# I like that the light is shining on the racists. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [July 17, 2009, 2:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-like-that-the-light-is-shining-on-the-racists/503337 "2009-07-17T14:21:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 10
**Author:** ![Rigamarole](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/77aa72/32.png) [@Rigamarole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rigamarole)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2009, 8:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-like-that-the-light-is-shining-on-the-racists/503337/181 "2009-08-02T20:22:43Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > What a bunch of bullshit. Her comment wasn’t racist and the Republican complaints were yet another case of white people bitching and moaning that everybody is racist against them Really? So if a white judge said he had the experience of a wise white man able to make better decisions than a Hispanic female judge, that wouldn’t be racist either, right? I really don’t want to side with the Republicans as like I said, it was blown out of proportion and not that big a deal due to her track record being generally good, but it _was_ a racist comment. ---
**Author:** ![Freudian\_Slit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/5daacb/32.png) [@Freudian\_Slit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freudian_Slit)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 4:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-like-that-the-light-is-shining-on-the-racists/503337/182 "2009-08-03T04:52:45Z")
> [@Rigamarole](#): > > Really? So if a white judge said he had the experience of a wise white man able to make better decisions than a Hispanic female judge, that wouldn’t be racist either, right? I think it’s different, though. I’m not saying hers was the most sensitive comment but I think it’s less about Hispanics or non-whites being more talented than non-whites. Just that all other things being equal, a non-white is more sensitive to issues of privilege that a white might take for granted. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 5:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-like-that-the-light-is-shining-on-the-racists/503337/183 "2009-08-03T17:18:07Z")
> [@Rigamarole](#): > > Really? So if a white judge said he had the experience of a wise white man able to make better decisions than a Hispanic female judge, that wouldn’t be racist either, right? Oh, fuck, not this idiotic bullshit again. Read the response I gave or other posters gave any of the 50 goddam times someone on the SDMB attempted to make this rhetorical point. If you make the effort to understand what she is saying, it is clearly not racist. If a white guy said a white men were more experienced with discrimination than Latinas, it wouldn’t be racist, it’d be incomprehensibly stupid. ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-like-that-the-light-is-shining-on-the-racists/503337/184 "2009-08-03T20:18:38Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > Oh, fuck, not this idiotic bullshit again. Read the response I gave or other posters gave any of the 50 goddam times someone on the SDMB attempted to make this rhetorical point. If you make the effort to understand what she is saying, it is clearly not racist. > > If a white guy said a white men were more experienced with discrimination than Latinas, it wouldn’t be racist, it’d be incomprehensibly stupid. Your attempt to sweep the perfect analogy under the rug or declare it idiotic is idiotic. It’s clearly a racist statement. ---
**Author:** ![Freudian\_Slit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/5daacb/32.png) [@Freudian\_Slit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freudian_Slit)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 8:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-like-that-the-light-is-shining-on-the-racists/503337/185 "2009-08-03T20:21:54Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > Your attempt to sweep the perfect analogy under the rug or declare it idiotic is idiotic. It’s clearly a racist statement. How is it necessarily racist? If she meant that Hispanics were inherently smarter or more talented, then, yes. But she means that Hispanics and non-whites have more experience with the lack of privilege. A white person is probably unaware of their privilege as they take it for granted. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-like-that-the-light-is-shining-on-the-racists/503337/186 "2009-08-03T20:25:42Z")
> [@Freudian\_Slit](#): > > How is it necessarily racist? Because **magellan01** can’t understand it. ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-like-that-the-light-is-shining-on-the-racists/503337/187 "2009-08-03T20:33:32Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > Because **magellan01** can’t understand it. Well, since I’m the only one, I guess you can just discount the point. Oh wait, I’m not. Even some people who think she should be confirmed share the opinion that the statement was racist. Sorry to burst your protective little bubble. ---
**Author:** ![BlinkingDuck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/eada6e/32.png) [@BlinkingDuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BlinkingDuck)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-like-that-the-light-is-shining-on-the-racists/503337/188 "2009-08-03T20:40:01Z")
> [@Biggirl](#): > > You, my friend, are a racist piece of shit who I will give the same consideration you give minorities. I will not answer any of your questions unless it is to call you names and make broad generalizations about your attitude. Oh…wow. Biggirl…you did not come off well in that exchange with megallan01. Now, I haven’t followed megallans posts and you may very well be right. However, just in this thread he came up with a reasonable post and you responded like that… Wow. You need to be careful because not everyone knows the history of you two…and from my perspective you have come off looking very unreasonable ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-like-that-the-light-is-shining-on-the-racists/503337/189 "2009-08-03T20:41:08Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > Even some people who think she should be confirmed share the opinion that the statement was racist. So what? Stupid comes in all varieties. That’s a lame-brained appeal to the populace and doesn’t prove the comment was racist. That doesn’t change the fact that [your arguments that the statement was racist have been weak.](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=11351293&post11351293) ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-like-that-the-light-is-shining-on-the-racists/503337/190 "2009-08-03T20:53:14Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > So what? Stupid comes in all varieties. :rolleyes:Oh yeah, well you’re a big fat stupid head. > [@Marley23](#): > > That’s a lame-brained appeal to the populace and doesn’t prove the comment was racist. That doesn’t change the fact that [your arguments that the statement was racist have been weak.](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=11351293&post11351293) No, it’s not. It’s not an appeal to the masses. It’s simply proof that the opinion crosses over ideological lines. Read up on your fallacies, willya? ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-like-that-the-light-is-shining-on-the-racists/503337/191 "2009-08-03T20:58:36Z")
> [@BlinkingDuck](#): > > Biggirl…you did not come off well in that exchange with megallan01. > > You need to be careful because not everyone knows the history of you two… Ha! Including me. We’ve probably crossed paths before, but I don’t recall anything specific, nor the tenor of it. Though I’m pretty sure we disagreed. But that did come as a surprise. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 9:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-like-that-the-light-is-shining-on-the-racists/503337/192 "2009-08-03T21:09:33Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > It’s not an appeal to the masses. It’s simply proof that the opinion crosses over ideological lines. Okay, we’ve now established that you don’t know what _that_ means either. ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-like-that-the-light-is-shining-on-the-racists/503337/193 "2009-08-03T22:15:32Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > Okay, we’ve now established that you don’t know what _that_ means either. Yeah, right. :rolleyes: Translation: you’re wrong and you ain’t got shit to back this up. If so, do. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 10:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-like-that-the-light-is-shining-on-the-racists/503337/194 "2009-08-03T22:33:39Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > Yeah, right. :rolleyes: Translation: you’re wrong and you ain’t got shit to back this up. If so, do. I’ll meet you halfway: you didn’t say “I’m right because everybody agrees with me,” you said “I’m right because lotsa people agree with me.” They’re both worthless arguments with no substance, and I think both qualify as appeals to the people. I backed up my arguments on this topic in plenty of depth in the thread I just linked to. Doesn’t look like they penetrated your carapace and you didn’t seem to have anything to offer in response the last time. (Your first reply was ‘if a white guy said it it would be racist,’ which is where we started over here.) I see nothing this time either, so far. If you’ve got a new point to make, go for it. Otherwise I’d rather not waste my time doing this again, since we’ve already had so many other posters here make the same argument about the same comments - almost all of which rely on "if you pretend someone else said it, it sounds different. " As far as **Rigamarole** ’s earlier point goes, I’m sure he is speaking with the best of intentions, but the post is unfortunate. Aside from the fact that Sotomayor’s comments weren’t racist, it’s foolish to confuse self-interested cries of “Racism!” with actual disapproval of racism. ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-like-that-the-light-is-shining-on-the-racists/503337/195 "2009-08-03T23:16:18Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > I’ll meet you halfway: you didn’t say “I’m right because everybody agrees with me,” you said “I’m right because lotsa people agree with me.” They’re both worthless arguments with no substance, and I think both qualify as appeals to the people. Nope. That’s not what I did. I didn’t even argue that I was right in that exchange. Check Post 188: [QUOTE=Marley23] Originally Posted by Marley23 Because magellan01 can’t understand it. [QUOTE=magellan01] Well, since I’m the only one, I guess you can just discount the point. Oh wait, I’m not. Even some people who think she should be confirmed share the opinion that the statement was racist. Sorry to burst your protective little bubble [/QUOTE] [/QUOTE] Here you sought to answer **Freudian Slit’s** question by offering my—singular—opinion as proof. I simply dispensed with that argument by showing that others held the same opinion. I did not attempt to prove the veracity of my opinion by pointing to others. I then went further and pointed out that the opinion I held was so reasonable that it was also held by people on the other side of the political divide. > [@Marley23](#): > > I backed up my arguments on this topic in plenty of depth in the thread I just linked to. Doesn’t look like they penetrated your carapace and you didn’t seem to have anything to offer in response the last time. (Your first reply was ‘if a white guy said it it would be racist,’ which is where we started over here.) I see nothing this time either, so far. If you’ve got a new point to make, go for it. Otherwise I’d rather not waste my time doing this again, since we’ve already had so many other posters here make the same argument about the same comments - almost all of which rely on "if you pretend someone else said it, it sounds different. " I didn’t post the reasoning here because this thread is about something else. I chimed in because of your ridiculously dismissive tone to **Rigamarole**. Your post didn’t serve anything more then the backhand it was. You want my reasoning, check the other thread. Whether you agree with it or not is up to you. But, fuck, even though I don’t agree with the reasoning you offered there does not equate to you not having offered it. You can’t be serious with this bullshit. > [@Marley23](#): > > As far as **Rigamarole** ’s earlier point goes, I’m sure he is speaking with the best of intentions, but the post is unfortunate. Aside from the fact that Sotomayor’s comments weren’t racist, it’s foolish to confuse self-interested cries of “Racism!” with actual disapproval of racism. Unfortunate? He just disagrees with you. Have you lost your mind? You’re being really strange here, **Marley**. Seriously. It seems uncharacteristic of your posting style as far as I can recall. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2009, 3:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-like-that-the-light-is-shining-on-the-racists/503337/196 "2009-08-04T03:29:24Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > Here you sought to answer **Freudian Slit’s** question by offering my—singular—opinion as proof. I simply dispensed with that argument by showing that others held the same opinion. He didn’t ask why anyone else held that opinion, he asked why you held it. 😉 > [@](#): > > I chimed in because of your ridiculously dismissive tone to **Rigamarole**. Your post didn’t serve anything more then the backhand it was. We’re in the Pit, right? Did I miss something? It’s true that I didn’t have much patience for what **Rigamarole** said. That’s because I felt his contention was ludicrous. He can change my mind if he’s got more to say about it, but that’s how I feel. The controversy over Sotomayor, which was pure political theatre that imparted no information to anyone, was not a blow against racism. It was a waste of time. I don’t think the tight-assed complaining about Joseph Lowery’s inaugural benediction was a blow against racism either. > [@](#): > > You want my reasoning, check the other thread. I talked to you in the other thread and I think you can tell what I think of your reasoning. > [@](#): > > Unfortunate? He just disagrees with you. Have you lost your mind? No, I just think it shows a lack of awareness of what was going on in the Sotomayor furor, which would be unfortunate. And perhaps a lack of awareness of what racism is. This interpretation of progress - it’s good that our society can jump on non-white people for questionable sounding remarks as well as white people - would only allow actual racists more cover to get away with what they do. ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2009, 4:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-like-that-the-light-is-shining-on-the-racists/503337/197 "2009-08-04T04:42:32Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > I talked to you in the other thread and I think you can tell what I think of your reasoning. Likewise. I’m sure what I think of your opinion will cause you as much loss of sleep as yours will of mine. I assure you it can’t be less. > [@Marley23](#): > > No, I just think it shows a lack of awareness of what was going on in the Sotomayor furor, which would be unfortunate. And perhaps a lack of awareness of what racism is. This interpretation of progress - it’s good that our society can jump on non-white people for questionable sounding remarks as well as white people - would only allow actual racists more cover to get away with what they do. Ohhhhhh, so you do have a little agenda here. Well that might explain your overly righteous and shitty attitude. You want to insulate all people of color from any charges of racism so the label can only be applied to whites—to keep them in line. That’s both asinine and disgusting. Either racism is a bad thing and should have have a spotlight put on it so it can be seen for what it is and excised whenever it rears it’s ugly head, or it’s forgivable, as long as you have noble intentions. There’s one problem with that: not everyone will agree on what is noble. By taking this attitude you are no better than a blatant cracker racist with a good enough education to weave a good web of bullshit with Aryan rationale. I have to say I’m glad to get to see the real you. Extremely disappointed, as well. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2009, 5:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-like-that-the-light-is-shining-on-the-racists/503337/198 "2009-08-04T05:17:41Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > Ohhhhhh, so you do have a little agenda here. You’re either making things up or having a serious reading comprehension failure. I guess the more charitable interpretation is the second one. ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2009, 5:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-like-that-the-light-is-shining-on-the-racists/503337/199 "2009-08-04T05:28:37Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > You’re either making things up or having a serious reading comprehension failure. I guess the more charitable interpretation is the second one. Well, that’s what I got from this: > [@](#): > > This interpretation of progress - it’s good that our society can jump on non-white people for questionable sounding remarks as well as white people - would only allow actual racists more cover to get away with what they do. If I was wrong, good. But I think that is what is contained in these words. If there is another explanation, I;m glad to hear it. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2009, 5:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-like-that-the-light-is-shining-on-the-racists/503337/200 "2009-08-04T05:33:32Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > But I think that is what is contained in these words. For starters you’d have to explain why I am trying to keep myself in line. :rolleyes: I was saying that attacking people for _questionable sounding remarks_, rather than legitimately racist deeds or statements, is a waste of time. Thus it’s not a measure of progress that people got on Sotomayor’s case, particularly since many of the people who were up in arms over her statement were just wrangling for political advantage. There’s no point in jumping on white people for statements that sound bad but are non-racist, and there’s no point in jumping on nonwhite people for it either. The ‘wise Latina’ thing wasn’t a marker of racial progress, it was a sign that some white voters (largely conservatives I guess) continue to be scared that people of color are taking over and are out for payback. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-like-that-the-light-is-shining-on-the-racists/503337.md?page=9) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-like-that-the-light-is-shining-on-the-racists/503337.md?page=11)