrangements work for me.
I still get regular cravings for “Lip Service,” with its jangly bits and organ.
ETA: OK, so your signature refers to one of Elvis Costello’s albums. Yes, it is too subtle for me. Apologies. I still don’t get what you’re going for though. Cheers!
A poster formerly named after an Elvis Costello reference would definitely have heard of him. So the juxtaposition of saying “never heard of him” with the signature was meant to be humorous. And was, IMO.
I’ve known Frank as a poster since I started here and had no idea he had a previous name, and even if I did I think I might have assumed he was just joking about the name. And so, yeah, way too subtle for me.
Aeschines, I tried to think of any other band or musician that irks me so, and the only other one that comes close is the Eurythmics. No other bands or musicians actively repulse me. How do you feel about the Eurythmics?
I’m really enjoying this discussion for my own reasons. For one thing, the OP’s explanation of what he finds off-putting in Elvis Costello’s lyrics gives me insight into what certain people dislike about me - Costello’s lyric samples from this thread are right along my sense of humor, I love hearing - and making - that kind of wordplay. I had never realized it would be perceived by some as a kind of pretentiousness. I project that he well may have the same motive as I do - he likes that sort of wit and wants to share it with others with the idea they will share his enjoyment of it.
Also, the side discussion about Sting. I was one of the youngish chicks mentioned here - “To take the example of Sting again, I think his solo work is just garbage and I don’t think a lot of rock critics really dig his stuff, and I don’t think he has a strong fan base of intelligent listeners. Back in the 80s when his private effluent was first forced upon us, it seemed like only youngish chicks dug it.” Yeah, I was youngish in the 80s and liked Sting (well, I liked Synchronicity and Dream of the Blue Turtles, to the point where I still remember all the songs on both). I’m intelligent, but dunno if I’m an “intelligent listener” as I am not up on any music scene; I decided to like Synchronicity because I read a review of it that made it sound good, and the lyrics were my kind of witty. And the Blue Turtle one because it was the next one. Many of the songs on both were literary - with elements of the exact kind of literature I liked, fairy tales, science fiction, etc. I am not even sure why “I will turn your face to alabaster, when you see the servant is the master” is pretentious - because it uses “alabaster” to mean pale? It rhymes, right? Sometimes you have to use a synonym to make the lyric rhyme, that’s pretentious? That song reminded me of the story of Merlin and Nimue, wasn’t my favorite but I enjoyed it.
Anyway, the literary references in the songs were what made me like them. I don’t think I’m exaggerating to say fiction was my life when I was young - I read all the time, and interpreted everything that happened to me through the medium of fiction; every current event, piece of gossip, and experience reminded me of some story or book I’d read. Only music that made some of those connections was music I felt a connection to. I appreciated Sting’s music for this reason. I think it’s a common experience for teenagers to fall in love with music that, for whatever individual reason, speaks to them, makes them feel understood by the singer and that’s how I felt with that particular music. And maybe when - back in the late 80s - people told me I sounded stuck up - they had the same reason this thread’s OP did.
Armed Forces is simultaneously one of the poppiest and most wordplayingest albums. It also has the amazing Senior Service which manages to be both about smoking and inside politics (perhaps of the navy) which I got even before I knew that Senior Service was both a brand of cigarettes and another name for the RN. But the best wordplay on that album IMO is Two Little Hitlers with a triple entendre She’s my soft touch typewriter / And I’m the great dictator, which, even if the song wasn’t called Two Little Hitlers, would still manage to be wordplay just on the strength of the word “dictator” alone.
Pretty much, yep. You can force a rhyme, but man, when I hear that it just clanks.
I can’t help but picture him orating when he says it. God, what a douche.
This is a guy who can write great lyrics - “I guess you’d call it suicide, but I’m too full to swallow my pride” and many others, but when he’s Mr King of Pain, I just :rolleyes:
