# I just don't get it. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [June 30, 2003, 10:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-just-dont-get-it/185448 "2003-06-30T22:44:20Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2003, 1:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-just-dont-get-it/185448/141 "2003-07-02T01:32:14Z")
**Poly** , there was never anything for me to forgive, personally. I was pretty sure it was either a misstatement or a misreading from the beginning. For those who continually find themselves misunderstood or misread on this and similar subjects, you might want to remember that it was **Poly’s** overall on-board demeanor and reputation that kept anyone from seriously “jumping his shit”. Not that the hetero side has been doing _all_ of the overreacting in recent gay threads… _stern glare at our own ranks_ ---
**Author:** ![Scylla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2003, 1:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-just-dont-get-it/185448/142 "2003-07-02T01:35:53Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Mockingbird \* > \*\*Puh-_leeeese_. > > You are a sad excuse for a human being. > > The level of denial you are at is astounding, and that you can spew the bullshit you do and believe it amazes me. > > gobear isn’t lying, but you are lying to yourself, you poor deluded bastard. > \*\* Maybe. It’s all possible. You could be right. You sure do seem to take a lot of pleasure in just letting rip at other people, you know? You do it real often. I wonder what you think that says about you. What do you think it means? ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2003, 3:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-just-dont-get-it/185448/143 "2003-07-02T03:01:19Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by jayjay \* > **Not that the hetero side has been doing _all_ of the overreacting in recent gay threads…** Yeah, but we EXPECT you guys to overreact! 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Homebrew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/c89c15/32.png) [@Homebrew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Homebrew)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2003, 3:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-just-dont-get-it/185448/144 "2003-07-02T03:02:59Z")
No need to apologize, **Polycarp**. We know your heart is golden and your intentions are good. ---
**Author:** ![gobear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/8dc957/32.png) [@gobear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gobear)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2003, 4:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-just-dont-get-it/185448/145 "2003-07-02T04:27:21Z")
> [@](#): > > I thought that, Miller, but I’m already in enough trouble in this thread without making that comment. (And apparently nobody is going to forgive me, either! All is forgiven, not that I was any more than mildly irritated. > [@](#): > > No. it’s judgemental hypocrisy that I’m unfriendly to. > > Playing the bigotry card because we’ve have a personal disagreement is low. It has nothing to do with gay people in general, and the implication otherwise is a shitty lie. Well then, \*\*show it’s a lie. So far you have used the “special rights” argument, you’ve called a racist, homophobic political hack an “elder statesman,” and you persist in insisting that this is not a gay issue when it jolly well is. To demand that I respect someone who never respected me is unequal treatment. I want to think you’re on the right side, but you’re not giving me a lot to work with here. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2003, 5:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-just-dont-get-it/185448/146 "2003-07-02T05:03:16Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by yojimbo \* > \*\*You gotta love The Onion. > > [http://www.theonion.com/onion3715/gay\_pride\_parade.html](http://www.theonion.com/onion3715/gay_pride_parade.html) \*\* I have to ask-I highly doubt gay pride parades are like this, but what are the most outrageous things that go on? (I’m not a fan of a parades in general) ---
**Author:** ![matt\_mcl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7ab992/32.png) [@matt\_mcl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/matt_mcl)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2003, 5:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-just-dont-get-it/185448/147 "2003-07-02T05:18:25Z")
Guin - the most out-there thing I can think of was the naked contingent at the Toronto parade. (They were the gay nudist club, anyway.) When people complain, they usually are referring to the drag queens, leather guys, and topless dykes, which I don’t understand the problem with, really. ---
**Author:** ![Panzerfaust](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ecc23a/32.png) [@Panzerfaust](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Panzerfaust)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2003, 5:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-just-dont-get-it/185448/148 "2003-07-02T05:19:27Z")
This is the sort of argument that’s almost never resolved, because of the very behaviour in this thread. I know this is really, really hard to believe, but not every heterosexual who disagrees with your position, or possible tendency toward tasteless fashion, is a redneck, queer-stomping reactionary striving to rob you of your right to blast Madonna and wear leather. Equality is the freedom to mock each other’s lifestyles without upset or offense. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2003, 5:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-just-dont-get-it/185448/149 "2003-07-02T05:23:32Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by matt\_mcl \* > \*\*Guin - the most out-there thing I can think of was the naked contingent at the Toronto parade. (They were the gay nudist club, anyway.) > > When people complain, they usually are referring to the drag queens, leather guys, and topless dykes, which I don’t understand the problem with, really. \*\* Ah, okay. (Although, wouldn’t you get arrested for indecent exposure, or doesn’t Canada have nudity laws?) As for being “weird”, there’s weird straight people too, I guess. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2003, 5:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-just-dont-get-it/185448/150 "2003-07-02T05:28:26Z")
Again, I reference Mardi Gras in re: weird straight people. I honestly fail to see a difference. ---
**Author:** ![Mockingbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c68b51/32.png) [@Mockingbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mockingbird)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2003, 5:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-just-dont-get-it/185448/151 "2003-07-02T05:31:51Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Polycarp \* > \*\*I _thought_ that, **Miller** , but I’m already in enough trouble in this thread without making that comment. (And apparently nobody is going to forgive me, either! :() > > But you gotta remember that the guy who defeated the Sacred Band was Alexander, himself no slouch in the SSA department. (Though we wont’ explore the implications of "Thjey were famed for their ability to beat off all attackers of Thebes… ;)) \*\* Like gobear said, there is no doubt that your intentions and meaning were without taint. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2003, 5:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-just-dont-get-it/185448/152 "2003-07-02T05:33:25Z")
I’ve always wanted to go to Mardi Gras. (Not to show my b00bs or anything-I want to dress up and wear my Mardi Gras mask and go to a ball) ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2003, 7:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-just-dont-get-it/185448/153 "2003-07-02T07:12:24Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by KellyM \* > \*\ ***Libertarian** , might it be because the LP opposes antidiscrimination law? The LP would be happy to leave gays (and all other minorities) huddled in whatever dark corners they can cajole out of an uncaring majority, which under the LP’s vision of the “minimal state” would not be required to refrain from discriminating against them. \*\* Goodness. You must think gays and other minorities, even when free from other people’s coercion, are woefully inept, incompetent, and impotent. I know plenty of gay people — including many on this board — who, when competing in a free and open market, would drive competing “straight” businesses right out of business. No one needs anti-discrimination laws; what are needed are anti-coercion laws. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2003, 7:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-just-dont-get-it/185448/154 "2003-07-02T07:33:53Z")
Oh, yes. Because quality of work and competence and talent _always_ win out over blind prejudice and hate. ---
**Author:** ![Mockingbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c68b51/32.png) [@Mockingbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mockingbird)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2003, 7:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-just-dont-get-it/185448/155 "2003-07-02T07:43:39Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by jayjay \* > \*\*Oh, yes. Because quality of work and competence and talent _always_ win out over blind prejudice and hate. \*\* Yup. Talent and hard work always can defeat a burning cross and bigotry. I learned that first by watching Raisin In The Sun. ---
**Author:** ![matt\_mcl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7ab992/32.png) [@matt\_mcl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/matt_mcl)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2003, 8:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-just-dont-get-it/185448/156 "2003-07-02T08:10:27Z")
> [@](#): > > (Although, wouldn’t you get arrested for indecent exposure, or doesn’t Canada have nudity laws?) A nude person is one who is “so clad as to offend the public order;” apparently, there is insufficient public order at a pride parade to be offended by topless women. (Anyway, it’s legal in Ontario.) One year, the nudists were arrested in Toronto; they were let off because they were wearing shoes, if you can believe it. (The year I was there, to be fair, most of them were wearing some sort of fig leaf.) ---
**Author:** ![Siege](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/dbc845/32.png) [@Siege](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siege)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2003, 10:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-just-dont-get-it/185448/157 "2003-07-02T10:45:43Z")
To be honest, I get a bit oogy about public displays of affection whether their between heterosexuals, bisexuals, homosexuals, or some combination of people whose sexuality I don’t know. In my case, it’s due to old wounds, i.e. “They’re getting affectionate, therefore I must not be wanted here.” On the other hand, it really bothers me that **scott evil** cannot refer to **jeremy** as casually and easily as **Airman Doors** can refer to **Ms. Robyn** in the same circumstances, or that men picking up women in bars is considered normal while men picking up men in bars is considered abnormal. I’ve also got one question after reading through this thread. You see, I like _La Cage Aux Folles_ (please tell me I’ve spelled that right!) and I’ve been known to belt out _I Will Survive_ at the top of my lungs and with great joy. Is there something I’m not aware of? 😉 CJ ---
**Author:** ![Siege](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/dbc845/32.png) [@Siege](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siege)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2003, 10:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-just-dont-get-it/185448/158 "2003-07-02T10:47:19Z")
By the way, congratulations **scott** and **jeremy**. May you have many long, happy, fabulous years together. CJ ---
**Author:** ![Who\_me\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/958977/32.png) [@Who\_me\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Who_me_1)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2003, 11:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-just-dont-get-it/185448/159 "2003-07-02T11:27:51Z")
This thread has turned out to be more interesting and thought provoking than I feared when I started reading it. I think this thread shows how far the straight community (as a whole) has to go to really accept gay and lesbian couples. I’ll admit that in going to my first gay bar (oh so many years ago) I found the sight of two gay men slow dancing and making out a little disconcerting. But I think it’s kind of like seeing anything that one is not used to for the first time… a little strange. I found that once I was more used to seeing men being affectionate with one another, the less I noticed it. And with women making out… I actually never had any issues with that…(and I’m not going to put a smilie or anything here… I’m not making a joke. I have had too many lesbian friends too even consider or really want to leer when they are kissing or whatever) I don’t hang at gay bars, I never did. If a gay friend wanted to go to one I had no problems with going. I found gay pride festivals to be some of the more enjoyable spots to be. I really can’t explain why though, everyone is friendly and outgoing and a lot of fun, but that is not it. There just seems to be a different atmosphere, _that’s_ what I can’t really explain, it’s a sense of freedom and celebration that I’ve never experienced anywhere else. Anyone who says that gay pride festivals hurt the acceptance of gays and lesbians… well I guess you can have your opinions. In my opinion, gay pride parades and festivals are not really to enhance acceptance of homosexuals, but for those same homosexuals to celebrate their feelings and the freedom of associating with others who feel the same way. But in saying that, they do not exclude anyone either. At a pride day celebration, everyone is made to feel welcome, which is another thing I haven’t experienced in very many places. I hope I have not insulted anyone here. If I have, please let me know where I’ve erred and where my misconceptions are. ---
**Author:** ![Scylla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2003, 1:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-just-dont-get-it/185448/160 "2003-07-02T13:07:26Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by gobear \* > \*\*Well then, \*\*show it’s a lie. So far you have used the “special rights” argument, No I haven’t. I have seen you make an argument that your experience gives you a special perspective, and you have argued that it has. > [@](#): > > you’ve called a racist, homophobic political hack an “elder statesman,” Yes, Gobear he is. As has been pointed out to you, that’s really a fact not subject to debate. Here’s another fact: He’s a war hero with 8 or 18 (I forget) combat decorations. Here’s another: In spite of the fact that he was very openly bigoted in the past a lot of his constituents, including black ones, kept him in office because it was perceived that he did change with the times. Did he really? I dunno. 'Prolly not, but that’s just my opinion. Was he bad on gays. Absolutely. So is everybody else who voted for Doma. I don’t want to defend the guy, but you put in the uncomfortable position of coming close to bein an apologist because of your insistence that this one horrible aspect of the man alone is his full measure. But, it’s really not that easy, at least in my book. > [@](#): > > and you persist in insisting that this is not a gay issue when it jolly well is. To demand that I respect someone who never respected me is unequal treatment. I have never demanded that you respected the man. And, what is not a gay issue is the fact that you and I are disagreeing whether it’s cool to shellack Strom before he’s even buried. > [@](#): > > \*\*I want to think you’re on the right side, but you’re not giving me a lot to work with here. \*\* I really do try to call them like I see them. I’m a political conservative, that doesn’t mean I agree with the Social ones. And they’re not all evil either. You underestimate the power of stupidity and simple ignorance if you think they all are. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-just-dont-get-it/185448.md?page=7) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-just-dont-get-it/185448.md?page=9)