# I lost my fire arm collection **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [January 10, 2013, 1:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-lost-my-fire-arm-collection/646738 "2013-01-10T13:03:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 16\ **Page:** 11
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2013, 12:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-lost-my-fire-arm-collection/646738/201 "2013-01-25T00:59:07Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > the one in which criminal laws are passed making the owner of a stolen gun criminally liable somehow if he fails to lock his gun in a safe. That is ridiculous. What if someone steals my shotgun at deer camp? What if someone breaks into the house when I’m cleaning a gun? ---
**Author:** ![scootergirl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e99b99/32.png) [@scootergirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scootergirl)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2013, 1:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-lost-my-fire-arm-collection/646738/202 "2013-01-25T01:02:31Z")
Being that I have ice fished in the middle of Kensington Lake in Michigan, I find it hard to believe that you ( a grown adult) were able to walk to the middle of the lake (without being swallowed by it) and then when you returned the guns were gone?! Your weight is obviously more than the guns, and if the ice supported you while you walked out there and placed them (WHY? :smack:) on the ice, then how is it that it wasn’t able to support them?! Weird…:dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2013, 1:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-lost-my-fire-arm-collection/646738/203 "2013-01-25T01:17:00Z")
> [@Oakminster](#): > > Because it’s not our fucking problem. > [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > Then we will make it your problem. Secure your weapon, or go to jail. Simple choice. Bold words. > [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > I’ll bet there is already a gold star on that date in your DayRunner. Not so bold, trying to turn the discussion away from actual admission that your previous bold words were empty bullshit. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2013, 1:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-lost-my-fire-arm-collection/646738/204 "2013-01-25T01:36:02Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Not so bold, trying to turn the discussion away from actual admission that your previous bold words were empty bullshit. But how does that make you feel? Let it out, **Bricker** , let it out. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2013, 4:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-lost-my-fire-arm-collection/646738/205 "2013-01-25T04:14:24Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > But how does that make you feel? Let it out, **Bricker** , let it out. Happy. It makes me warmly content that ideas such as yours are viable only in heads such as yours, and not in the real world. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2013, 4:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-lost-my-fire-arm-collection/646738/206 "2013-01-25T04:30:10Z")
So, when the guys who tried to mug my wife at gun point finally figure out that they would do better without a witness, I’m going to defend our lives with what, a popsickle stick? 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/i_love_me_vol.i/32/521_2.png) [@I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/I_Love_Me_Vol.I)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2013, 5:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-lost-my-fire-arm-collection/646738/207 "2013-01-25T05:10:27Z")
> [@Oakminster](#): > > It’s a blatantly obvious joke, and one that has been used in multiple threads on this very board by several people, including me. Not so obvious to normal people, really. It sort of shot right past me. Guess some of us were barreled over by it. But I guess you gun folk are of a different stock. ---
**Author:** ![Oakminster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/77aa72/32.png) [@Oakminster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oakminster)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2013, 5:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-lost-my-fire-arm-collection/646738/208 "2013-01-25T05:16:13Z")
> [@I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](#): > > Not so obvious to normal people, really. It sort of shot right past me. Guess some of us were barreled over by it. But I guess you gun folk are of a different stock. Methinks we need stricter pun control. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Willcross](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b2d939/32.png) [@Willcross](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Willcross)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2013, 6:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-lost-my-fire-arm-collection/646738/209 "2013-01-25T06:42:41Z")
Who comes into the home and checks to make sure the guns are secure? How often? Will they also check _your_ home to make sure you don’t have any unregistered guns? Or will the crime only be punishable if a gun is stolen from my home? So I guess it would be in my best interest to not report a gun if its stolen? In that case, you don’t know where the guns really are. Will it only be punishable if the gun is stolen AND used in a crime? Otherwise how would you know? What if someone breaks into my house, steals my gun, shoots someone in an alley and walks away? No bullet recovered or shell casing to possibly link it to my gun. I guess the integrity of the registry, and where the guns really are can get pretty fuddled over time. If I have my gun stored in a way you deem unsecure, and it’s stolen, what’s to stop me from lying and saying it was stored with a trigger lock? How would anyone know? I could kick my own closet door down and claim the gun was locked in there but the intruder bashed his way in looking for valuables? A 50 dollar door will be cheaper than a criminal record, court costs, and fees. This law seems very easy to skirt? Are you aware that there were about 24,000 murders in 1993, and that number has been dropping ever since? In 2011 the number had dropped by 10,000 _fewer_ murders, for a total of 14,000? Even though the population increased by 50 million US citizens? The assault rifle ban went into effect in 94 when murder was at an all time high. Murders did decrease; but after the ban expired in 04 murders continued to decrease all the way up until the present. This makes me think the ban had little to do with this and perhaps it was some other factor? Could murders be decreasing as the baby boomers age? Maybe it has nothing to do with gun laws, maybe a generation as a whole tends to cut back on the murdering when they hit their 50’s and 60’s? That was a huge chunk of young men entering their 20’s and 30’s when crime was rising in the 70’s and 80’s? > **[United States Crime Rates 1960 t0 2019](https://www.disastercenter.com/crime/uscrime.htm)** > > United States crime statistics, United States , United States rape, United States murder, United States property crime, United States crime index, United States violent crime, violent crime in State, United States burglary, United States vehicle... ---
**Author:** ![filmore](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/7993a0/32.png) [@filmore](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/filmore)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2013, 2:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-lost-my-fire-arm-collection/646738/210 "2013-01-25T14:05:14Z")
There doesn’t have to be anyone to verify that the guns are locked up. Many people will follow the law because it is the law, not because they fear being caught breaking it. Laws can change public behavior. Consider seat belt laws. It wasn’t enough to tell people to buckle up. They made it a law and now most people do it. I don’t think they’re doing it simply because they fear being caught by a roaming policeman. People do it even when there’s no chance of a policeman seeing them. There’s nothing to prevent gun owners from lying and saying their guns were locked up and likely they would never be caught. But some (most?) responsible gun owners would follow the law and it would be less likely their guns would be used by an unauthorized person. One thing that’s confusing in the gun debates is there’s different categories of gun violence. Solutions in one category may not do anything in another category. But that doesn’t mean that the solution should be thrown out. For example, a bar fight that escalates into a parking lot shootout will not be eliminated by requiring trigger locks–it’s the owner’s gun and he can take the lock off. But it can help prevent a moody teenager from taking his parent’s gun to school and killing the girl who spurned him. Or help prevent the guns ending up in the hands of criminals who steal the guns by breaking into homes and cars. Securing guns won’t end gun violence, but it will prevent some deaths. And since we’re talking about real people dying, I think it’s worth making some changes even if it means gun owners have to deal with the inconvenience of securing their guns. ---
**Author:** ![Tristan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tristan/32/18058_2.png) [@Tristan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tristan)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2013, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-lost-my-fire-arm-collection/646738/211 "2013-01-25T17:46:38Z")
As a responsible and legal gun owner, I am horrified that over and over again, those who would seize our guns are proven right, as gun owners show they are willing to flout and ignore laws, by definition turning themselves into the criminals they so hate. It sickens me. ---
**Author:** ![filmore](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/7993a0/32.png) [@filmore](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/filmore)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2013, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-lost-my-fire-arm-collection/646738/212 "2013-01-25T17:55:10Z")
To clarify, I don’t think the gun owner would always be liable if his gun was misused. I think it depends on the situation. For example: - The gun was made an attractive target to a criminal. For example, a visible gun in a gun rack in a vehicle. Since the gun was visible, a thief could easily break in with the purpose of stealing it. The gun owner would be liable in that case. But if the gun was stolen from the trunk or from a home, then he wouldn’t be liable. - Negligence. If a gun owner loses his unsecured gun in a theater and a kid shoots someone, the gun owner would have some liability. - If an authorized guest gains unauthorized access to an unsecured gun, the gun owner would have some liability. For example, he has a party and one of the guests shoots someone with the a gun found in the home, the owner would have some liability. Even if the guest was not authorized to be in the place where the guns were, it’s reasonable to expect that guests may wander throughout the house (such as children). The gun owner would not have liability if the gun was secured and the unauthorized person defeated the lock. Right now there doesn’t seem to be any ownership of the problem by gun owners of trying to prevent any misuse of their guns. I wish the gun culture was more responsible in that they made a reasonable effort to ensure that if their gun falls into unauthorized hands, it takes a significant amount of effort to misuse it. If the laws and courts change to recognize that gun owners have some responsibility, the culture will change. ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2013, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-lost-my-fire-arm-collection/646738/213 "2013-01-25T18:30:51Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > So, when the guys who tried to mug my wife at gun point finally figure out that they would do better without a witness, I’m going to defend our lives with what, a popsickle stick? > 🙂 You can’t outgun an armed mugger- they’re _ **professionals** _! 😛 In fact, if you had a gun and they didn’t, they’d just take it away from you. Everyone knows that!:rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2013, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-lost-my-fire-arm-collection/646738/214 "2013-01-25T18:33:00Z")
> [@Lumpy](#): > > You can’t outgun an armed mugger- they’re _ **professionals** _! 😛 This fellow was not terribly bright. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Ethilrist](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ethilrist/32/4604_2.png) [@Ethilrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ethilrist)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2013, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-lost-my-fire-arm-collection/646738/215 "2013-01-25T21:53:52Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > What if someone breaks into the house when I’m cleaning a gun? The guy who taught me how to shoot kept one gun loaded & holstered while he was cleaning the rest, then loaded one of the freshly-cleaned guns & holstered it while he cleaned the last one. YMMV. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2013, 10:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-lost-my-fire-arm-collection/646738/216 "2013-01-25T22:55:50Z")
> [@Ethilrist](#): > > The guy who taught me how to shoot kept one gun loaded & holstered while he was cleaning the rest, then loaded one of the freshly-cleaned guns & holstered it while he cleaned the last one. > > YMMV. Hey, I’m trying to nit pick here! [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-lost-my-fire-arm-collection/646738.md?page=10)