# I need to improve my cardiac/aerobic fitness. I have questions. **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [January 14, 2015, 12:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-need-to-improve-my-cardiac-aerobic-fitness-i-have-questions/709765 "2015-01-14T00:17:08Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 14\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![chiroptera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/df705f/32.png) [@chiroptera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chiroptera)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2015, 12:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-need-to-improve-my-cardiac-aerobic-fitness-i-have-questions/709765/1 "2015-01-14T00:17:08Z")
Inspired in part by [this thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=745430&highlight=heart+rate+resting). I was mistaken in my response, in Oct 13 my RHR was 72, during the course of my last physical. I don’t think this is very good. As background: I am thin, almost 57, female, and I would say moderately active. My BP has always been low - between 90/60 and 100/70. I hike and walk dogs often, and 5-6 miles at a liesurely pace is no big deal. But to be honest I don’t go faster than a brisk walk at times. I’m a painting contractor so I am on my feet and physically active and very strong, but none of it is aerobic or high intensity. I do belong to a gym but rarely use the cardio equipment. Well, I recently started to. I don’t know how accurate the cardio monitors on the machines are, but since I just started paying attention, I’m alarmed at my numbers. For instance, within 5-6 minutes on a treadmill or bike at a slow jog/moderate (3 mph or so?) intensity pedalling my HR is up to 140+. And I am definitely feeling it - sweating a little, can feel my heart pounding, some slight dizzieness. Also I have noticed in the last few years that shoveling snow or breaking into a brief jog/uphill jog during a hike gets me really dizzy and breathless and red-faced within minutes. I’ve been ignoring that, but don’t want to any more. This bothers me because I thought I was in better shape than that but apparently not. I guess I’m a schlub, but I don’t want to be. So my questions (and general thoughts re: cardiac fitness are great too) - Is such a rapid rise in HR really that alarming? What is normal; at what point is pushing oneself just fine and when does it cross over to potentially dangerous? Are getting dizzy and pounding and sweaty really danger signs? Or should I just increase intensity/speed/incline and push through (which is what I have been doing.) Bonus questions: How accurate are the sensors on typical gym cardio equipment? Is there such a thing as a heartrate monitor that is vaguely accurate and doesn’t cost $500? ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2015, 12:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-need-to-improve-my-cardiac-aerobic-fitness-i-have-questions/709765/2 "2015-01-14T00:49:14Z")
As far as your basic condition-You’re in shape for what you do. Walking will not get you in shape for running will not get you in shape for cycling and so on. I would get seen by a doctor before doing more, you shouldn’t be getting dizzy/red-faced, etc from what seems to be very moderate exertion. Chest strap HR monitors are quite cheap, you can get a good one for $50, more or less. I’ve almost always used Polar with never a problem. My current monitor came with my Garmin Forerunner 305 and it’s just as accurate. ---
**Author:** ![JerrySTL](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e274bd/32.png) [@JerrySTL](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JerrySTL)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2015, 1:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-need-to-improve-my-cardiac-aerobic-fitness-i-have-questions/709765/3 "2015-01-14T01:50:45Z")
I’ve been riding a bicycle many miles for 5 decades and doing 2 or 3 half marathons a year also. I still had a minor heart attack at 46 YO. So going to see a doctor before upping the exercise is a good idea in my opinion. You HR rising so fast is somewhat of a concern. How fast does it come back down? You should be under 100 BPM after 10 minutes even when you do a hard workout. If not, you are overdoing it; have a problem that the doctor should see; or really out of shape. If you are walking 5-6 miles at any pace, you aren’t badly out of shape. ---
**Author:** ![Wesley\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wesley_clark/32/20581_2.png) [@Wesley\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wesley_Clark)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2015, 2:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-need-to-improve-my-cardiac-aerobic-fitness-i-have-questions/709765/4 "2015-01-14T02:09:12Z")
Where did the 100bpm figure come from? Normal resting pulse can range from 60-100bpm, so I’m not sure if everyone would be back to resting pulse within 10 minutes of exercise, esp if it was intense exercise. ---
**Author:** ![Spiderman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spiderman/32/230_2.png) [@Spiderman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spiderman)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2015, 2:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-need-to-improve-my-cardiac-aerobic-fitness-i-have-questions/709765/5 "2015-01-14T02:37:24Z")
The quick rule of thumb is your max HR is 220-age, or 163 in your case. Therefore, a 90% HR for you is 147. If you’re hitting 140+ at a relatively easy 3mph pace, that’s pretty high for 5-6 mins into it. I agree with the previous recommendations that you should see your doctor first. To answer your bonus questions, I find them to be accurate & within a few beats of a either a Polar or Garmin unit I’ve happened to use at a given time over the years. I’d add $10-20 to **running coach** ’s estimate, but you can easily get one for \< $100. Added bonus: Most gym equipment works with a Polar HRM strap, meaning you don’t need to be wearing your watch in the gym. If you’re only going to use it in the gym (instead of walking/cycling outside) you could consider just buying the chest strap. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2015, 2:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-need-to-improve-my-cardiac-aerobic-fitness-i-have-questions/709765/6 "2015-01-14T02:49:15Z")
Don’t know about the 10 minute number but there is [this](http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa043012): > [@](#): > > The value for the recovery of heart rate was defined as the decrease in the heart rate from peak exercise to one minute after the cessation of exercise. An abnormal value for the recovery of heart rate was defined as a reduction of 12 beats per minute or less from the heart rate at peak exercise. … a low value for the recovery of heart rate was strongly predictive of death (relative risk, 4.0; 95 percent confidence interval, 3.0 to 5.2; P\<0.001). After adjustments were made for age, sex, the use or nonuse of medications, the presence or absence of myocardial perfusion defects on thallium scintigraphy, standard cardiac risk factors, the resting heart rate, the change in heart rate during exercise, and workload achieved, a low value for heart-rate recovery remained predictive of death (adjusted relative risk, 2.0; 95 percent confidence interval, 1.5 to 2.7; P\<0.001). … Lots of good heart rate monitors out there. 140 bpm shouldn’t be overly intense for you. Agreed, to feel it so intensely does seem a bit unusual. Not an adult MD so FWIW but Id at least check your 1 minute recovery from peak and ask your regular MD about it. ---
**Author:** ![chiroptera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/df705f/32.png) [@chiroptera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chiroptera)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2015, 12:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-need-to-improve-my-cardiac-aerobic-fitness-i-have-questions/709765/7 "2015-01-14T12:06:57Z")
> [@running\_coach](#): > > As far as your basic condition-You’re in shape for what you do. Walking will not get you in shape for running will not get you in shape for cycling and so on. > > . Ha. Excellent point. So I guess I want to get in better condition so the occasional burst of exertion won’t leave me panting and red-faced and at possible risk of a heart attack. Hence the plan to up my game. And point taken, y’all, that scheduling a doctor visit to do whatever to check my heart condition is a good idea. In Oct 2013 I did have an EKG (full medical check up, since this was a new doctor and it had been a while) and he didn’t seem to have any concerns. But I’ll make an appointment and will keep my work outs at or below my target HR for now. I’m trying to do a minimum 30 minutes of cardio at the gym daily, especially since work + winter means it is bitterly cold (ten below zero right now) and dark when I leave for work, and when I come back. The dogs have to make do with fewer walks in winter. I’ll pay more attention to how fast my recovery rate is. I know, a bit of hyperbole on my part re: the $500 monitors. I’ve looked at FitBits but not sure I need all of the features. Anything anybody recommends in the $50 range that just tracks my heart rate? I’d like to have something I can also use when walking or hiking. I do hike sometimes with my local Sierra Club and those are often 6-8 mile hikes but at a relatively leisurely pace, and being Michigan, we don’t have many hills here. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2015, 12:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-need-to-improve-my-cardiac-aerobic-fitness-i-have-questions/709765/8 "2015-01-14T12:15:11Z")
In terms of your response to running on the treadmill at 3.0 mph - one can think of yourself having done the start of a [Balke Treadmill stress test protocol](http://www.topendsports.com/testing/tests/balke.htm#) and it sounds like you wouldn’t get as far on it as someone who moves around as much as you do would be expected to. Not sure why that would be. Really this may be a flag of some concern so glad you are going to talk to your doc. ---
**Author:** ![chiroptera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/df705f/32.png) [@chiroptera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chiroptera)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2015, 12:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-need-to-improve-my-cardiac-aerobic-fitness-i-have-questions/709765/9 "2015-01-14T12:28:06Z")
> [@DSeid](#): > > In terms of your response to running on the treadmill at 3.0 mph - one can think of yourself having done the start of a [Balke Treadmill stress test protocol](http://www.topendsports.com/testing/tests/balke.htm#) and it sounds like you wouldn’t get as far on it as someone who moves around as much as you do would be expected to. Not sure why that would be. > > Really this may be a flag of some concern so glad you are going to talk to your doc. Huh. Thanks **DSeid**. I’m going to make an appointment today; will my doc order a stress test, do you think? Far as I know I’m healthy as the proverbial horse, but I did smoke for many years (I quit almost two years ago.) I know that’s a big risk factor and it’s entirely possible, or probable I guess, that I’ve done some measure of permanent damage. Gah. My age (and previous bad, very bad, habit) is catching up to me! ---
**Author:** ![chiroptera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/df705f/32.png) [@chiroptera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chiroptera)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2015, 12:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-need-to-improve-my-cardiac-aerobic-fitness-i-have-questions/709765/10 "2015-01-14T12:42:14Z")
Correction, not that it matters: I quit smoking almost three years ago, not two. Early April 2012. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2015, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-need-to-improve-my-cardiac-aerobic-fitness-i-have-questions/709765/11 "2015-01-14T19:50:25Z")
Again, NOT an adult doctor, so maybe one with more knowledge will jump in, but I think maybe. It makes sense. Or repeating the EKG and maybe an echo. My ill-informed concern would be that maybe you had a “silent MI” along the way. But again, I’m a kids doc. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2015, 3:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-need-to-improve-my-cardiac-aerobic-fitness-i-have-questions/709765/12 "2015-01-15T03:27:16Z")
> [@chiroptera](#): > > … I did smoke for many years (I quit almost two years ago.) I know that’s a big risk factor and it’s entirely possible, or probable I guess, that I’ve done some measure of permanent damage. > > Gah. My age (and previous bad, very bad, habit) is catching up to me! Actually though as far as heart attack and death goes, two years plus out from quitting smoking is [great](http://www.escardio.org/about/press/press-releases/esc13-amsterdam/Pages/coronary-artery-disease-smokers-non-angiography.aspx). > [@](#): > > After 2.0 years of follow-up, 2.1% of the study patients experienced heart attacks or death. Rates of heart attack or death were almost 2-fold higher in active smokers compared to never smokers. Past smokers had the same rates or heart attack or death as never smokers, despite having a higher prevalence, extent and severity of CAD Let us know what your doc says. I love hearing that I worry for nothing! ---
**Author:** ![chiroptera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/df705f/32.png) [@chiroptera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chiroptera)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2015, 9:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-need-to-improve-my-cardiac-aerobic-fitness-i-have-questions/709765/13 "2015-01-15T09:46:13Z")
> [@DSeid](#): > > Actually though as far as heart attack and death goes, two years plus out from quitting smoking is [great](http://www.escardio.org/about/press/press-releases/esc13-amsterdam/Pages/coronary-artery-disease-smokers-non-angiography.aspx). > > Let us know what your doc says. I love hearing that I worry for nothing! Yeah stop scaring me with thoughts about silent MIs, **DSeid**! 😛 Actually that’s nice to know about the quit-smoking benefits. I certainly feel (and no doubt smell) better. Appointment made for Jan 29; I’ll update. In the meantime I will continue with my little daily 30-minute low-intensity cardio work outs at the gym, plus walkies if it ever warms up again. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2015, 4:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-need-to-improve-my-cardiac-aerobic-fitness-i-have-questions/709765/14 "2015-01-29T04:21:12Z")
First off good luck at your doc’s tomorrow **chiroptera**! Please post when you get home. Second [this](http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2015/01/28/how-weight-training-can-help-you-keep-the-weight-off/?hpw&rref=health&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&module=well-region®ion=bottom-well&WT.nav=bottom-well&_r=0) for the op helping explain why calories out decreases sometimes quite a bit with weight loss but significantly less with exercise, especially if it includes some weight training (if the op’s friend’s MD will accede to allow it). > [@](#): > > for reasons that are not fully understood, many people become more sedentary after they lose weight. Studies show that non-exercise activity thermogenesis, or N.E.A.T. — a measure of how much energy people use to stand, fidget, walk to the car and otherwise move around without formally exercising — often declines substantially after weight loss, perhaps because the body thinks you are starving and directs you to stay still and conserve energy. > > The upshot is that successful dieters typically burn fewer calories each day than they did when they were heavier, which sets them up for weight regain. > > Enter exercise … > > … women who did not exercise generally did not move much either. They spent fewer minutes each day in motion than they had before their weight loss. Their levels of N.E.A.T. fell significantly. Their resting metabolic rates also declined, since they weighed less. Over all they were burning considerably fewer calories each day than before they had shed the 25 pounds. > > Meanwhile, the women who exercised had a drop-off in their resting metabolic rates after losing the weight, as expected, but much less of a slump in their everyday movements. Their levels of N.E.A.T. — the calories they burned in activities apart from exercise — declined only slightly for the exercising volunteers as a group, and some women increased how much they moved. They walked, stood, took the stairs and fidgeted more than they had before their weight loss. > > This increase in N.E.A.T. was most common among the women who weight trained. … > > … Over all, the data suggest that exercise — and, in particular, weight training — after weight loss prompts people to move more throughout the day, said Gary R. Hunter, a distinguished professor in the department of human studies at the University of Alabama at Birmingham and lead author of the study. As a result, they burn more calories and, with some discipline about food intake, should stave off weight regain.