# I Pit Amazing Grace Baptist Church **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 23, 2009, 10:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-amazing-grace-baptist-church/514908 "2009-10-23T22:34:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![bup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6bbea6/32.png) [@bup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bup)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2009, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-amazing-grace-baptist-church/514908/141 "2009-10-26T18:12:07Z")
> [@mswas](#): > > Yes, and Country music today resembles Rock and Roll more than it resembles the 1927 Opry sound. Regardless, Elvis, Jerry Lee Lewis, Johnny Cash, June Carter, etc… were all part of a scene. Country music’s resurgence as a pop genre occurred when it started to become as influenced by Southern Rock as it was by that old western style. The Outlaw Country style went hand in hand with the ascendance of Rock and Roll. Oh, I don’t give a shit about all your rationalization. Country music and rock are now in bed, yes. Lots of early rock n’ roll was country influenced, yes. The larger point is, [you were a judgmental asshole in this post](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=11700545&postcount=62), and it’s laughable because you were factually incorrect in what you were being all pedantic about. ---
**Author:** ![Ann\_Onimous](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ea5d25/32.png) [@Ann\_Onimous](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ann_Onimous)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2009, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-amazing-grace-baptist-church/514908/142 "2009-10-26T18:12:19Z")
> [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](#): > > Ah, but in Mark (10.11-12) and Luke (16.18) (and also Corinthians 7.10-11, but that wasn’t quoting Jesus) the ban on divorce and remarriage is absolute. > > I’m not the best person to argue this, as I don’t believe it’s the word of god anyway. But there one sees people interpreting the bible differently, and able to justify it with multiple scriptural cites. > > [http://www.marriagedivorce.com/rudvin.pdf](http://www.marriagedivorce.com/rudvin.pdf) has some cites and arguments on the whole issue. But they’re pretty much dead set against remarriage after divorce for any reason. Also against divorce. The references from Mark and Luke look almost identical to the one from Matthew, except they are missing the fornication angle. Same with the First Corinthians verse. Matthew gave more detail. Just like Matthew and John touched on Jesus’ birth, and Mark skips straight to Jesus’ baptism by John the Baptist: but Luke tells the story in great detail. I don’t see those scriptures as contradicting each other. I am definitely going to read the cite you gave in detail when I get home tonight. Thanks for pointing me in that direction! And, as a non-believer, you are absolutely the best person to argue this. It keeps me honest, and keeps me thinking. I continuously need to study and evaluate my belief system. ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2009, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-amazing-grace-baptist-church/514908/143 "2009-10-26T20:02:49Z")
> [@Juliana](#): > > I am definitely going to read the cite you gave in detail when I get home tonight. Thanks for pointing me in that direction! I look forward to your thoughts on it. I have nothing invested on any one interpretation, I just find it fascinating that there is such strident diversity of opinion as to what it all means, even when people decide to all follow one particular edition of the bible. Having been raised in a very Calvinist area, I did grow up watching extended family members get quite heated over how they thought particular passages should be interpreted. Some disagreements nearly came to blows, and some resulted in icy relations within the larger family. ---
**Author:** ![StusBlues](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/dc4da7/32.png) [@StusBlues](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/StusBlues)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2009, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-amazing-grace-baptist-church/514908/144 "2009-10-26T20:15:49Z")
What exactly is wrong with masturbation? If it was good enough for Jesus, then it surely should be good enough for the rest of us. ---
**Author:** ![Shot\_From\_Guns](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ccd318/32.png) [@Shot\_From\_Guns](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shot_From_Guns)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2009, 8:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-amazing-grace-baptist-church/514908/145 "2009-10-26T20:17:25Z")
I always love watching Bible-literalist Christians trying to worm their way out of things like Luke 3:11, Matthew 19:24/Mark 10:25, Matthew 7:5, etc. > [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](#): > > Having been raised in a very Calvinist area, I originally read this as, “Having been raised in a very Calvinist **era** ,” and I thought to myself, “Holy shit, **Qad** , how old \*\*are \*\*you?” ---
**Author:** ![Ann\_Onimous](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ea5d25/32.png) [@Ann\_Onimous](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ann_Onimous)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2009, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-amazing-grace-baptist-church/514908/146 "2009-10-26T20:27:38Z")
> [@stuthehistoryguy](#): > > What exactly is wrong with masturbation? If it was good enough for Jesus, then it surely should be good enough for the rest of us. Okay, I’m laughing at this one. Dang: I don’t believe in Purgatory, but I think it’s getting ready to split wide open for me. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2009, 9:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-amazing-grace-baptist-church/514908/147 "2009-10-26T21:54:46Z")
> [@MyFootsZZZ](#): > > Please say; “It’s a choice”. Which could mean anyone of us could ‘choose’ to be gay. Being straight wasn’t a choice for me. Was/is it a choice for you? But you can change, if you really want to, if you want to change your evil ways 😃 ---
**Author:** ![ToeJam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/dfb087/32.png) [@ToeJam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ToeJam)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2009, 10:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-amazing-grace-baptist-church/514908/148 "2009-10-26T22:01:02Z")
> [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](#): > > Having been raised in a very Calvinist area This reminds me of an recent amusing anecdote- my Bob Jones graduate classmate has taken a slight interest in my own philosophical leanings- mostly in the sense that he knows I’m not a Christian but very tolerant of religious ideas. And so he’s taken a liking to try to get me to join/visit his Church and learn more about his (Protestant) religious views in hopes that “it might take” to my perhaps confused mind? He seems very desiring to get me to consider Christianity at this point in my life, but he’s not overbearing about it at all, which is nice. Anyways, he had asked me if I’d ever gone to a church before, and I pointed out why yes- I’ve had to go to chapel every week in middle school for 4 years of my life. It was back in the days when I went to a religious private school. He was very surprised and asked me what I thought about that experience. “It was okay, not my thing, but I didn’t mind it too much. It was a Lutheran private school” I mentioned. But as soon as I said the Lutheran part though- his jaw dropped, and it seemed like a look of surprise/horror came across his face, and I was amused/confused a bit by his reaction. When I asked him was was the matter he just sputtered: “Nothing. Just… they were Lutherans?” “Uh yeah… that’s a part of Christianity right? Just like you guys, just another branch of Protestantism and all that?” “Yeah- but at least we’re not _LUTHERANS_!” he managed to spurt out. For some reason, I was just really amused by that reaction as I didn’t expect that from him. I sometimes forget how my take on “Christianity” is not how others see it. I just have Catholics and Protestants (throw all of them together under that heading though i know that there are some variations between them, but I don’t always know the specifics), and the other groups such as JW/Mormons/Church of LDS on the ends of the scale and pretty much most forms of Christianity fit somewhere nicely in that spectrum- just never really thought about how the people IN each subgroups view each other. Guess he must have not been a fan of Lutherans for some reason… It was amusing though. But I still don’t really care to go back to church. I’ll have to politely hint that to him somehow. ---
**Author:** ![mswas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e99b99/32.png) [@mswas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mswas)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2009, 10:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-amazing-grace-baptist-church/514908/149 "2009-10-26T22:04:39Z")
> [@bup](#): > > Oh, I don’t give a shit about all your rationalization. Country music and rock are now in bed, yes. Lots of early rock n’ roll was country influenced, yes. > > The larger point is, [you were a judgmental asshole in this post](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=11700545&postcount=62), and it’s laughable because you were factually incorrect in what you were being all pedantic about. Your insecurity does not interest me. ---
**Author:** ![mswas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e99b99/32.png) [@mswas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mswas)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2009, 10:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-amazing-grace-baptist-church/514908/150 "2009-10-26T22:05:43Z")
> [@Jack\_Batty](#): > > **mswas** , I don’t get why you’re fighting this musical argument completely against the grain. > > How can Country music, which existed for years before nary a pelvis was swiveled, be a subset of Rock n Roll? Just based on what we know from the passage of time, it’s impossible. > > Rock n Roll itself is a subset of Blues. Country and Rock did meld later on into Country Rock (Skynyrd, Eagles, Garth Brooks), but that hardly makes one a subset of another. Ok, fair enough. You get my point though. ---
**Author:** ![MyFootsZZZ](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/myfootszzz/32/12580_2.png) [@MyFootsZZZ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MyFootsZZZ)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2009, 10:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-amazing-grace-baptist-church/514908/151 "2009-10-26T22:08:53Z")
> [@SteveG1](#): > > But you can change, if you really want to, if you want to change your evil ways 😃 I suddenly see why this ‘Jesus’ fellow has such a strong following… check out how hot he is! I’m cured! Praise Jesus! ---
**Author:** ![Jack\_Batty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jack_batty/32/3201_2.png) [@Jack\_Batty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jack_Batty)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2009, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-amazing-grace-baptist-church/514908/152 "2009-10-26T22:15:03Z")
I forgot what your point was. I got too wrapped up in “which came first, Donny or Marie?” ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2009, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-amazing-grace-baptist-church/514908/153 "2009-10-26T22:15:34Z")
> [@Jack\_Batty](#): > > I forgot what your point was. I got too wrapped up in “which came first, Donny or Marie?” Don’t you mean “who came first”? ---
**Author:** ![MyFootsZZZ](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/myfootszzz/32/12580_2.png) [@MyFootsZZZ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MyFootsZZZ)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2009, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-amazing-grace-baptist-church/514908/154 "2009-10-26T22:23:14Z")
> [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](#): > > Don’t you mean “who came first”? … this had me on the floor. ---
**Author:** ![mswas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e99b99/32.png) [@mswas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mswas)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2009, 10:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-amazing-grace-baptist-church/514908/155 "2009-10-26T22:24:50Z")
> [@Jack\_Batty](#): > > I forgot what your point was. I got too wrapped up in “which came first, Donny or Marie?” Shrugs. Actually the point had little to do with what you all picked on. Not my problem. **Bup** linked to the original post wherein the point I was making was contained. I feel no need to argue it with people who ignore the argument in favor of an incidental detail. ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2009, 10:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-amazing-grace-baptist-church/514908/156 "2009-10-26T22:26:25Z")
> [@mswas](#): > > Shrugs. Actually the point had little to do with what you all picked on. Not my problem. **Bup** linked to the original post wherein the point I was making was contained. I feel no need to argue it with people who ignore the argument in favor of an incidental detail. That your entire point was a mistaken incidental detail is something you should feel worse about than we do. ---
**Author:** ![mswas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e99b99/32.png) [@mswas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mswas)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2009, 10:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-amazing-grace-baptist-church/514908/157 "2009-10-26T22:31:29Z")
> [@jsgoddess](#): > > That your entire point was a mistaken incidental detail is something you should feel worse about than we do. And yet it wasn’t. Some people are just too culturally ignorant to tell the difference between a small fundamentalist christian church and American rural culture as a whole. Bottom line, if you can’t tell why they’d be against country music as well as Rock and Roll you don’t really have much understanding of fundie Christianity as a culture. It’s neither here nor there to me. The SDMB is filled with people who like to think they are smarter than everyone else and yet gloss over the thesis statement of post in order to go to town about their knowledge of entertainment trivia. Fundamentalist Christianity != rural Southern culture. Try disabusing yourself of your ignorance of the culture you are critiquing before you critique it. What they played at the Opry in 1927 had zero to do with my point. If you want to keep getting your Pit on, go ahead. ---
**Author:** ![mswas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e99b99/32.png) [@mswas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mswas)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2009, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-amazing-grace-baptist-church/514908/158 "2009-10-26T22:37:55Z")
I’ll try and make this as clear as possible as several people are having trouble understanding a simple concept. To a fundamentalist Christian church the accent you sing in while playing in a band consisting of electric guitar, bass, and drums is not a sufficient criteria to make it qualitatively different. They are still ‘worldly’ musical genres. ---
**Author:** ![Covered\_In\_Bees](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/7ab992/32.png) [@Covered\_In\_Bees](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Covered_In_Bees)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2009, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-amazing-grace-baptist-church/514908/159 "2009-10-26T22:41:49Z")
What the hell are you guys arguing about? I thought this thread was about [sexually](http://mitchieville.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/08/catholic_uniform.jpg) [repressed](http://www.hatingitmagazine.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/10/gw-2310-school-girl-outfit.jpg) [Catholic](http://cdn1.ioffer.com/img/item/121/735/147/Yjp2.jpg) [girls](http://www.ic.sunysb.edu/Stu/alcheng/Twins1.jpg)? Surely that is a topic that can bring one another together in harmony and appreciation? [Is](http://www.tshirttrauma.com/img/Halloween_07/Schoolgirl.jpg) [it](http://www.splendicity.com/styleitless/files/2007/10/steveandbarrys-plaidskirt-brown-boots-look1.jpg) [not](http://www.theradreport.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/08/mischabarton.jpg)? **NOTE** : The links in “repressed” and “Catholic” are probably **NOT SAFE FOR WORK**. The others might not be either, but those two are quite a bit more racy. ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2009, 10:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-amazing-grace-baptist-church/514908/160 "2009-10-26T22:43:22Z")
> [@mswas](#): > > And yet it wasn’t. EDIT: You know, I just don’t care enough. Never mind. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-amazing-grace-baptist-church/514908.md?page=7) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-amazing-grace-baptist-church/514908.md?page=9)