# I Like the Monkees better than the Beatles, and I don't care who knows it! **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [April 21, 2017, 10:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-like-the-monkees-better-than-the-beatles-and-i-dont-care-who-knows-it/784949 "2017-04-21T22:17:09Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2017, 3:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-like-the-monkees-better-than-the-beatles-and-i-dont-care-who-knows-it/784949/21 "2017-04-22T15:15:08Z")
> [@The\_Stafford\_Cripps](#): > > I don’t think the Beatles really tried to lift your mood much, and I wonder if the Beach Boys actually influenced the Monkees more. It’s interesting that the Beatles songs you like are ones which (while good, and the lyrics of Eleanor Rigby being outstanding) I would class as being amongst their less interesting work. Actually, what jumped out at me about the Beatles songs the OP mentioned was that they were all chosen from among their more… what’s the word I want? somber? songs. If the OP values the Monkees for being bouncy and poppy and able to lift his/her mood, it seems only fair to compare the Beatles’ songs that at least try to do the same thing. ---
**Author:** ![davidm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidm/32/225_2.png) [@davidm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davidm)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2017, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-like-the-monkees-better-than-the-beatles-and-i-dont-care-who-knows-it/784949/22 "2017-04-22T16:06:20Z")
> [@Two\_Many\_Cats](#): > > … > I like the Monkees better. And I always will. 🆒🆒🆒🆒 You have too many cats. 🙂 [![]( " - YouTube") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v72H7YRzOEg) ---
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2017, 5:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-like-the-monkees-better-than-the-beatles-and-i-dont-care-who-knows-it/784949/23 "2017-04-22T17:09:16Z")
I’ll just leave this here - Take the last train to Clarksville and I’ll meet you at the station… You hear it don’t you. Gonna be a long weekend. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![The\_Stafford\_Cripps](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_stafford_cripps/32/7167_2.png) [@The\_Stafford\_Cripps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Stafford_Cripps)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2017, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-like-the-monkees-better-than-the-beatles-and-i-dont-care-who-knows-it/784949/24 "2017-04-22T17:46:34Z")
Yes, Thudlow Boink, that’s pretty much what I was trying to say, though right now I can’t think of any Lennon or McCartney songs that are truly joyful in the Monkees way. Horny, yes, but not bright in spirit. ---
**Author:** ![drad\_dog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/aeb1de/32.png) [@drad\_dog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drad_dog)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2017, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-like-the-monkees-better-than-the-beatles-and-i-dont-care-who-knows-it/784949/25 "2017-04-22T18:12:39Z")
> [@The\_Stafford\_Cripps](#): > > Yes, Thudlow Boink, that’s pretty much what I was trying to say, though right now I can’t think of any Lennon or McCartney songs that are truly joyful in the Monkees way. Horny, yes, but not bright in spirit. Well aside from the fact that what they were specifically known for was creating a joyous, bright and spirited sound that reverberated to every corner of the globe and is the mommy and daddy of everything you know as popular music, well, you have a point? I think the very fact that you can see the beatles as “not joyful” is a function of how drastically they affected the world of pop to come after them. I love the monkees, but why would they be more “joyful”? Prefab joy? Are we talking about any song in particular? Is it that The Beatles didn’t have a laugh track? ---
**Author:** ![Dendarii\_Dame](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/bbce88/32.png) [@Dendarii\_Dame](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dendarii_Dame)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2017, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-like-the-monkees-better-than-the-beatles-and-i-dont-care-who-knows-it/784949/26 "2017-04-22T20:06:19Z")
I prefer the Monkees too. ---
**Author:** ![cochrane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cochrane/32/10441_2.png) [@cochrane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cochrane)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2017, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-like-the-monkees-better-than-the-beatles-and-i-dont-care-who-knows-it/784949/27 "2017-04-22T20:40:24Z")
> [@enipla](#): > > I’ll just leave this here - > > Take the last train to Clarksville and I’ll meet you at the station… > > You hear it don’t you. Gonna be a long weekend. 😃 I’ll see your last train to Clarksville and raise you this: It’s another Pleasant Valley Sunday, out here in status symbol land. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![El\_Kabong](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/el_kabong/32/496_2.png) [@El\_Kabong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Kabong)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2017, 12:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-like-the-monkees-better-than-the-beatles-and-i-dont-care-who-knows-it/784949/28 "2017-04-23T00:00:21Z")
> [@cochrane](#): > > I’ll see your last train to Clarksville and raise you this: > > It’s another Pleasant Valley Sunday, out here in status symbol land. 😃 Yeah? Well, I’m not your steppin’ stone. ---
**Author:** ![DSYoungEsq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c6cbf5/32.png) [@DSYoungEsq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSYoungEsq)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2017, 2:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-like-the-monkees-better-than-the-beatles-and-i-dont-care-who-knows-it/784949/29 "2017-04-23T02:25:56Z")
The Monkees were a very good group. They were not better than the Beatles. But I enjoy their music. I guess I just wanna be free (to disagree). ---
**Author:** ![blondebear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blondebear/32/1022_2.png) [@blondebear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blondebear)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2017, 4:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-like-the-monkees-better-than-the-beatles-and-i-dont-care-who-knows-it/784949/30 "2017-04-23T04:49:24Z")
The Monkees put out a pretty decent album last year, “Good Times”. It has one of my absolute favorite Monkees tunes [Me And Magdelena](https://youtu.be/WSOQyR7psSo), which Rolling Stone called one of the best songs of 2016. ---
**Author:** ![Enuma\_Elish](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5e9695/32.png) [@Enuma\_Elish](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Enuma_Elish)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2017, 8:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-like-the-monkees-better-than-the-beatles-and-i-dont-care-who-knows-it/784949/31 "2017-04-23T08:27:02Z")
I think **The Stafford Cripps** had a good idea that got lost in this thread. There is a difference between ‘dancing music’ and ‘listening music’. The Monkeys made quite a few songs that are danceable … The Beatles made songs that demanded to be heard, but when was the last time anyone heard a Beatles song and was inspired to get off their duff and move to the music? **Disclaimer:** I am currently listening to the 'world’s largest trivia contest from 90FM WWSP in Stevens Point, WI. I used to try to make an effort to answer the questions, but over the years, I realized it was the old-timey danceable music they play between clues that I loved. I love the Beatles, but the older I get, I love music that ‘makes my pants want to get up and dance’. ---
**Author:** ![Spoons](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spoons/32/3141_2.png) [@Spoons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoons)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2017, 11:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-like-the-monkees-better-than-the-beatles-and-i-dont-care-who-knows-it/784949/32 "2017-04-23T11:41:02Z")
> [@cochrane](#): > > I’ll see your last train to Clarksville and raise you this: > > It’s another Pleasant Valley Sunday, out here in status symbol land. 😃 “People complain about how hard life is, and the kids just don’t understand.” I like both, and I’m unsure why I need to make a choice. ---
**Author:** ![DSYoungEsq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c6cbf5/32.png) [@DSYoungEsq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSYoungEsq)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2017, 3:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-like-the-monkees-better-than-the-beatles-and-i-dont-care-who-knows-it/784949/33 "2017-04-23T15:10:28Z")
I don’t see the Monkees as primarily making “danceable” music, more so than The Beatles. “Last Train to Clarksville” is one of the Monkees most well-known songs, and it’s not something that gets you up and dancing. It’s a great anti-war song that makes me cry. Nor do I generally get up and boogie to “Daydream Believer”, another well-known Monkees song. Since both of those are prominent in my iTunes, I guess that shows what kind of Monkees music I like. I’ve also reference another Monkees song I like in a prior post. I suppose that’s a “slow dance” song from the old days, but I don’t exactly get up out of my chair to slow dance with myself in my dotage. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![The\_Stafford\_Cripps](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_stafford_cripps/32/7167_2.png) [@The\_Stafford\_Cripps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Stafford_Cripps)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2017, 4:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-like-the-monkees-better-than-the-beatles-and-i-dont-care-who-knows-it/784949/34 "2017-04-23T16:08:45Z")
> [@drad\_dog](#): > > I love the monkees, but why would they be more “joyful”? Prefab joy? Are we talking about any song in particular? Is it that The Beatles didn’t have a laugh track? It’s the central premise of the opening post. I agree with it. Monkees songs are joyful in a way which Beatles songs are not. Beatles songs contains lots of emotion, but nobody’s responded to my comment with any examples of Beatles songs that show unalloyed joy and positivity. Both Lennon and McCartney lost their mothers as teenagers and I would say that the pain shows in their music. ---
**Author:** ![davidm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidm/32/225_2.png) [@davidm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davidm)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2017, 4:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-like-the-monkees-better-than-the-beatles-and-i-dont-care-who-knows-it/784949/35 "2017-04-23T16:52:34Z")
I can think of “joyous” Beatles songs. “I Wanna Hold Your Hand”, “Lovely Rita”, “Penny Lane”, “Her Majesty”, “Birthday”, “Sgt. Pepper’s Lonely Hearts Club Band”, “When I’m Sixty-Four”, and those are just a few examples. The Beatles are being unfairly penalized on the joyous scale in this discussion because they did a large mix that included both joyous and non-joyous while the Monkees’ catalog is nearly all joyous. ---
**Author:** ![drad\_dog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/aeb1de/32.png) [@drad\_dog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drad_dog)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2017, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-like-the-monkees-better-than-the-beatles-and-i-dont-care-who-knows-it/784949/36 "2017-04-23T17:14:19Z")
The Beatles are penalized for being geniuses, making intriguing sounds that have to be heard, and being FIRST. The ironic thing is that they are known as a band who opened up the whole world to joy, more than any other act in history: their joy at making their music. Read any old journalism about them, and you’ll see it. Pay attention to the keening high end background vocals of Paul on “It won’t be long” for one example. They struck some kind of chord and it wasn’t dour or melancholy. It did have some pain deep down inside. You want art that doesn’t? Not sure what the big dance numbers of the monkees were, but then I just dance to anything I like and sit out the rest. I do agree that the beatles priority wasn’t “dance” but it didn’t need to be. All of their imitators were doing that. They were thinking bigger and had the genius to do it. But aren’t “I’m Down” and I Wanna Be Your Man (Remember the disco scene in Hard Days Night?) floor shakers? ---
**Author:** ![The\_Stafford\_Cripps](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_stafford_cripps/32/7167_2.png) [@The\_Stafford\_Cripps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Stafford_Cripps)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2017, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-like-the-monkees-better-than-the-beatles-and-i-dont-care-who-knows-it/784949/37 "2017-04-23T17:22:50Z")
The Beatles aren’t being ‘penalised’. They’re one of my favourite bands. They bring joy, but not through joyful music. Obviously joy is very subjective and I’m not going to argue with your choices, davidm. However I did consider ‘I Wanna Hold Your Hand’ - I still think there is something in the harmonies and chords which transcends everyday emotions, likewise with ‘Penny Lane’. That’s why they were such a great band. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2017, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-like-the-monkees-better-than-the-beatles-and-i-dont-care-who-knows-it/784949/38 "2017-04-23T17:30:51Z")
> [@davidm](#): > > I can think of “joyous” Beatles songs. “I Wanna Hold Your Hand”, “Lovely Rita”, “Penny Lane”, “Her Majesty”, “Birthday”, “Sgt. Pepper’s Lonely Hearts Club Band”, “When I’m Sixty-Four”, and those are just a few examples. The first one I thought of was “Good Day Sunshine”; but “Penny Lane” and “Sgt. Pepper’s Lonely Hearts Club Band” (which is sort of like their “Hey Hey We’re the Monkees”) and others soon followed. > [@drad\_dog](#): > > The Beatles are penalized for being geniuses, making intriguing sounds that have to be heard, and being FIRST. Notice that the OP never attempted to claim that the Monkees were _better_ than the Beatles, just that he/she _likes/enjoys_ them more. Which is perfectly okay. In fact, the things you mention don’t necessarily contribute to how much pleasure and enjoyment a person gets out of an artist’s work. (In the case of the Beatles, I personally think they do, but not everyone has to feel the same way.) ---
**Author:** ![Two\_Many\_Cats](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8dc957/32.png) [@Two\_Many\_Cats](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Two_Many_Cats)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2017, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-like-the-monkees-better-than-the-beatles-and-i-dont-care-who-knows-it/784949/39 "2017-04-23T17:50:42Z")
Above somewhere, someone thought it strange that I would list somber Beatles songs to compare to Monkees joyous songs. The comparison I made was between Monkees and Beatles songs that I liked. I don’t really like any so called “happy” Beatles songs. I guess the closest happy Beatles song I like is _Yellow Submarine_, and that’s really only because my best friend and I used to parody that one a lot. ---
**Author:** ![drad\_dog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/aeb1de/32.png) [@drad\_dog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drad_dog)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2017, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-like-the-monkees-better-than-the-beatles-and-i-dont-care-who-knows-it/784949/40 "2017-04-23T17:57:54Z")
> [@Thudlow\_Boink](#): > > The first one I thought of was “Good Day Sunshine”; but “Penny Lane” and “Sgt. Pepper’s Lonely Hearts Club Band” (which is sort of like their “Hey Hey We’re the Monkees”) and others soon followed. > > Notice that the OP never attempted to claim that the Monkees were _better_ than the Beatles, just that he/she _likes/enjoys_ them more. > > Which is perfectly okay. > > In fact, the things you mention don’t necessarily contribute to how much pleasure and enjoyment a person gets out of an artist’s work. (In the case of the Beatles, I personally think they do, but not everyone has to feel the same way.) I was only responding to “They aren’t as joyous or danceable,” not their priority in anyone’s heart. My feeling is that to criticize the band that made “A day in the life”, “strawberry fields”, “tomorrow never knows”, “Abbey road medley” etc etc., for not being danceable or joyous is a little myopic. I don’t follow what it was that I mentioned that “contributes to pleasure.” How would I know that? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-like-the-monkees-better-than-the-beatles-and-i-dont-care-who-knows-it/784949.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-like-the-monkees-better-than-the-beatles-and-i-dont-care-who-knows-it/784949.md?page=3)