I Pit Babale

[Babale]

@Gyrate

Case in point: Robert Kraft (billionaire buddy of Trump, Netanyahu and Epstein ) forced Ed Sheeran to drop Macklemore from his concert tour under threat of having the whole tour cancelled because Macklemore kept saying “Free Palestine”. Gotta silence those critics of Israel every way they can…

Macklemore? Are you seriously going with him as your example of someone who is anti-Zionist without being anti-Semitic?

I agree, Macklemore is a perfect example of the level of anti-Semitism that the average pro-palestinian protestor displays:

And Robert Kraft didn’t force Ed Sheeran to do anything. Ed Sheeran is famously nonpolitical and for Macklemore to force him into politics by shouting slogans for his pet issue when opening for him is a shitty thing to do to a supposed friend.

[puzzlegal]

@Babale

@puzzlegal

I’m on a lot of private discords run by people in their 30s, and some in their 20s. I don’t think it’s age, I think you hang out with a bad crowd.

Then I’m certain you have seen this pro-Russia stuff, but may not have recognized it as such because just like the pre-2016 Nazi online spaces, there are lots of dog whistles. Are you telling me that Hasan Piker streams aren’t shared in these communities? He’s the single largest left wing content creator online.

I have never seen a “Hasan Piker” stream. None of them tend to share streams at all. A typical post that links to something external is

Caroline Ellison has joined Manifund

(Stolen from a friend’s discord)

These people chat about politics, but they are more engaged with “combatting NIMBYism” in their neighborhoods than in the middle east, honestly. Lots of finance stuff. Lots of knitting-related stuff. And that’s including the woman who marched for Gaza, who is also working on a PhD in knitting. (There some more technical term, and her thesis is about machine knitting.) As it’s become clear that there’s nothing she can do about Gaza, she’s moved on. When we discuss elections, the positions of national candidates on the middle east comes up. But trans rights are a hotter topic. Ukraine is also an issue. (And as i said, i don’t personally know anyone who is currently pro-Russian.) But healthcare for Americans and voting rights are more important.

I think you live in a bubble with a lot of people with very extreme views.

[iiandyiiii]

Most people don’t listen to political podcasts. Most people haven’t even heard of Hasan Piker.

[Babale]

@puzzlegal

I have never seen a “Hasan Piker” stream. None of them tend to share streams at all.

@puzzlegal

I think you live in a bubble with a lot of people with very extreme views.

To be clear, no one I interact with in any sort of positive way is a fan of Hasan Piker. The communities I am in have nothing to do with him.

But the communities that are fans of his do exist, and I do unfortunately come across them quite often. I agree that they are a minority, but they clearly aren’t that small of a minority, or he wouldn’t be the #1 left wing politics content creator.

[puzzlegal]

I’ve never heard of Hasan Piker

[iiandyiiii]

Neither have most people. Even most progressives. I’m a very politically active and engaged progressive and I hadn’t heard of him before he was mentioned in the Dope.

[Babale]

@puzzlegal

I’ve never heard of Hasan Piker.

And my mom has never heard of Joe Rogan, but it doesn’t mean that they aren’t both hugely detrimental to American politics.

[iiandyiiii]

Rogan averages about 50 times the viewership of his episodes as compared to Piker, according to googling. They’re not remotely comparable in influence.

[puzzlegal]

I have a lot of progressive friends. I have friends who distribute pro-union literature and support strikes. I have friends who stand outside ICE facilities to protest. I am not out of touch with progressives.

[Babale]

He campaigned with both el Sayed and Mamdani, so plenty of New York and Michigan voters have unfortunately heard of him.

[iiandyiiii]

Right. Piker is a boogeyman largely promoted by MAGA and Israeli government propaganda sources (and allies). He has little actual reach and influence.

[puzzlegal]

I’ve followed both Mamdani and el Sayed without having heard of this guy. I have friends who are gaga over Mamdani. No, they don’t post videos from this guy.

[Gyrate]

@Babale

And Robert Kraft didn’t force Ed Sheeran to do anything

Just straight out with the lies now. Sheeran knew Macklemore’s views before the tour started and didn’t stop Macklemore from doing anything until Robert Kraft gave Sheeran the ultimatum to drop Macklemore or be cancelled from every stadium for the rest of his tour. But here you are, saying “Robert Kraft didn’t force Ed Sheeran to do anything”. Maybe the reason you don’t see intellectual honesty in others is because you have no idea what it looks like?

It’s also worth noting that Kraft doesn’t seem to have the same issue with Kanye West, who is performing in the same Kraft-owned stadia later this year. So to sum up:

According to Robert Kraft, this is objectionable antisemitism:

Criticism of Israel, criticism of apartheid, being against genocide in no way is a criticism of you. My message is for peace; love for all human beings to be treated with dignity, respect, and equality.

…but this is fine:

This ain’t a game. Imma use you as an example to show the Jewish people that told you to call me that no one can threaten or influence me. I told you this is war. Now gone get you some business.

I’m a bit sleepy tonight but when I wake up I’m going death con 3 On JEWISH PEOPLE. The funny thing is I actually can’t be Anti Semitic because black people are actually Jew also You guys have toyed with me and tried to black ball anyone whoever opposes your agenda.

I prefer my kids knew Hannukah from Kwanzaa. At least it will come with some financial engineering.

And of course this.

But it’s fine - it’s not like Kanye is anywhere near as influential as Macklemore...

It’s almost as if barring Macklemore has nothing to do with antisemitism and everything to do with the specific actions of the Israeli government.

[Babale]

When people talk this way about Piker, I’m always reminded of the way that MAGA responds to every unfavorable question with, “I haven’t heard of that”.

[puzzlegal]

There are topics that politicians have a responsibility to know about. No one has a responsibility to follow podcasters.

[Gyrate]

@Babale

When people talk this way about Piker, I’m always reminded of the way that MAGA responds to every unfavorable question with, “I haven’t heard of that”.

Yes, we’re well aware that you assume everyone is as dishonest and hypocritical as you.

Personally I’d never heard of him until he became the latest right-wing version of Emmanuel Goldstein. (See also George Soros and Saul Alensky, although I was at least vaguely aware of Soros before then.) And then the GOP started putting up thirst trap pictures of him at their convention (Piker, not Soros - urgh)…

[Babale]

@Gyrate

But here you are, saying “Robert Kraft didn’t force Ed Sheeran to do anything”

Hey asshole, you know your link doesn’t actually prove any of what you say, right? Yes, I know that when Macklemore went online and tried to invite a man after Sheeran, he tied him in with his (((Zionist))) sponsor Kraft. I also know that there is exactly zero evidence for this other than Macklemore screeching that the Jews got him kicked off the tour.

@Gyrate

But it’s fine - it’s not like Kanye is anywhere near as influential as Macklemore...

I love that you’re so brainrotten that you think I would ever defend Kayne? He’s a rotten piece of shit who should have zero audience.

What deranged caricature of my actual views are you arguing against?

@Gyrate

It’s almost as if barring Macklemore has nothing to do with antisemitism and everything to do with the specific actions of the Israeli government.

Again, aside from the Macklemore tweet, there is no evidence that Kraft did anything.

[Pleonast]

@Babale

That said, in the interests of ending this sidebar which is even more boring than the usual buzzword bingo is, I’ve edited my post to remove the alternating caps. Hope that helps

Thank you. This is a written medium and I prefer posts that I can read.

[Babale]

@puzzlegal

There are topics that politicians have a responsibility to know about. No one has a responsibility to follow podcasters.

When politicians are dragging him on stage to campaign with him, he is no longer “just” a podcaster. If Mamdani or El Sayed didn’t want me to tie them to Hasan and his comments (such as “America deserved 9/11” or “anyone who has ever expressed positive feelings towards Israel shouldn’t be allowed to be dogcatcher”), then they shouldn’t have flown him to their respective states to campaign with him.

[Thing.Fish]

It’s certainly true that the Palestinian solidarity movement in the West is much better organized than the analogous movements for the Ryhinga or Uighurs are, which is why this conflict is more in the public eye. Part of the reason for this is that wealthy Arab states are willing to fund pro-Palestine activity. So I don’t think it’s unreasonable to say that both sides have large and active “PR campaigns” running internationally.