# I hope you got taken to jail . . . **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 20, 2002, 1:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hope-you-got-taken-to-jail/133095 "2002-10-20T13:25:45Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Myrr21](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Myrr21](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Myrr21)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2002, 12:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hope-you-got-taken-to-jail/133095/41 "2002-10-22T00:20:45Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by g8rguy \* > More importantly, your rectocranial inversion might prove hazardous to **my** health You’re right. There is a minute chance that a flying toddler could smash through your windshield and kill you. Somehow I doubt it, though. **Jester:** > [@](#): > > First off, it’s possible to still read plates and follow at a safe distance. Minimum safe following distance is 2 seconds (pretty much the standard, in the US at least…if not actually practiced). At 90mph = 1.5 miles per minute = .05 miles/ 2 seconds = 264 feet minimum safe following distance. That’s a mightly long way to read three inch letters and still keep an eye on the road… Nothing in life is safe. Some things are pretty dangerous. Some things are pretty stupid and life-threatening. Letting a kid have some (_gasp_) kinda dangerous fun shouldn’t invite a call to the cops. ---
**Author:** ![happyheathen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b5e925/32.png) [@happyheathen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/happyheathen)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2002, 12:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hope-you-got-taken-to-jail/133095/42 "2002-10-22T00:23:48Z")
Let’s see… > [@](#): > > I know it was ninety because that’s how fast WE had to go to stay behind you while I read your tag… Driving 90 mph, close enough to read a plate - does that sound safe? And how, exactly, am I now endangering you? And, if you cannot foresee road hazards, well… you stay on that side of the Rockies, too, 'K? dipshit. be useful for something. lizard food seems a good use for your demonstrated intellectual capacity - go play with a ‘gator - say about 20’ worth. ---
**Author:** ![happyheathen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b5e925/32.png) [@happyheathen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/happyheathen)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2002, 12:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hope-you-got-taken-to-jail/133095/43 "2002-10-22T00:28:47Z")
and, for those playing at home: Find the logic error: > [@](#): > > Clearly the _hypothetical_ situation in which the car is in good condition, the roads straight and level, there’s no traffic in sight, and the kids are old enough to know how to perform the trick _fails even to apply here_, given that there was, in fact, traffic in sight… Extra points for grammar. ---
**Author:** ![Jester](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jester/32/8223_2.png) [@Jester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jester)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2002, 2:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hope-you-got-taken-to-jail/133095/44 "2002-10-22T02:18:24Z")
Alright, heathen. Fine. If you drive responsibly and are able to account for any and all roadside hazards ever, then bully for you. I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt. Now answer me this. How is someone going 90 mph on a road with traffic on it _not_ a hazard? And I’ll ask again: what happens when one of the unrestrained kids decides to put his/her hands over mommy’s eyes? ---
**Author:** ![Jester](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jester/32/8223_2.png) [@Jester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jester)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2002, 2:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hope-you-got-taken-to-jail/133095/45 "2002-10-22T02:23:52Z")
Sorry, **Myrr21** , I somehow managed to miss your post above. Good point about the following distance. Just to play devil’s advocate, though, what if it was a four-lane interstate and Nightingale was “following” in the next lane over? Also, the tailgating doesn’t change the fact that it was really freakin’ dangerous to begin with. This isn’t “slightly dangerous fun.” This is “incredibly stupid and irresponsible and potentially hazardous to everybody else on the road fun.” ---
**Author:** ![sx633](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/22d042/32.png) [@sx633](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sx633)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2002, 3:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hope-you-got-taken-to-jail/133095/46 "2002-10-22T03:12:50Z")
Here is a timely article from today’s (Oct. 21) MSNBC, dateline Cheboygan, Michigan. “Teen injured After Fall From Car” Hmmm. Let’s see. Driveway. Friend Driving. Hospitalized. Serious Condition. Felonious Driving. More charges possible. Hey, what could have gone wrong? All they were doing was having the time of their lives! And it was certainly in a well-controlled enviironment – the driveway. Heck, no other traffic, slow speed. Where do sign up? > **[MSNBC News - Breaking News and News Today | Latest News](https://www.msnbc.com/)** > > MSNBC breaking news and the latest news for today. Get daily news from local news reporters and world news updates with live audio & video from our team. FWIW–I know it has been rebutted well a couple times, but to emphasis the point – the issue of tailgating was raised by the “children are chattel” crowd despite there being no evidence to support it. Clearly anyone who has ever driven knows that you get the best view of bumper stickers, license plates, etc. by driving in the adjoining lane. Sheesh, are you people braindead about everything? ---
**Author:** ![iampunha](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/74df32/32.png) [@iampunha](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iampunha)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2002, 3:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hope-you-got-taken-to-jail/133095/47 "2002-10-22T03:42:21Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Jester \* > And I’ll ask again: what happens when one of the unrestrained kids decides to put his/her hands over mommy’s eyes? You must have missed that memo, **Jester**. **hh** doesn’t normally address any arguments that he knows he’s already lost. Waste of time, really. But if he thinks he’s right (even if, for the most part, he’s its exact opposite), he’ll keep on going until he’s shown his normal colors. And FTR, a vehicle would not need to be much closer than 50 feet or so for me to be able to read the license plate in daylight under even decent conditions (no rain, etc). And unless the Mercedes’ brake lights are out, it’s not like the car can go 90-0 with no warning whatsoever. ---
**Author:** ![happyheathen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b5e925/32.png) [@happyheathen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/happyheathen)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2002, 4:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hope-you-got-taken-to-jail/133095/48 "2002-10-22T04:19:24Z")
Wow! a whole 50’ at 90 mph! Let’s see: 90 mph = 475200 ft/hr =\> 7920 ft/min =\> 132 ft/sec (fps) which means you will cover that 50’ in approx. .38 seconds - about as long as it takes to wink your eye. and you presume to lecture anyone about highway safety? brilliant! fucking brilliant! and, since you couldn’t figure that one out: I don’t respond to moron Q’s such as “And I’ll ask again: what happens when one of the unrestrained kids decides to put his/her hands over mommy’s eyes?” a) the question is irrelevant - what if the kid decides to jump out a window? what if driver falls asleep? what if… pointless excercise. b) anyone asking such a Q should be allowed to slink off and sober up (or learn limit him/herself to relevant points). moron[sub]1[/sub], meet moron[sub]2[/sub] p.s. - it takes about .5 seconds for the eyes to see a brake light and relay the “hit the brakes” signal to the feet - and that is best case - your .38 cushion would cause you to rear-end the MBZ (and probably kill the little darlings about whom you are so concerned) p.p.s - as point of argument, I will specify that 90 mph is probably irresponsible (even though I have hit 130 mph - I-80 in Utah runs over the salt lake - 4 lanes of clear, flat, straight, smooth concrete - no traffic for 2 miles in front of me - never got within 1000’ of anybody) YMMV. (and, once, while doing some mountain driving (fun!) at night, over the posted limit, I encountered a doe standing over her dead fawn - in my lane. I didn’t even come close -YMM definately V.) p.p.p.s. (if that is possible) - if you are in an adjacent lane: a) if the plate is at all recessed, you will have a tough time reading it. b) if we are to throw out irrelevant “what if’s”: if the driver is so reckless to allow the kids to move about in a moving vehicle (_horrors_), why would you assume that he/she would not swerve/change lanes irresponsibly? ---
**Author:** ![Jester](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jester/32/8223_2.png) [@Jester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jester)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2002, 4:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hope-you-got-taken-to-jail/133095/49 "2002-10-22T04:39:16Z")
> [@](#): > > a) the question is irrelevant - what if the kid decides to jump out a window? what if driver falls asleep? what if… What the Hell do you mean it’s not relevant? Guess what: if the kid is strapped in, like they should be, then they’re not going to jump out of the window. If the driver falls asleep and crashes, the kid has a much better chance of surviving if he/she is strapped in. That’s _why you strap your kid down, instead of letting them roam around the car!_ Thank you for helping me prove my point. ---
**Author:** ![Troy\_McClure\_SF](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/troy_mcclure_sf/32/4150_2.png) [@Troy\_McClure\_SF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Troy_McClure_SF)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2002, 5:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hope-you-got-taken-to-jail/133095/50 "2002-10-22T05:41:53Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by happyheathen \* > Yes, when driving, I can anticipate the near future. Wow, Jedi do exist! > [@](#): > > AND, _GASP_ allow for the possibility of the unexpected. If you cannot, please get off the damned road - you are a wreck-in-waiting. All I can say is wow. And not the good wow. ---
**Author:** ![happyheathen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b5e925/32.png) [@happyheathen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/happyheathen)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2002, 5:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hope-you-got-taken-to-jail/133095/51 "2002-10-22T05:51:11Z")
I’m crushed by both your wit and logic! ---
**Author:** ![Jester](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jester/32/8223_2.png) [@Jester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jester)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2002, 5:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hope-you-got-taken-to-jail/133095/52 "2002-10-22T05:52:53Z")
So does that mean that you admit you’re wrong? Geez. It’s about damn time. Now let’s all go get some bagels. ---
**Author:** ![happyheathen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b5e925/32.png) [@happyheathen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/happyheathen)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2002, 6:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hope-you-got-taken-to-jail/133095/53 "2002-10-22T06:34:01Z")
OK! moron[sub]1[/sub] has checked in… ---
**Author:** ![Jester](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jester/32/8223_2.png) [@Jester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jester)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2002, 6:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hope-you-got-taken-to-jail/133095/54 "2002-10-22T06:38:24Z")
Alright, fine. No bagels for you. Now, care to actually debate the issue? Your posts seem to have gradually degenerated. First, the dubbing of “moron” was just a quick little quip in an actual attempt at discussion. Now, it would seem, it comprises the entirety of your posts. Whatsamatter? Run out of points to avoid? [sub]And does anybody else get the mental image of Thing 1 and Thing 2 from the _Cat in the Hat_ books? Those guys were awesome.[/sub] ---
**Author:** ![lezlers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/258eb7/32.png) [@lezlers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lezlers)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2002, 6:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hope-you-got-taken-to-jail/133095/55 "2002-10-22T06:44:20Z")
Heathen, I think Jester’s trying to say that the point here is REDUCING the risk of something going very, very wrong (such as a child jumping out of the window, or playing hide and seek), not INCREASING it. Hence, why there are LAWS about toddler’s having to be in car seats and the like. Lord, I hope you don’t have children. ---
**Author:** ![iampunha](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/74df32/32.png) [@iampunha](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iampunha)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2002, 6:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hope-you-got-taken-to-jail/133095/56 "2002-10-22T06:47:26Z")
**happyheathen** , did you eat a lot of paint chips as a child? > [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by happyheathen \* > which means you will cover that 50’ in approx. .38 seconds - about as long as it takes to wink your eye. > > and you presume to lecture anyone about highway safety? Well, first of all, I’m not driving 90 mph with two unrestrained children, nor do I normally (read: much of any time) drive that fast at all. Second, yeah, I do presume to lecture someone who does what the subject of the OP did. Don’t fucking do it. It’s dangerous. That the OP had to go 90 mph just to be able to read the license plate of the person in question shouldn’t be coming back to bite her in the ass in the first place; it’s, sadly, yet another thing the driver in the OP was doing wrong and unfortunate that the OP had to drive that fast to be able to read the license plate to call the driver in. > [@](#): > > I don’t respond to moron Q’s such as “And I’ll ask again: what happens when one of the unrestrained kids decides to put his/her hands over mommy’s eyes?” > > a) the question is irrelevant - what if the kid decides to jump out a window? what if driver falls asleep? what if… Are you really that fucking stupid? You can strap a child down such that the child is virtually immobile. You can try to get as much sleep as possible before a roadtrip of any length or sort. You cannot just _assume_ that a completely unrestrained child is going to behave calmly (especially as the child in the OP was certainly _not_ doing so) in a moving vehicle. Or any vehicle. Kids, unless they are physically prevented from doing so (say, by a child safety seat, a seat belt, or something similar), are generally going to move about. It’s not at all out of the ordinary or “irrelevant” to ask what happens if an unrestrained child decides to play “peek-a-boo” with mommy. > [@](#): > > b) anyone asking such a Q should be allowed to slink off and sober up (or learn limit him/herself to relevant points). :rolleyes: Given a choice between debating flaming shit and debating you, I’ll debate the shit. At least the shit can flame, if nothing else. > [@](#): > > moron[sub]1[/sub], meet moron[sub]2[/sub] Damnit … one of you is bad enough. Whatever spawned you spawned another one? Damn gene pool ought to have an entrance examination. > [@](#): > > p.s. - it takes about .5 seconds for the eyes to see a brake light and relay the “hit the brakes” signal to the feet - and that is best case - your .38 cushion would cause you to rear-end the MBZ (and probably kill the little darlings about whom you are so concerned) That would be assuming that the Mercedes was flooring the brake, in which case it’s entirely possible that I _would_ rear-end the vehicle. And I probably wouldn’t have been so close (trying to read the plates so I could call the faulty, dangerous driver in) if not for the behavior of the driver in question. Otherwise, a simple tap on the brake is not going to be that much of a problem. And if I feel 50 feet is too close, I can always get in another lane, or get in front of the vehicle and have a passenger read the plate. Oh, and a cite for that whole half-second thing would be just gee-golly splenderful. > [@](#): > > b) if we are to throw out irrelevant “what if’s”: if the driver is so reckless to allow the kids to move about in a moving vehicle (_horrors_), why would you assume that he/she would not swerve/change lanes irresponsibly? Damn fucking straight, horrors, you worthless excuse for … whatever the fuck you are. I’ve met balls sharper than you. Does your 2-volt brain not have the ability to grasp that a moving, uncontrollable, bouncy object in car moving at _any_ speed is dangerous? Especially at 90 fucking miles an hour? I wouldn’t want a fucking professional stunt driver in a car moving 90 miles an hour if there were unrestrained children in said car. It’s simply _not safe_. ---
**Author:** ![Jester](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jester/32/8223_2.png) [@Jester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jester)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2002, 6:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hope-you-got-taken-to-jail/133095/57 "2002-10-22T06:47:40Z")
Excellent summary, **lezlers**. _You_, my friend, get a bagel. Oh, and in anticipation of heathen’s rebuttal, I stitched you a shirt with “moron[sub]3[/sub]” on it. Never hurst to be prepared. Welcome to the club! ---
**Author:** ![happyheathen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b5e925/32.png) [@happyheathen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/happyheathen)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2002, 7:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hope-you-got-taken-to-jail/133095/58 "2002-10-22T07:39:24Z")
Yup - nail them damned kids down - let 'em loose in a car and they’ll blind you every time. unless, of course, the little bastards are distracted by the moron[sub]x[/sub] tailgateing them so they can report 'em to the Po-leece. Yup. yet another **NEWSFLASH** : - millions of kids were raised (more or less successfully) even though they were allowed to ride in a car _GASP_ _ **UNRESTRAINED!** _ Do y’all really feel so unqualified at _living_ that you need laws to tell you how to transport kids? (ftr: I think safety seats are wonderful - I also believe kids can survive car trips without them) Now, about those idiots holding their kids in their laps on airplanes travelling 500+ mph… no takers on that one? then shut up about free-range kids in cars those who tailgate 50’ at 90mph get to lecture on highway safety. Suuurreee… and the precious > [@](#): > > …Kids, unless they are physically prevented from doing so (say, by a child safety seat, a seat belt, or something similar), are generally going to move about. It’s not at all out of the ordinary or “irrelevant” to ask what happens if an unrestrained child decides to play “peek-a-boo” with mommy. You know, for the 1000’s of miles we 4 kids rode in that pre-belt Olds, we never played “peek-a-boo” with the driver. Amazing, huh? It’s like kids somehow have some sense. But that can’t be right - ya gotta immobilize them or they’ll wreck the car (either that, or hijack it and drive it into their preschool for revenge - al-kidda?). **lezlers** - welcome to the party! the Q;s here are: a) probability of kids coming to harm by playing in the sunroof (or somehow sabotaging the vehicle - morons[sub]1 & 2[/sub] have not yet suggested the kids could jump on the pedals, grab the shifter, slice the driver’s throat) b) whether the risk of a) was sufficient cause of the OPer’s outrage. c) whether the OPer, in his/her rage, placed the kids in greater danger by tailgateing them at 90 mph, close enough to read the plate. note: the “I could have viewed the plate from another lane” is both: 1. irrelevant - that is not what the OPer did 2. as stated earlier, would have been more difficult or impossible due to the geometry of the location of the plate. a general Q for you superior drivers: When in heavy traffic, how far ahead do you look? No. 1 answer at traffic schools: “the car in front of me” Explains the chain-reaction pile-ups, don’t it? ---
**Author:** ![MsWhatsit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/eb8c5e/32.png) [@MsWhatsit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MsWhatsit)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2002, 8:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hope-you-got-taken-to-jail/133095/59 "2002-10-22T08:18:24Z")
This just proves my theory that no matter what jackassed, moronic, and absolutely indefensible behavior you can think of, somebody will invariably come along to defend it anyway. Incidentally, the plural of “anecdote” is not “data”; I hope this is not too subtle a comment for happyheathen to noodle out, but if so, I’m sure someone can explain it. ---
**Author:** ![Catamount](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/catamount/32/2840_2.png) [@Catamount](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Catamount)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2002, 12:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hope-you-got-taken-to-jail/133095/60 "2002-10-22T12:21:54Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Jester \* > \*\*-Magnus, Lord of the Underworld, could suddenly burst out of the pavement in front of you in his horrific, fiery glory, finally free to continue his eternal quest for fresh new souls. > \*\* **Jester** , I would like to congratulate you for living up to your name. You made a very cranky Spaz laugh today. Thank you. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hope-you-got-taken-to-jail/133095.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hope-you-got-taken-to-jail/133095.md?page=4)