# I joined, and pledged support to Yes California today. **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [November 11, 2016, 4:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-joined-and-pledged-support-to-yes-california-today/771467 "2016-11-11T04:44:31Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 60
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2017, 6:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-joined-and-pledged-support-to-yes-california-today/771467/1181 "2017-02-07T18:32:42Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > Is the lawyer in Russia? Nyet! In CalExit, Russia is in LAWYER! ---
**Author:** ![Morgenstern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Morgenstern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgenstern)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2017, 12:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-joined-and-pledged-support-to-yes-california-today/771467/1182 "2017-02-08T00:19:53Z")
> [@tomndebb](#): > > This is just the most recent drought. There were also droughts 1929 - 1934, 1976 - 1977, 1987 - 1982, and 2012 - 201?. That is a lot of unavailable water for an area that cannot survive without it. > And the current snowpack is still [not regarded as sufficient to ease current restrictions](http://www.csmonitor.com/Environment/2017/0204/As-the-snowpack-piles-up-is-California-s-drought-over-No-say-experts). > 10% from a serious drought would be catastrophic. Typical uninformed bullshit. CA has had droughts about every 7 years since I’ve lived here. When that happens, we’re asked to cut back our water usage by up to 25%, and we typically respond by cutting back 30%. 10% wouldn’t be anywhere near catastrophic. Not welcome. but not catastrophic like you guessed. > [@tomndebb](#): > > Your pipe dreams seem to blind you to the differences between rejecting Donald Trump as bigot-in-charge and actually choosing to separate from the U.S. – Whatever. I’d be butthurt if I lived in a red state too Tom… It’s bad enough being on the other side of the country from the Orange plague. > [@tomndebb](#): > > (I _have_ found this amusing: > [A Calexit leader lives in Russia.](http://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/opinion/the-conversation/sd-calexit-leaders-lives-in-russia-20161216-htmlstory.html)) 😛 Imagine that, he took a job in Russia. For pay. You didn’t have to dig so hard, it’s on the CalExit web site. Great detective work though. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![DorkVader](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/73ab20/32.png) [@DorkVader](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DorkVader)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2017, 12:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-joined-and-pledged-support-to-yes-california-today/771467/1183 "2017-02-08T00:27:02Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > Nyet! > > In CalExit, Russia is in LAWYER! 😃 snerfk 😃 I’ll be billing you for a keyboard ---
**Author:** ![Morgenstern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Morgenstern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgenstern)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2017, 12:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-joined-and-pledged-support-to-yes-california-today/771467/1184 "2017-02-08T00:27:52Z")
> [@Paranoid\_Randroid](#): > > Would it be possible to write out a possible scenario as to how California’s exit might unfold? Not necessarily how it _will_, just how it might. I’m not appraised of the issues but it’s unclear to me that 37 other state governments could be convinced permitting California to leave would be in their best interest. > > That leaves other legal solutions, but even if (say) California were added to chapter 11 of the UN charter what would be the ballgame? Is there a plan? If CA is added to the UN list of territories, it’s a done deal. The US has already agreed, by treaty, to promote independence for those people seeking it. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2017, 12:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-joined-and-pledged-support-to-yes-california-today/771467/1185 "2017-02-08T00:47:03Z")
> [@Morgenstern](#): > > If CA is added to the UN list of territories, it’s a done deal. The US has already agreed, by treaty, to promote independence for those people seeking it. I guess you are ignorant of the US’s treatment of treaties that the US finds inconvenient. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2017, 1:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-joined-and-pledged-support-to-yes-california-today/771467/1186 "2017-02-08T01:01:14Z")
> [@Morgenstern](#): > > If CA is added to the UN list of territories, it’s a done deal. The US has already agreed, by treaty, to promote independence for those people seeking it. Hahahaha! There’s more than a dozen colonies on the UN list that have been there since1946!! ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2017, 6:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-joined-and-pledged-support-to-yes-california-today/771467/1187 "2017-02-08T06:07:54Z")
> [@Morgenstern](#): > > Typical uninformed bullshit. CA has had droughts about every 7 years since I’ve lived here. When that happens, we’re asked to cut back our water usage by up to 25%, and we typically respond by cutting back 30%. 10% wouldn’t be anywhere near catastrophic. Not welcome. but not catastrophic like you guessed. The big problem would arise not when California loses a million acre-feet or three from the Colorado River _instead_ of losing a comparable amount due to drought, but when it loses the Colorado River _in addition to_ a drought. Didn’t think of that, hunh? Moreover, replenishing water lost in the South with rainfall in the North isn’t as trivial as you imply. Yes there is huge infrastructure in place to move water, but does it have much extra capacity? Google tells me that even a single million acre-feet per year equates to over 10,000 gallons per second. You’d better start dredging the Feather River now! Or not. In the scenario where Trumpia cuts off the Colorado River, Imperial Valley will revert to desert. Just let it go. But what I cannot understand is your entire scenario. You envision an amicable secession in which Trumpia continues to meet certain financial obligations to the rebels, while not expecting the converse … and yet maliciously renounces its Colorado River obligations. Is there a webpage detailing how this is all envisioned to play out? I admit to only skimming the thread — every time I read that California’s new status will be protected by the U.N. I check the links to see if we’re getting info from _The Onion_. ---
**Author:** ![Pantastic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3bc359/32.png) [@Pantastic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pantastic)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2017, 7:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-joined-and-pledged-support-to-yes-california-today/771467/1188 "2017-02-08T07:11:10Z")
> [@Morgenstern](#): > > If CA is added to the UN list of territories, it’s a done deal. The US has already agreed, by treaty, to promote independence for those people seeking it. I wonder if all of Calexit has your deep and nuanced understanding of international law and history. This fantasy of yours is amusingly divorced from reality. ---
**Author:** ![crucible](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/5f8ce5/32.png) [@crucible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crucible)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2017, 12:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-joined-and-pledged-support-to-yes-california-today/771467/1189 "2017-02-08T12:27:51Z")
I’m not at all convinced that the other states have to confirm California leaving the Union. But, one must admit, there are all sorts of ‘red’ states who often voice the sentiment that California should fall into the Pacific, the rest of the country would be better off. Stupid sentiment, yes, but one frequently voiced. Most of the 38 votes needed might come from Red States…and the rest from Blue ones who want to encourage a strong stand against Thrumpism. Calexit might well be followed by NENYexit. Yes, clearer head might well prevail, but, just sayin’, a lot of Thrumpists would like to see their Washington minority of the people government become a majority. When California goes, they can implement their theocratic plans to their heart’s content. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2017, 1:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-joined-and-pledged-support-to-yes-california-today/771467/1190 "2017-02-08T13:03:05Z")
> [@crucible](#): > > I’m not at all convinced that the other states have to confirm California leaving the Union. But, one must admit, there are all sorts of ‘red’ states who often voice the sentiment that California should fall into the Pacific, the rest of the country would be better off. Stupid sentiment, yes, but one frequently voiced. Most of the 38 votes needed might come from Red States…and the rest from Blue ones who want to encourage a strong stand against Thrumpism. Calexit might well be followed by NENYexit. > > Yes, clearer head might well prevail, but, just sayin’, a lot of Thrumpists would like to see their Washington minority of the people government become a majority. When California goes, they can implement their theocratic plans to their heart’s content. I guess you never heard of the Civil War. ---
**Author:** ![Paranoid\_Randroid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/paranoid_randroid/32/18_2.png) [@Paranoid\_Randroid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Paranoid_Randroid)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2017, 2:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-joined-and-pledged-support-to-yes-california-today/771467/1191 "2017-02-08T14:17:29Z")
> [@crucible](#): > > I’m not at all convinced that the other states have to confirm California leaving the Union. Well, I centered in on that because the Yes California website specifically describes two ways forward and both require a 2/3 majority of states to agree. Considering the size of California’s economy, its importance to the nation, and what’s certain to be a large degree of popular opposition (the end of the union as we know it is pretty serious business), I’m doubtful that can be achieved. California’s exit might mean a Republican lock on the White House – but the costs involved would be huge and there aren’t enough red states crazy enough to think it’s a good trade off. That’s why I’ve asked for some kind of scenario as to how it might unfold. ---
**Author:** ![Pantastic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3bc359/32.png) [@Pantastic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pantastic)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2017, 3:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-joined-and-pledged-support-to-yes-california-today/771467/1192 "2017-02-08T15:15:08Z")
> [@crucible](#): > > I’m not at all convinced that the other states have to confirm California leaving the Union. Well, you’re disagreeing with the Supreme court and the fact of the Civil War, so I doubt that there’s anything that would actually convince you. Even Morgenstern is convinced that the other states have to consent to California leaving, at least some of the time. If you’re going to steadfastly ignore facts and history, the fact that you’re not convinced really isn’t significant to anyone but you. > [@](#): > > But, one must admit, there are all sorts of ‘red’ states who often voice the sentiment that California should fall into the Pacific, the rest of the country would be better off. Stupid sentiment, yes, but one frequently voiced. Most of the 38 votes needed might come from Red States…and the rest from Blue ones who want to encourage a strong stand against Thrumpism. Calexit might well be followed by NENYexit. If this is true, name one state that has actually voiced that sentiment. No, not some citizen ranting, and not even an individual state rep, I want a proclamation approved by the state legislature and signed off (or not vetoed) by the governor, because that’s what it takes for the state to voice such an opinion, and also what is required for a state to approve of the exit should it get that far. “Some people sometimes say mean stuff about California” is a far cry from “The state says…” or from voting in favor of a constitutional amendment. Very few states are actually going to vote to destroy the US as a country, but deciding that a foreign country can simply take over American homes on American land without a fight, that a state can just up and leave if they don’t like an election, and all of the other fun that goes along with Calexit would mean that the US ceases to exist as an effective country. ---
**Author:** ![Pantastic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3bc359/32.png) [@Pantastic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pantastic)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2017, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-joined-and-pledged-support-to-yes-california-today/771467/1193 "2017-02-08T15:16:48Z")
> [@Paranoid\_Randroid](#): > > Well, I centered in on that because the Yes California website specifically describes two ways forward and both require a 2/3 majority of states to agree. One actually takes 3/4 of States (amendment) and the other requires holding a constitutional convention to completely rewrite the constitution, which is a much more extreme option than Calexit makes out. ---
**Author:** ![Paranoid\_Randroid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/paranoid_randroid/32/18_2.png) [@Paranoid\_Randroid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Paranoid_Randroid)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2017, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-joined-and-pledged-support-to-yes-california-today/771467/1194 "2017-02-08T15:31:08Z")
> [@Pantastic](#): > > One actually takes 3/4 of States (amendment) and the other requires holding a constitutional convention Thanks, sorry. I need to be more careful in what I write. ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2017, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-joined-and-pledged-support-to-yes-california-today/771467/1195 "2017-02-08T16:46:27Z")
All this talk of how many states in the U.S. are needed to let California go keep ignoring the fact that it is extremely unlikely that most Californians are willing to secede. I keep looking for serious numbers and I can only find wild speculation from the Calexit promoters. ---
**Author:** ![Morgenstern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Morgenstern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgenstern)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2017, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-joined-and-pledged-support-to-yes-california-today/771467/1196 "2017-02-08T16:51:33Z")
> [@Pantastic](#): > > I wonder if all of Calexit has your deep and nuanced understanding of international law and history. This fantasy of yours is amusingly divorced from reality. History? History you say? People have voted to leave before. You’re guessing right? ---
**Author:** ![Morgenstern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Morgenstern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgenstern)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2017, 4:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-joined-and-pledged-support-to-yes-california-today/771467/1197 "2017-02-08T16:52:59Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > Hahahaha! > > There’s more than a dozen colonies on the UN list that have been there since1946!! Yes. Some don’t want independence. Gawd you’re perceptive. ---
**Author:** ![Morgenstern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Morgenstern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgenstern)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2017, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-joined-and-pledged-support-to-yes-california-today/771467/1198 "2017-02-08T16:54:08Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > I guess you never heard of the Civil War. The civil war has nothing to do with this. you keep missing that even though it’s been told to you 15 or 20 times herein. Please try harder to keep up. > [@octopus](#): > > I guess you are ignorant of the US’s treatment of treaties that the US finds inconvenient. You got me there. With an administration that lives in alternative facts, fake news, fraud and deception, what could go wrong? That is, if there’s even a country left to leave when the Orange plague runs its course. ---
**Author:** ![Morgenstern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Morgenstern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgenstern)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2017, 4:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-joined-and-pledged-support-to-yes-california-today/771467/1199 "2017-02-08T16:59:01Z")
> [@tomndebb](#): > > All this talk of how many states in the U.S. are needed to let California go keep ignoring the fact that it is extremely unlikely that most Californians are willing to secede. Patience. Trump’s not done recruiting for our side yet. > [@tomndebb](#): > > I keep looking for serious numbers and I can only find wild speculation from the Calexit promoters. Patience. ---
**Author:** ![Morgenstern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Morgenstern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgenstern)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2017, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-joined-and-pledged-support-to-yes-california-today/771467/1200 "2017-02-08T17:01:03Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > Why do you keep posting this bullshit? It’s been debunked a dozen times already. Clearly it hasn’t. I’ve read opinions and guesses from those with no credentials in this matter, but it’s clearly far from debunked. Obviously, I don’t give much weight to those opinions and guesses. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-joined-and-pledged-support-to-yes-california-today/771467.md?page=59) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-joined-and-pledged-support-to-yes-california-today/771467.md?page=61)