# I live in the US, but I don't vote. Never have, never will. Ask Me Anything if you want. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [November 8, 2016, 1:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-live-in-the-us-but-i-dont-vote-never-have-never-will-ask-me-anything-if-you-want/771059 "2016-11-08T13:49:06Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 10
**Author:** ![Idle\_Thoughts](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/838e76/32.png) [@Idle\_Thoughts](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Idle_Thoughts)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2016, 10:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-live-in-the-us-but-i-dont-vote-never-have-never-will-ask-me-anything-if-you-want/771059/181 "2016-11-08T22:43:44Z")
> [@Buck\_Godot](#): > > Why do you recycle? I can guarantee you one aluminum can more or less in the land fill won’t make a lick of difference, yet you feel the need to make this effort. Why? Well, see, that’s something I actually care about. > [@kambuckta](#): > > Interesting, if saddening thread. > > **Idle Thoughts** , given that you have chosen to not vote, would you extend that choice to every other person in a ‘democracy’? And if that were the case, and everyone refrained from voting, would you be comfortable living in a dictatorship? > > See, if politics (etc) holds zero interest for you, you shouldn’t care what style of government you live under. And further, no matter how evil/despotic/malign your dictator, it wouldn’t matter to you at all…is that right? Again, there is no connection between “not caring to vote” and “not caring if the country was run by someone like Hitler”. ---
**Author:** ![Zeke\_N.Destroi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/4af34b/32.png) [@Zeke\_N.Destroi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeke_N.Destroi)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2016, 10:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-live-in-the-us-but-i-dont-vote-never-have-never-will-ask-me-anything-if-you-want/771059/182 "2016-11-08T22:50:07Z")
> [@grayhairedmomma](#): > > For me, it is important for everyone who can vote to do so, because I want to know what the true level of support is for a particular viewpoint or issue. When people don’t vote, it’s hard to know whether support for something is lukewarm, middling, or strong. Then look the percentage of the enfranchised that don’t exercise it and see that as an indication of support (or lack thereof) for the system itself. Not acting is in fact an action. > [@](#): > > For example, in the last few election cycles, the Tea Party was able to gain a substantial foothold in the Republican party, IMO because a lot of moderate Republicans stayed home and didn’t vote in local elections - believing like the OP that their vote wouldn’t make a difference. I think it is more likely that they were complacent enough to believe that that faction couldn’t gain enough support to matter and so, rather than their vote not counting, their vote wasn’t needed. I believe that is why Trump is the candidate now. People who care thinking there is no need to act and being proven laughably wrong. They didn’t learn their lesson the first couple of times and now they see the result of it. I’ll bet that the next cycle sees those people rise off of their asses in order to correct the mistakes that complacency (not apathy) created. > [@](#): > > Also, IMO, when you don’t come out and vote (whatever side you’re on) you’re encouraging the polarization of politics. Well that follows as day does the orange. By not supporting any party you encourage those who do to become even less reasonable? > [@](#): > > If everyone who could vote did so, maybe it would be easier to get a third party off the ground. And this is, by definition, good because…? Look at UKIP. > [@](#): > > If during this election in particular, 100% of eligible voters voted, then it would be okay for a certain percentage of people to vote for Stein and Johnson, without the fear that Trump/Clinton will lose because of it. Then we could actually start to talk about the views that Stein and Johnson espouse and what it is about them that is attractive to a substantial portion of the population. So what is stopping a substantial portion of the population from voting for them now? If the attraction is to such a substantial segment of the population then they should make a really good showing. They won’t though because your system is designed so that you have one of two meaningful choices and then protest candidates. That is the reality. Once your country is prepared to accept 3rd party candidates then they will start making a meaningful showing. This acceptance will be shown in the poll results. If those who cared but don’t participate could be made to participate by simply being given an alternative then you’d see a bazillion votes for legitimate 3rd partiers but you don’t because they can’t be. ---
**Author:** ![Larry\_Borgia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/larry_borgia/32/156_2.png) [@Larry\_Borgia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Borgia)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2016, 10:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-live-in-the-us-but-i-dont-vote-never-have-never-will-ask-me-anything-if-you-want/771059/183 "2016-11-08T22:51:21Z")
> [@Idle\_Thoughts](#): > > Well, see, that’s something I actually care about. > > Again, there is no connection between “not caring to vote” and “not caring if the country was run by someone like Hitler”. You know there is an actual fascist running this year, right? ---
**Author:** ![monstro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@monstro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monstro)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2016, 10:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-live-in-the-us-but-i-dont-vote-never-have-never-will-ask-me-anything-if-you-want/771059/184 "2016-11-08T22:56:49Z")
> [@VinylTurnip](#): > > I don’t even care whether he votes. A lot of people don’t. But why is it threadworthy? Why do posters create threads to announce that they’re ignorant and like it that way? Or to boast about some asshole thing they did, like stiffing a delivery driver for some petty non-reason? Not everything needs to be shared; in fact, quite the opposite. > > For example: the other day I was pissing at a urinal and the end of my belt slipped down and got splashed with urine. I had to rinse it off in the sink, hoping nobody would walk in and see me. Did I come here to tell everyone about it? NO! I mean, not until now… I’m peeing on myself right now reading this! ---
**Author:** ![Zeke\_N.Destroi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/4af34b/32.png) [@Zeke\_N.Destroi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeke_N.Destroi)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2016, 10:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-live-in-the-us-but-i-dont-vote-never-have-never-will-ask-me-anything-if-you-want/771059/185 "2016-11-08T22:57:17Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > Just because a reason doesn’t apply to you doesn’t mean it doesn’t apply to anyone else. You should put that on a t-shirt or something. You fucking nipple-slip. I’ll point out that your logic (work and sacrifice equals appreciation and lack of the former means lack of the latter) has been used since time immemorial to deny assistance to the less privileged. Wrong-headed self-affirming horseshit _you pug, you knob, you button head_ \<– thank-you Rostand ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2016, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-live-in-the-us-but-i-dont-vote-never-have-never-will-ask-me-anything-if-you-want/771059/186 "2016-11-08T22:59:41Z")
> [@Zeke\_N.Destroi](#): > > You should put that on a t-shirt or something. You fucking nipple-slip. > > I’ll point out that your logic (work and sacrifice equals appreciation and lack of the former means lack of the latter) has been used since time immemorial to deny assistance to the less privileged. > > Wrong-headed self-affirming horseshit _you pug, you knob, you button head_ \<– thank-you Rostand Oh noes! A nipple slip. What is this insult time on the short bus? It takes real work to appear as stupid as you are. If you honestly think that some people don’t value what is freely given you must be living under a rock. I knew the education system was somewhat shitty I didn’t know we have regressed this badly as a nation that a supposed adult can’t parse simple sentences with simple contingencies. ---
**Author:** ![Baker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/bb73d2/32.png) [@Baker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baker)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2016, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-live-in-the-us-but-i-dont-vote-never-have-never-will-ask-me-anything-if-you-want/771059/187 "2016-11-08T22:59:53Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > What-s the connection to OP? > [INDENT]“The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing.”[/INDENT][INDENT][INDENT][INDENT][INDENT] - Edmund Burke[/INDENT][/INDENT][/INDENT][/INDENT] You are assuming that the OP is a good man. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2016, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-live-in-the-us-but-i-dont-vote-never-have-never-will-ask-me-anything-if-you-want/771059/188 "2016-11-08T23:04:23Z")
> [@Skywatcher](#): > > Now I vote every four years. Well, wait a sec. Your congressman and all the applicable state and local positions are far more likely to have an effect on your life than who the president is. If anything, you should take your midterm (and possibly annual) small-scale votes more seriously and if you’re indifferent to anything, it should be to the presidency. ---
**Author:** ![IvoryTowerDenizen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ivorytowerdenizen/32/17937_2.png) [@IvoryTowerDenizen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/IvoryTowerDenizen)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2016, 11:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-live-in-the-us-but-i-dont-vote-never-have-never-will-ask-me-anything-if-you-want/771059/189 "2016-11-08T23:09:58Z")
> [@Zeke\_N.Destroi](#): > > Where do you get off being “disappointed in” anyone that isn’t your kid, partner or friend? > > Disappointed **that** people don’t vote is different and perfectly fair but “disappointed in” assumes that you have the right to cast judgement upon them. > > Do you? If so then from where does that right derive precisely? Just as I can be proud of someone who achieves something, I can be disappointed in someone who does something that goes against my personal value system. My right to feel anything certainly doesn’t come from you or anyone else. I own it as an independent minded person. So, yeah I am disappoint IN someone who behaves this way and I am disappoint THAT someone behaves that way, regardless of whether you think I’m entitled to it or not. ---
**Author:** ![mlees](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba8739/32.png) [@mlees](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mlees)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2016, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-live-in-the-us-but-i-dont-vote-never-have-never-will-ask-me-anything-if-you-want/771059/190 "2016-11-08T23:16:11Z")
> [@panache45](#): > > Seriously, how in hell did you get to be a Mod, in a site dedicated to fighting ignorance? Apparently, their standards, if any, are at an all-time low. You are beneath contempt. You think there was some kind of exam? ---
**Author:** ![Zeke\_N.Destroi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/4af34b/32.png) [@Zeke\_N.Destroi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeke_N.Destroi)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2016, 11:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-live-in-the-us-but-i-dont-vote-never-have-never-will-ask-me-anything-if-you-want/771059/191 "2016-11-08T23:17:25Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > Oh noes! A nipple slip. What is this insult time on the short bus? > > It takes real work to appear as stupid as you are. If you honestly think that some people don’t value what is freely given you must be living under a rock. > > I knew the education system was somewhat shitty I didn’t know we have regressed this badly as a nation that a supposed adult can’t parse simple sentences with simple contingencies. Appearing to be as stupid as me is no effort at all. It comes naturally to me. Actually being as stupid as you appear would require more than Herculean effort. And I’ll have you know that I come from a province (that means a place not in your country) that ranks consistently below average in my country and still comes out well above the average of the system you came from. Holy fuck, a yank criticising someone else’s schools. Lemme guess, you were a “no kid left behind” weren’t ya? Or maybe your system couldn’t afford the “short bus” so you could get to school and if it was provided none of you would appreciate it. Though you might be able to spell appreciate without spell check And if you honestly think I meant that NO ONE who gets free shit blows it then you are dumber than you think I am. I merely said that the idea that NO ONE who gets free shit (ie no sacrifice or work) can appreciate it has been used to continue oppressing the oppressed since time immemorial. It’s almost like I said exactly that. ---
**Author:** ![monstro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@monstro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monstro)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2016, 11:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-live-in-the-us-but-i-dont-vote-never-have-never-will-ask-me-anything-if-you-want/771059/192 "2016-11-08T23:19:50Z")
All I got to say to **Idle Thoughts** … It must be nice. It must be nice to have such a comfortable carefree existence that “politics” is a mere abstraction. It must be nice to never worry about your rights being curtailed or the gains made by earlier generations being dismantled. It must be nice to not have to worry about skyrocketing housing costs, insurance premiums, and utility bills. Must be nice to only have to worry about the inappropriateness of your mother going trick-or-treating. Other people have to worry about their own trick-or-treaters being searched-and-frisked because they fit the “profile”. Must be so nice to have such a simple life where this is an abstraction. If all that was hanging in the balance for this current election was, say, trade policy or what we should do with ISIS, I could totally understand being apathetic. Those are things that feel “abstract” to me. But civil rights–my own and those of others–are the opposite of an abstraction. So is healthcare. If you were apathetic about everything, I’d have enormous empathy for you because it would indicate that you are suffering from mental illness. But apathy resulting from willful ignorance is intolerable to me. People who intentionally blind themselves to current events are always the ones who are caught by surprise when the shit starts coming down. They are the first ones begging for help from those of us who have been paying attention all along. I don’t care if you ever vote. But at the very least, you can stay informed well enough to know when your vote really matters. It really isn’t that hard to do in this day and age. ---
**Author:** ![Zeke\_N.Destroi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/4af34b/32.png) [@Zeke\_N.Destroi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeke_N.Destroi)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2016, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-live-in-the-us-but-i-dont-vote-never-have-never-will-ask-me-anything-if-you-want/771059/193 "2016-11-08T23:22:01Z")
> [@IvoryTowerDenizen](#): > > Just as I can be proud of someone who achieves something, I can be disappointed in someone who does something that goes against my personal value system. My right to feel anything certainly doesn’t come from you or anyone else. I own it as an independent minded person. > > So, yeah I am disappoint IN someone who behaves this way and I am disappoint THAT someone behaves that way, regardless of whether you think I’m entitled to it or not. And that right there is some nuclear grade patronizing bullshit. I wish I was so fond of myself that I felt it was my place to dish out praise or opprobrium upon the entirety of my benighted species. Oh to attain such heights. I bask… I bask. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2016, 11:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-live-in-the-us-but-i-dont-vote-never-have-never-will-ask-me-anything-if-you-want/771059/194 "2016-11-08T23:40:06Z")
> [@Zeke\_N.Destroi](#): > > Appearing to be as stupid as me is no effort at all. It comes naturally to me. Actually being as stupid as you appear would require more than Herculean effort. > > And I’ll have you know that I come from a province (that means a place not in your country) that ranks consistently below average in my country and still comes out well above the average of the system you came from. > > Holy fuck, a yank criticising someone else’s schools. Lemme guess, you were a “no kid left behind” weren’t ya? Or maybe your system couldn’t afford the “short bus” so you could get to school and if it was provided none of you would appreciate it. Though you might be able to spell appreciate without spell check > > And if you honestly think I meant that NO ONE who gets free shit blows it then you are dumber than you think I am. I merely said that the idea that NO ONE who gets free shit (ie no sacrifice or work) can appreciate it has been used to continue oppressing the oppressed since time immemorial. > > It’s almost like I said exactly that. Well no one said what you were responding to. That poor straw man. ---
**Author:** ![IvoryTowerDenizen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ivorytowerdenizen/32/17937_2.png) [@IvoryTowerDenizen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/IvoryTowerDenizen)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2016, 11:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-live-in-the-us-but-i-dont-vote-never-have-never-will-ask-me-anything-if-you-want/771059/195 "2016-11-08T23:40:59Z")
> [@Zeke\_N.Destroi](#): > > And that right there is some nuclear grade patronizing bullshit. I wish I was so fond of myself that I felt it was my place to dish out praise or opprobrium upon the entirety of my benighted species. > > Oh to attain such heights. I bask… I bask. Meh. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2016, 11:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-live-in-the-us-but-i-dont-vote-never-have-never-will-ask-me-anything-if-you-want/771059/196 "2016-11-08T23:45:23Z")
Because it seems relevant, I will share my own experience of voting today. I havealways voted, in every election since I was eligible. As the election season unrolled this year, some of you may know that although I am not a fan of Mrs. Clinton, and believe her presidency will be a horrible one, I had nonetheless resolved to support over her main opponent, whose presidency I believe would be a more horrible one. So I got my ballot and sat down. In my jurisdiction, we are handed paper ballots, mark them, and then they are ingested by a scanner. I started to mark the ballot. I couldn’t. I passed over the presidential electors, marked my choice for US Representative, chose my options for various bond issues… and then stared at the president’s choice again. Finally I marked it for Trump. I couldn’t vote for Clinton. I stood up and walked towards the scanner… and then I couldn’t put it in the scanner; I couldn’t vote for Trump. I marked my ballot VOID and requested a new one. Sat back down. Filled out all the other spots again. Finally I marked Clinton, stood up again. Sent the ballot into the scanner before I could change my mind again. Outside some guy named Buridan had a donkey for sale. The point of this little oversharing is to suggest that it’s not always irrational to refuse to vote. ---
**Author:** ![Idle\_Thoughts](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/838e76/32.png) [@Idle\_Thoughts](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Idle_Thoughts)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2016, 11:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-live-in-the-us-but-i-dont-vote-never-have-never-will-ask-me-anything-if-you-want/771059/197 "2016-11-08T23:48:55Z")
> [@monstro](#): > > If you were apathetic about everything, I’d have enormous empathy for you because it would indicate that you are suffering from mental illness. For what it’s worth, I am apathetic about pretty much everything. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2016, 11:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-live-in-the-us-but-i-dont-vote-never-have-never-will-ask-me-anything-if-you-want/771059/198 "2016-11-08T23:49:58Z")
So you voted twice? Voter fraud!! 😉 Sent from my LG-H830 using Tapatalk ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2016, 11:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-live-in-the-us-but-i-dont-vote-never-have-never-will-ask-me-anything-if-you-want/771059/199 "2016-11-08T23:50:08Z")
> [@Idle\_Thoughts](#): > > Well, see, that [recycling] something I actually care about. So you dutifully put all your recyclables in the bin, put them on the curb, and feel you’ve done your job. Good for you. Do you realize that politics is the ONLY thing that ensures this happens? Without the right laws being made and enforced, the city could simply take your virtuous recycling bin and dump it on a vacant lot in a poor neighborhood. Politics is literally the ONLY thing that determines the thing that you care about (sorry for yelling twice). ---
**Author:** ![Bullitt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bullitt/32/5725_2.png) [@Bullitt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bullitt)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2016, 12:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-live-in-the-us-but-i-dont-vote-never-have-never-will-ask-me-anything-if-you-want/771059/200 "2016-11-09T00:02:59Z")
> [@Morgenstern](#): > > This election cycle you’ve swung on Trump’s nut sack while most of us just laughed at you. That laughter will get real loud around midnight tonight. You’ll be here, right? At times I’ve been strongly for Trump, and at other times I’ve shaken my head at his buffoonery and wasn’t sure if I’d vote for him. In the end I did because IMHO he’s the much better option. So yes, if Clinton wins I will be here and take it standing up. If she becomes the President, then she becomes my President. Just like Obama was, though I never voted for him. If Trump wins will you be here? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-live-in-the-us-but-i-dont-vote-never-have-never-will-ask-me-anything-if-you-want/771059.md?page=9) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-live-in-the-us-but-i-dont-vote-never-have-never-will-ask-me-anything-if-you-want/771059.md?page=11)