# I joined, and pledged support to Yes California today. **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [November 11, 2016, 4:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-joined-and-pledged-support-to-yes-california-today/771467 "2016-11-11T04:44:31Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 49
**Author:** ![levdrakon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@levdrakon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/levdrakon)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2017, 2:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-joined-and-pledged-support-to-yes-california-today/771467/961 "2017-01-28T02:04:03Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > So your view is that USA gets no compensation for the 45% of California that it owns? Not a very compelling reason for the rest of us to grant California their independence … I don’t think there are really any good compelling reasons for the US to let CA go. California is arguably the most important state in the union, except for presidential elections. I wouldn’t say the US gets no compensation. But I did just run across [this article](https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2017/jan/19/bureau-land-management-federal-lease): Congress moves to give away national lands, discounting billions in revenue > [@](#): > > Republicans have overwritten the value of federal lands, easing the path to disposing of federal property even if doing so loses money for the government and provides no demonstrable compensation to American citizens. > … > Essentially, the revised budget rules deny that federal land has any value at all, allowing the new Congress to sidestep requirements that a bill giving away a piece of federal land does not decrease federal revenue or contribute to the federal debt. > > Republican eagerness to cede federal land to local governments for possible sale, mining or development is already moving states to act. Western states, where most federal land is concentrated, are already introducing legislation that pave the way for land transfers. Hey, if they’re giving it away… 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2017, 2:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-joined-and-pledged-support-to-yes-california-today/771467/962 "2017-01-28T02:17:22Z")
> [@levdrakon](#): > > I see. I read the last page before posting to make sure I wasn’t missing something. If California seceded, federal lands would revert to California and technically, Marines would be trespassing except in reality there would be agreements made before California took control. Nothing was said about kicking anyone out. If both parties think certain bases are important, California could just charge $0 for rent or something. > > No need for stealth bombing. That’s no fun! California, with no army, has no real power to decide who does what with the land. California can’t even control its borders now. The US isn’t giving up a state when it can ignore or eliminate secessionists. Giving up any state is national suicide. It’s that simple. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2017, 2:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-joined-and-pledged-support-to-yes-california-today/771467/963 "2017-01-28T02:28:14Z")
> [@levdrakon](#): > > I don’t think there are really any good compelling reasons for the US to let CA go. California is arguably the most important state in the union, except for presidential elections. > > I wouldn’t say the US gets no compensation. But I did just run across [this article](https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2017/jan/19/bureau-land-management-federal-lease): > > Congress moves to give away national lands, discounting billions in revenue > Hey, if they’re giving it away… 🙂 I must admit, I’m surprised to see California liberals making common cause with Clive Bundy. ---
**Author:** ![Morgenstern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Morgenstern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgenstern)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2017, 2:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-joined-and-pledged-support-to-yes-california-today/771467/964 "2017-01-28T02:51:34Z")
Forward we go. Apparently, it’ not in violation of some law somewhere as many speculated, or at least, the CA AG didn’t find it. From CalExit. \*The California Attorney General’s Office has given us the green light to begin circulating the petition to qualify the Calexit independence vote for the November, 2018 ballot. \* Now, 6 months to collect the signatures putting the matter on the ballot. i think we’re pretty safe **octopus** , I don’t think Trump is sending in the B-52s yet. He’s too busy signing papers to keep out Muslims. ---
**Author:** ![Morgenstern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Morgenstern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgenstern)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2017, 2:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-joined-and-pledged-support-to-yes-california-today/771467/965 "2017-01-28T02:57:39Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > It was on the last page, post #895 and #896. I was asking Morgenstern what would become of Camp Pendleton, and the rest of the 45% of California that is owned by the federal government. He said “we’re free to do with it as we choose”, which Octopus, and me, and probably others, interpreted to mean that they’d kick the Marines out of Camp Pendleton. Good fucking luck with that. Again, you are mistaken. I posted the protocol used with the Phillippines becoming independent. Both countries agreed to the US remaining in bases for defense. I suggest you see what happened there and assume it might be a guide as to what happens here to. As I said. We’re collecting signatures. Trump continue to send people this way. ---
**Author:** ![MrsTime](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d26b3c/32.png) [@MrsTime](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrsTime)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2017, 2:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-joined-and-pledged-support-to-yes-california-today/771467/966 "2017-01-29T02:50:17Z")
> [@Morgenstern](#): > > We won’t lose our US citizenship. We will have dual citizenship as we live in the Republic of California. We will continue using the US dollar unless and until we vote on vote on creating a new currency. California is currently a donor state, paying more to the Federal government than it receives each year. California wouldn’t have to pay taxes to the US, and since they grow most of the produce the rest of the world eats the prices would likely go way up for a head of lettuce or a tomato. They have the 8th largest economy in the world. I suspect they would get along without the US just fine, however I would remind everyone as to why the Civil war was fought. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2017, 2:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-joined-and-pledged-support-to-yes-california-today/771467/967 "2017-01-29T02:53:28Z")
Oh San Francisco, you glorious bastards, you really are throwing your lot in with the Bundys: > **[California Could Cut Off Feds In Response To Trump Threats](https://www.cbsnews.com/sanfrancisco/news/california-could-cut-off-feds-in-response-to-trump-threats/)** > > The state of California is studying ways to suspend financial transfers to Washington after the Trump Administration threatened to withhold federal money from sanctuary cities, KPIX 5 has learned. > [@](#): > > The state of California is studying ways to suspend financial transfers to Washington after the Trump administration threatened to withhold federal money from sanctuary cities, KPIX 5 has learned. > > … > > “California could very well become an organized non-payer,” said Willie Brown, Jr, a former speaker of the state Assembly in an interview recorded Friday for KPIX 5’s Sunday morning news. “They could recommend non-compliance with the federal tax code.” I’m sure that’ll go over well when the IRS comes knocking: “well, the state of California recommended non-compliance.” :smack: ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2017, 4:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-joined-and-pledged-support-to-yes-california-today/771467/968 "2017-01-29T04:06:10Z")
> [@MrsTime](#): > > California wouldn’t have to pay taxes to the US, and since they grow most of the produce the rest of the world eats the prices would likely go way up for a head of lettuce or a tomato. They have the 8th largest economy in the world. I suspect they would get along without the US just fine, however I would remind everyone as to why the Civil war was fought. Which was to keep the union united. ---
**Author:** ![levdrakon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@levdrakon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/levdrakon)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2017, 10:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-joined-and-pledged-support-to-yes-california-today/771467/969 "2017-01-29T10:50:52Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > Oh San Francisco, you glorious bastards, you really are throwing your lot in with the Bundys: Trying to get away from the US of Bundy more like. ---
**Author:** ![jz78817](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jz78817/32/1028_2.png) [@jz78817](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jz78817)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2017, 11:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-joined-and-pledged-support-to-yes-california-today/771467/970 "2017-01-29T11:21:30Z")
> [@MrsTime](#): > > California wouldn’t have to pay taxes to the US, and since they grow most of the produce the rest of the world eats the prices would likely go way up for a head of lettuce or a tomato. They have the 8th largest economy in the world. I suspect they would get along without the US just fine, however I would remind everyone as to why the Civil war was fought. I’ll remind you that said produce is grown in the mostly red areas of California. it’s another unrealistic assumption that they’d want to stay with you. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2017, 1:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-joined-and-pledged-support-to-yes-california-today/771467/971 "2017-01-29T13:37:03Z")
> [@Morgenstern](#): > > You all are making one big mistake. You’re underestimating the resolve of Californian’s. > > _The state’s citizens have voted in measures to increase taxes, legalize marijuana, restrict the rights of gun owners and enact criminal justice reforms. While conservative state legislatures are debating pointless “bathroom bills,” California has passed what some say are the strongest LGBT protections in the entire world. The state hasn’t found a remedy for earthquakes, but a company in Silicon Valley has what appears to be a workable solution. It involves houses that hover._’ > > With a populating this intelligent, we’ll get what we want. Tough road it be, but there’s a road. What if you secede, and then other parts of California decide to secede from California? This idea of secession is about as loony as the Republic of Texas. ---
**Author:** ![levdrakon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@levdrakon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/levdrakon)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2017, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-joined-and-pledged-support-to-yes-california-today/771467/972 "2017-01-29T14:15:46Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > What if you secede, and then other parts of California decide to secede from California? This idea of secession is about as loony as the Republic of Texas. Conservatives frequently try to split the state because it’s too liberal and progressive. It always fails. Why would they be any more successful with the Nation of California? Claim they’re Russian and call Putin? ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2017, 3:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-joined-and-pledged-support-to-yes-california-today/771467/973 "2017-01-29T15:42:39Z")
> [@levdrakon](#): > > Conservatives frequently try to split the state because it’s too liberal and progressive. It always fails. Why would they be any more successful with the Nation of California? For at least a couple of reasons. First and foremost, the precedent would have been set by California itself that splitting up is aok and possible. Also, you would no longer being working under the U.S. Constitutional framework that makes secession so difficult. ---
**Author:** ![harmonicamoon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/65b543/32.png) [@harmonicamoon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/harmonicamoon)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2017, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-joined-and-pledged-support-to-yes-california-today/771467/974 "2017-01-29T15:43:17Z")
California is seeking signatures for a ballot initiative to leave the union. What if every state did this? Would trump get the picture? Or would he say it is fake news? ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2017, 3:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-joined-and-pledged-support-to-yes-california-today/771467/975 "2017-01-29T15:52:56Z")
And I would be curious for you to flesh out how it’s “frequently” been attempted and “always fails” and that the motivation is because California is so liberal and progressive. ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2017, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-joined-and-pledged-support-to-yes-california-today/771467/976 "2017-01-29T15:54:39Z")
And what do you want Trump to do if states do want to secede? Remember under _Texas v White_ it is Congress and not the President that decides if those states can leave. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2017, 4:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-joined-and-pledged-support-to-yes-california-today/771467/977 "2017-01-29T16:00:49Z")
I love California but the leftists in that state who are behind this are basically making themselves look like a bunch of unhinged sore sports, and it just reinforces the very negative attitudes that most of the rest of the country has toward them. Having said that, if ever there was an opportunity for a separatist movement to really get going and become mainstream, the possibility of a trade row with Mexico just might be the tonic secessionists are looking for – and they might have sympathizers in other states, including Texas. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2017, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-joined-and-pledged-support-to-yes-california-today/771467/978 "2017-01-29T17:45:23Z")
> [@harmonicamoon](#): > > California is seeking signatures for a ballot initiative to leave the union. > > What if every state did this? Would trump get the picture? Or would he say it is fake news? What picture should he get? That every state has a few loons like CA does? I think we can safely assume that is true without the need of such ballot initiatives. Polls are taken all the time about this sort of nonsense, and regardless of who is president, you typically get 20-25% of respondents in any given state to say they want to secede. BFD. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2017, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-joined-and-pledged-support-to-yes-california-today/771467/979 "2017-01-29T17:48:48Z")
> [@harmonicamoon](#): > > California is seeking signatures for a ballot initiative to leave the union. > > What if every state did this? Would trump get the picture? Or would he say it is fake news? We have a massive thread on California going on here: [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=810365&page=20](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=810365&page=20) This is all looney stuff. Trump won’t care. The vast majority of Democrats won’t care. Only those who subscribe to sovereign citizen-type nonsense will ultimately care. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2017, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-joined-and-pledged-support-to-yes-california-today/771467/980 "2017-01-29T17:53:42Z")
> [@levdrakon](#): > > Conservatives frequently try to split the state because it’s too liberal and progressive. It always fails. Why would they be any more successful with the Nation of California? Claim they’re Russian and call Putin? > [@CarnalK](#): > > For at least a couple of reasons. First and foremost, the precedent would have been set by California itself that splitting up is aok and possible. Also, you would no longer being working under the U.S. Constitutional framework that makes secession so difficult. Is it conservatives trying to do this? I think it’s more us folks up North who want to shake off the southern part, and we’re pretty damn liberal. But the fact is, it’s not really fair to say people “try to do” this. They talk about it a lot, but there’s not a lot of doing involved. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-joined-and-pledged-support-to-yes-california-today/771467.md?page=48) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-joined-and-pledged-support-to-yes-california-today/771467.md?page=50)