# I just witnessed Food Food Stamp Abuse! WTF! **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [July 10, 2005, 12:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-just-witnessed-food-food-stamp-abuse-wtf/311796 "2005-07-10T00:36:58Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Nawth\_Chucka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/c57346/32.png) [@Nawth\_Chucka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nawth_Chucka)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2005, 12:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-just-witnessed-food-food-stamp-abuse-wtf/311796/21 "2005-07-10T12:56:31Z")
We went over exactly these issues in [this thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=301299&highlight=food+stamps) I figured you may not have seen it due to your newness… ---
**Author:** ![Rushgeekgirl](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rushgeekgirl/32/3715_2.png) [@Rushgeekgirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rushgeekgirl)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2005, 1:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-just-witnessed-food-food-stamp-abuse-wtf/311796/22 "2005-07-10T13:17:11Z")
> [@](#): > > We went over exactly these issues in this thread That thread made me sad. ---
**Author:** ![Nawth\_Chucka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/c57346/32.png) [@Nawth\_Chucka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nawth_Chucka)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2005, 2:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-just-witnessed-food-food-stamp-abuse-wtf/311796/23 "2005-07-10T14:12:25Z")
> [@Rushgeekgirl](#): > > That thread made me sad. I’m right there w/ you **RGG** ; after all the years I paid taxes into it, someone tried to make me feel bad about using a Pell grant because it’s ‘government assistance’. Why not complain about people speeding on government maintained roads?? Maybe someday soon people who aren’t in need will stop devaluing those who are! Having less $$ is not an indication of lacking morals or worth, and I say to hell w/ any of those people who look down their noses at folks who expect their government’s help after it has accepted their support in the form of taxes. ---
**Author:** ![chaoticbear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f07891/32.png) [@chaoticbear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chaoticbear)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2005, 11:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-just-witnessed-food-food-stamp-abuse-wtf/311796/24 "2005-07-10T23:47:31Z")
I can almost always tell when people are going to pay with an EBT card. Warning signs include: 1. Lots of processed junk food, and often the most expensive brand of it 2. A lot of frozen prepared meals 3. Significant lack of fresh vegetables (or Hi Opal!) ---
**Author:** ![funeste](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8491ac/32.png) [@funeste](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/funeste)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2005, 1:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-just-witnessed-food-food-stamp-abuse-wtf/311796/25 "2005-07-11T01:36:21Z")
> [@chaoticdonkey](#): > > I can almost always tell when people are going to pay with an EBT card. Warning signs include: > > 1. Lots of processed junk food, and often the most expensive brand of it > 2. A lot of frozen prepared meals > 3. Significant lack of fresh vegetables (or Hi Opal!) I too have found that, if I take notice of the people who conform to my prejudice while disregarding those who don’t, almost all of them do! ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2005, 1:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-just-witnessed-food-food-stamp-abuse-wtf/311796/26 "2005-07-11T01:40:16Z")
> [@Carm6773](#): > > You can also use EBT to buy Bakery items, such as FULL SHEET CAKES complete with picture of the little one (who, along with Mom, is completely decked out in FUBU gear). Mom sometimes has a hard time swiping her card because her custom done nails are still wet, or the card is at the bottom of the Louis Vuitton purse, underneath a huge roll of cash (usually 20s and 50s). One cart is devoted to the cake, the other to the rest of the party food, which includes: lobster, steak, crab legs, etc. You forgot to mention that she drove off in a Cadillac. ---
**Author:** ![fluiddruid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/c2a13f/32.png) [@fluiddruid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fluiddruid)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2005, 1:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-just-witnessed-food-food-stamp-abuse-wtf/311796/27 "2005-07-11T01:47:37Z")
> [@chaoticdonkey](#): > > I can almost always tell when people are going to pay with an EBT card. Warning signs include: > > 1. Lots of processed junk food, and often the most expensive brand of it > 2. A lot of frozen prepared meals > 3. Significant lack of fresh vegetables (or Hi Opal!) Wouldn’t this apply to most American families (or at least most poor American families) with or without assistance? Interestingly, government assistance programs are accepted at our city’s Farmer’s Market. This is widely popular and the merchants at the market bear huge signs advertising that they accept it. One of my temporary employees was mentioning it, that she can’t wait to use it to get fresh green beans and things like that for her and her kids. ---
**Author:** ![MsRobyn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/90ced4/32.png) [@MsRobyn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MsRobyn)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2005, 1:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-just-witnessed-food-food-stamp-abuse-wtf/311796/28 "2005-07-11T01:51:39Z")
> [@Portia](#): > > I’m right there w/ you **RGG** ; after all the years I paid taxes into it, someone tried to make me feel bad about using a Pell grant because it’s ‘government assistance’. Why not complain about people speeding on government maintained roads?? Why would someone make you feel bad for using a Pell grant to go to school? It’s not like the government gave you a check for nothing. This term, I was fortunate to have Pell and state grants cover all of my tuition and fees. I don’t see it as a handout, I see it as a means to better myself and get a better-paying job. The money I got in grants will be repaid within five years out of my taxes, and I have to repay all of my loans with interest, so the government isn’t out anything at all. If anyone insists that an education grant is “government assistance” or a “handout”, that’s their own ignorance showing. Robin ---
**Author:** ![Nawth\_Chucka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/c57346/32.png) [@Nawth\_Chucka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nawth_Chucka)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2005, 1:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-just-witnessed-food-food-stamp-abuse-wtf/311796/29 "2005-07-11T01:59:53Z")
> [@MsRobyn](#): > > Why would someone make you feel bad for using a Pell grant to go to school? Robin That’d be “Cause he was a jerk who used his version of Republicanism to belittle anyone not on his financial level.” In his world, all it takes is lots of hard work and one is guaranteed success. Failure or difficulty means laziness or weakness of some kind. This was someone who’d gone from poverty to upper middle-class and believed you don’t buy anything w/o having the $$ for it first, even college. ---
**Author:** ![eleanorigby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ee7513/32.png) [@eleanorigby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eleanorigby)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2005, 2:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-just-witnessed-food-food-stamp-abuse-wtf/311796/30 "2005-07-11T02:20:12Z")
Maybe the beer helps with let down and helps Mama relax a bit. It certainly doesn’t hurt the baby at all, and I can’t believe that one beer upon occasion would adversely effect lactation. What is this thread about? Are poor people not supposed to consume beer? Who decided that? Are they not entitled to a cold frosty one on a hot summer day because they get government assistance? What kind of an attitude is that? I am just full of questions! As for the custom manicure and the sheet cake–you don’t know what this woman’s priorities are. Maybe that cake is all the Bday that kid is having. Maybe they rented out Disneyworld–my point is that you don’t have enough info to make a final judgement. Maybe the manicure is the one luxury the woman allows herself ( I think custom nails are tacky as hell, but that opinion is not shared by all). Who the hell knows or cares? What does FUBU mean? I don’t understand why people get so mad about welfare and the “wasting” of “our tax dollars”–like it would better to have these people begging on the streets? In an ideal world, people would consistently make nutritious choices etc–but I don’t see how anyone can judge another’s diet choices in situations like this. Maybe they have a veggie garden out back and so don’t need to buy any produce…who knows? Don’t you have more important things to do than report people for “fraud”(that most likely isn’t fraud at all?). ---
**Author:** ![chique](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4491bb/32.png) [@chique](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chique)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2005, 5:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-just-witnessed-food-food-stamp-abuse-wtf/311796/31 "2005-07-11T05:16:35Z")
So on the one hand you have a guy using his cash assistance (and does anyone know the total off the top of his/her head? Something like $220 a month to buy soap, toothpaste, laundry detergent, dish soap, all clothing, transportation (be it gas for the beater, bus passes, or subway tokens), bedding, kitchen utensils, etc.) to buy beer. On the other hand, there are two guys in Washington, DC, whose sole job is raising a flag, holding it for five seconds, and lowering it so you can give it to your best friend on his 4th of July birthday. The office of the president sends out hundreds of birthday and anniversary cards. There are hair dressers whose sole purpose is to cut and style the hair of congressmen. There’s a guy who wanders around the Capitol and fills up snuff boxes. And the largest government contractor has managed to lose something like a billion dollars in Iraq. And you’re mad because someone bought a six pack? ---
**Author:** ![Rushgeekgirl](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rushgeekgirl/32/3715_2.png) [@Rushgeekgirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rushgeekgirl)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2005, 5:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-just-witnessed-food-food-stamp-abuse-wtf/311796/32 "2005-07-11T05:31:24Z")
> [@chaoticdonkey](#): > > I can almost always tell when people are going to pay with an EBT card. Warning signs include: > > 1. Lots of processed junk food, and often the most expensive brand of it > 2. A lot of frozen prepared meals > 3. Significant lack of fresh vegetables (or Hi Opal!) I suppose I would have surprised you then. I looove fresh fruits and veggies. One thing I did splurge on, once, was a DiGiorno stuffed crust pizza. I was craving it, and it had meat and veggies and filled me up just as well as my standard chicken dinner…and cost about the same. Most of the time we eat simple: meat, a couple veggies and a starch. If I crave a candy bar or something like that we run next door to the gas station. I don’t even know if they take the EBT card; we usually get change from the cusscan. Maybe I’m not your \*usual \*\* FS recipient though. I could still qualify for them now, but I declined recertification. Six months was all I’d allow myself. I only took them as part of Families First so I could get on insurance while pregnant. Heck, I’ve never been much above poverty level; I imagine I could have gotten them at any time in the past sixteen years. \*usual meaning the welfare queen generalization I always see. ---
**Author:** ![Rushgeekgirl](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rushgeekgirl/32/3715_2.png) [@Rushgeekgirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rushgeekgirl)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2005, 5:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-just-witnessed-food-food-stamp-abuse-wtf/311796/33 "2005-07-11T05:34:22Z")
_So on the one hand you have a guy using his cash assistance (and does anyone know the total off the top of his/her head?_ I received 277 in FS, 142 in cash for 2 people. ---
**Author:** ![chaoticbear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f07891/32.png) [@chaoticbear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chaoticbear)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2005, 5:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-just-witnessed-food-food-stamp-abuse-wtf/311796/34 "2005-07-11T05:36:29Z")
You know, I just realized that I don’t know many of the rules regarding EBT benefits. Do you have to be employed? Do you have to be _un_employed? Is there a maximum length that you can receive benefits? How is amount per month determined? Does all of this vary from state to state so that my questions are pointless? ---
**Author:** ![Rushgeekgirl](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rushgeekgirl/32/3715_2.png) [@Rushgeekgirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rushgeekgirl)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2005, 5:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-just-witnessed-food-food-stamp-abuse-wtf/311796/35 "2005-07-11T05:39:31Z")
And haha yeah, I know I shouldn’t have gotten myself pregnant when I couldn’t afford to. At 34, you’d think I’d know better! (I just felt like a comment might have been made somewhere later. I’ll admit my irresponsibility before anyone jumps on it!) ---
**Author:** ![Rushgeekgirl](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rushgeekgirl/32/3715_2.png) [@Rushgeekgirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rushgeekgirl)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2005, 5:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-just-witnessed-food-food-stamp-abuse-wtf/311796/36 "2005-07-11T05:44:11Z")
> [@chaoticdonkey](#): > > You know, I just realized that I don’t know many of the rules regarding EBT benefits. Do you have to be employed? Do you have to be _un_employed? Is there a maximum length that you can receive benefits? How is amount per month determined? Does all of this vary from state to state so that my questions are pointless? I wasn’t required to be employed because I was pregnant. I think you get a year after where you’re not required to work or attend classes, but you still have to sign a Personal Responsibility Plan. Mine included filing for child support and showing how I paid my bills, and showing that my baby got her shots and well-baby check-ups. With Families First, if you’re not pregnant you either have to work or attend classes (I hear they offer college classes but I love my job when I can perform it…reallly looking forward to going back to work soon). I think the maximum is sixty months, but I’ve also heard there are exceptions; I guess for folks with disabilities. I think the amount per month goes by the maximum amount you can get paid at a job in some sort of formula with how many people are on it in the household. I am pretty sure it varies state to state, but I’m really no expert on that part. ---
**Author:** ![Carm6773](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/2bfe46/32.png) [@Carm6773](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Carm6773)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2005, 11:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-just-witnessed-food-food-stamp-abuse-wtf/311796/37 "2005-07-11T11:57:22Z")
> [@eleanorigby](#): > > What is this thread about? Are poor people not supposed to consume beer? Who decided that? Are they not entitled to a cold frosty one on a hot summer day because they get government assistance? I have no problem with the poor consuming beer; I just don’t think the govt. should pay for it. > [@](#): > > As for the custom manicure and the sheet cake–you don’t know what this woman’s priorities are. Maybe that cake is all the Bday that kid is having. Maybe they rented out Disneyworld–my point is that you don’t have enough info to make a final judgement. Maybe the manicure is the one luxury the woman allows herself ( I think custom nails are tacky as hell, but that opinion is not shared by all). Who the hell knows or cares? What does FUBU mean? It’s quite obvious what the lady’s priorities are. She appears to have a “beer budget”, but she wants the govt. to give her enough means for her “champagne tastes.” In other words, she either takes the money that she would have spent on food and spends it on luxuries- custom manicure, designer clothes (that’s what FUBU gear is), designer purse, etc; or takes the money and spends it on expensive food- -full sheet cake with picture (which isn’t cheap), lobster, steak, crab legs (which I did mention was part of the Bday celebration), and so on. > [@](#): > > I don’t understand why people get so mad about welfare and the “wasting” of “our tax dollars”–like it would better to have these people begging on the streets? Helping the destitute is the way it should be, and if it was that way I would be happy. Don’t get me wrong, welfare reform under Clinton’s admin went a long way to fix an overly abused system, but there is still work to do. Unfortunately in the current system assistance money is going to fund someone’s luxurious lifestyle and someone else who needs it is being denied. IMHO, this is a wasting of my tax dollars. ---
**Author:** ![Kalhoun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3bc359/32.png) [@Kalhoun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalhoun)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2005, 2:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-just-witnessed-food-food-stamp-abuse-wtf/311796/38 "2005-07-11T14:54:07Z")
> [@EnderWay](#): > > I just watched the clerk at the local Bodega sell someone two > 20 oz. beers. The person used the EBT Benefits card; this > is the electronic version of Food Stamps. > > Fist of all, I couldn’t believe the blatancy of this clerk doing > that right in front of me. You think he would have waited till no one else > was at the counter. > > Secondly, since Food Samp Program is now electronic (Electronic Benefits Transfer aka EBT ), the retailers are given a swipe machine for the cards and entry of the > recpients PIN. So you would think the system would not even allow this > kind of purchase. Shame on you governemt officials …WTF. > > I’ve decided that I’m definatly going to report it. Though I messed up a little. > After the person buying the beer left; I couldn’t help but make a comment to the clerk that I couldn’t believe the system allowed that. He actually said to > me … they do that because they want to make money! Yea, Duh! I tried to cover > my tracks by saying I don’t blame them, if the machine lets > them OK. But the transaction should be rejected through the EBT. > I don’t want them knowing I repoted them. > > I also saw on the On the NYS EBT site http://www.otda.state.ny.us/otda%20internet%20search/ebt/howto.htm > How to Use Your Benefit Card at an Automated Teller Machine (ATM) A little > more the halfway down the page! > > Aww come on now … so now we’re just giving them money to use as they > please with no restrictions. This makes me so hopping mad!! F@\*k You > government officals!! Well, they do give you cash, as food stamps don’t cover things like toilet paper, tooth paste, shampoo, etc. Some people just get food stamps and some people get both. At least I did, back in the 70s when I did a brief stint on the dole. ---
**Author:** ![Kalhoun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3bc359/32.png) [@Kalhoun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalhoun)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2005, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-just-witnessed-food-food-stamp-abuse-wtf/311796/39 "2005-07-11T15:06:06Z")
> [@elfbabe](#): > > Yeah, it’s called “welfare”. It’s been around for a while, I’m surprised you haven’t noticed. > > From [here](http://www.nedap.org/ebt_brochure.html):My guess is that this guy was buying the beer with his cash assistance rather than his food stamps. According to things I’ve heard from cashiers at grocery stores, people often do things like this - buy the bread, milk, cheerios, and vegetables with the food stamp account and then switch to the cash portion to pay for ice cream or some sort of sugary cereal or something else not allowed. > > Really, while it would be theoretically good to make sure people didn’t spend welfare or disability money on frivolous or unhealthy things… who’s going to decide whether each particular product that can possibly be purchased is allowed? What about the exceptions, how are you going to deal with those? If you forbid, say, ice cream, you’ll probably want to make an exception for the family whose kid just got his tonsils out. If you say that people can’t buy tvs, what about those who want to watch the news, or the weather, or job-training videos? If you don’t make exceptions, you encourage people to find ways to cheat the system - either by finding a place that’ll sell them the forbidden items on their food stamp cards or working for cash under the table… and occupations that pay in cash under the table are often ones that the local government wishes to _discourage_, if you know what I mean. If you do make exceptions, you’ll have to put a system in place to investigate and deal with all the requests for exceptions… and employing all of those people is going to cost you a significant amount of money. > > I’d also like to ask… have you ever _been_ poor or so disabled you couldn’t work? It sucks. Unless you have some evidence that this guy is squandering all his money on alcohol when it should be going to feed his kids or something, let the poor bastard have a beer once in a while! You could buy a truckload of Cheetos with the food money if you so desired. At least in Colorado you could. As long as it was food, it was legit. ---
**Author:** ![chaoticbear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f07891/32.png) [@chaoticbear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chaoticbear)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2005, 4:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-just-witnessed-food-food-stamp-abuse-wtf/311796/40 "2005-07-11T16:17:45Z")
Oddly enough, here, you can’t buy energy drinks with EBT food stamps. The computer doesn’t consider it a food item, and we can’t override it to be “foodstampable”. Anyone know why? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-just-witnessed-food-food-stamp-abuse-wtf/311796.md?page=1)