# I hurt anyone who fails to help anyone who helps me (Schelling wins Economics Nobel) **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [October 10, 2005, 1:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hurt-anyone-who-fails-to-help-anyone-who-helps-me-schelling-wins-economics-nobel/325551 "2005-10-10T13:42:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 6\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![hawthorne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/c89c15/32.png) [@hawthorne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hawthorne)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2005, 1:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hurt-anyone-who-fails-to-help-anyone-who-helps-me-schelling-wins-economics-nobel/325551/1 "2005-10-10T13:42:47Z")
They’re rattling through my favourite people in economics. In recent years, there’s been Kahneman, Smith, Akerlof, Sen. I thought Tom Schelling had surely missed out what with the cavalcade of game theorists who’s won. And he’s getting on. But he’s joint winner this year (with Robert Aumann). Cool. His stuff is easy to read but deep. Here’s the end to a short article of his in the top journal in economics “Altruism, Meanness and Other Potentially Strategic Behaviors” _American Economic Review_. It’s such a cool article. No regressions, no equations, no data. > [@](#): > > Here is that small sample of strategic declarations: […] > > I am harmless and couldn’t hurt you if I wanted to. > I’ll attack anyone who comes near me. > I’ll expose us both if you don’t do what I ask. > If a predator spots us it will prefer me to you. > I can’t run because I’m vulnerable with my back to you. > I’ll destroy my property if you approach it. > I will not fight for my property, so you don’t have to kill me to get it. > If I do what you ask I’ll be punished. > I hurt anyone who fails to help anyone who helps me. > I do not taste good. > You do not taste good. Interesting, and just a bit creepy. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2005, 2:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hurt-anyone-who-fails-to-help-anyone-who-helps-me-schelling-wins-economics-nobel/325551/2 "2005-10-10T14:04:09Z")
I think I get some of it but can you put it into context? Is he saying that these are the behaviours exhibited by humans today? In the past? Under what circumstances and how do they manifest themselves? It’s interesting but without context, I’m finding it hard to wrap my head around what he is trying to say. ---
**Author:** ![Inigo\_Montoya](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inigo_montoya/32/124_2.png) [@Inigo\_Montoya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inigo_Montoya)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2005, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hurt-anyone-who-fails-to-help-anyone-who-helps-me-schelling-wins-economics-nobel/325551/3 "2005-10-10T14:30:49Z")
It reads a little like a Gollum/Smeagol debate. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2005, 2:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hurt-anyone-who-fails-to-help-anyone-who-helps-me-schelling-wins-economics-nobel/325551/4 "2005-10-10T14:42:48Z")
> [@Inigo Montoya](#): > > It reads a little like a Gollum/Smeagol debate. \… 😃 ---
**Author:** ![hawthorne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/c89c15/32.png) [@hawthorne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hawthorne)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2005, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hurt-anyone-who-fails-to-help-anyone-who-helps-me-schelling-wins-economics-nobel/325551/5 "2005-10-10T16:01:32Z")
> [@Inigo Montoya](#): > > It reads a little like a Gollum/Smeagol debate. Yes, indeed. Some of Schelling’s work is on the question of self command (how should I act if I don’t trust myself?) As for what this stuff’s all about, try the official Nobel screed ([.pdf](http://nobelprize.org/economics/laureates/2005/ecoadv05.pdf)) As it turns out, the article I mention isn’t cited in the bibliography there. (Most of the talk is about _The Strategy of Conflict_. This is a little book that anyone with a high school education could read and think about.) Obviously I can’t quote the whole thing, but here’s a little more context : > [@](#): > > A behavior propensity is strategic if it influences others by influencing their expectations. Strategic behavior is ubiquitous in human society and often takes forms that have a paradoxical quality - eliminating options, impairing capabilities […] and other apparently nonself-serving behaviors that are advantageous only in their _anticipation_ by others. > > […] > > Unable to explain to a bee that its stinging would merely hurt me but would kill it, I have behaved with great respect towards bees. > > […] > > Meanness and altruism are not only alike, except for sign, but often indistinguishable. Punishing a wrongdoer can be a “public good” motivated as well by meanness as public spirit. It is even a favor to the victim if it serves as warning or instill as discipline amongst “victims”. > > […] > > [L]et me clarify my motivation. My interest is not in the possible genetic heritability of any human traits we might identify as stratically self-serving. It is the opposite, to see whether the richness of observable strategic behavior in people can provide hints to the biologists who study other creatures. ---
**Author:** ![Inigo\_Montoya](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inigo_montoya/32/124_2.png) [@Inigo\_Montoya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inigo_Montoya)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2005, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-hurt-anyone-who-fails-to-help-anyone-who-helps-me-schelling-wins-economics-nobel/325551/6 "2005-10-10T16:15:44Z")
> [@hawthorne](#): > > His stuff is easy to read but deep. > [@Schelling](#): > > A behavior propensity is strategic if it influences others by influencing their expectations. Strategic behavior is ubiquitous in human society and often takes forms that have a paradoxical quality - eliminating options, impairing capabilities […] and other apparently nonself-serving behaviors that are advantageous only in their anticipation by others. No. t.s. elliott is an easy read. This took me 5 passes and I’m only _beginning_ to get what he’s saying and I think I’m a pretty bright kid. That someone could write about this, let alone get comfortable enough with it mentally to make the idea dance well enough for a Nobel Prize is one thing. But for other people to read it and go “Aha!” as opposed to “WITCH!” makes me feel barely worth of reading the cover of a Mad Magazine.