# I pit Bricker for admitting he plans to make posts that are "clearly and utterly unreasonable" **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [December 1, 2014, 10:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-bricker-for-admitting-he-plans-to-make-posts-that-are-clearly-and-utterly-unreasonable/706080 "2014-12-01T22:24:25Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2014, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-bricker-for-admitting-he-plans-to-make-posts-that-are-clearly-and-utterly-unreasonable/706080/101 "2014-12-02T18:05:07Z")
I denounce, renounce and condemn your stance against this Board’s declared purpose of fighting liberal hypocrisy… Wait, what? “Ignorance”, you say? Well. Hmmmmm. Never mind, then, carry on! ---
**Author:** ![Fotheringay-Phipps](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/d9b06d/32.png) [@Fotheringay-Phipps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fotheringay-Phipps)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2014, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-bricker-for-admitting-he-plans-to-make-posts-that-are-clearly-and-utterly-unreasonable/706080/102 "2014-12-02T18:06:31Z")
> [@Hamlet](#): > > You, I, and Bricker can only control how we post and react. When Bricker ignores or simply glosses over an intelligent point by a poster, in favor of responding to some dumbass insult, it only adds to the problem, not solves it. It’s like a bunch of 2nd graders screaming for attention, when Bricker gives it to them, it only exacerbates the problem. Because he’s now the second grader screaming for attention too. > > As a (mostly) thoughtful poster who, I like to think, has some intellectual heft, I despise the masses of 2nd graders who may agree with me politically, and they don’t make it better, they make it worse. In large part because it gives people like Bricker the opportunity to ignore the actual points someone makes, and instead focus on making the idiots look idiotic. Sure, it’s easy pickings for Bricker, he gets to make fools look like fools, but it does nothing to forward any discussion. It just lets him pretend he’s oh so much smarter than the dumb kids in class. > > Bricker’s the 4th grader who screams and yells just like the 2nd graders and blames it on the them for making the playground loud. Sure, he could ignore them and go play with the 5th graders, but where’s the fun in that? Nothing “solves” the problem, but while responding in kind exacerbates the problem in terms of setting the overall tone of the discussion, it also tends to level the playing field somewhat. So the issue is how to weigh “elevating the tone” versus “leveling the playing field” as considerations. And this assessment is where you will tend to find a divergence of opinion between those who benefit from a non-level playing field and those who suffer from it. In my opinion and experience, no poster can get by as a minority ideology on a MB (unless tightly controlled by unbiased moderators) without a good left jab, just to keep things level. I’ve never seen it done by anyone, on any MB (or blog), and don’t think it can be. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2014, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-bricker-for-admitting-he-plans-to-make-posts-that-are-clearly-and-utterly-unreasonable/706080/103 "2014-12-02T18:07:25Z")
> [@Bone](#): > > I am presuming inclination based on your posts. I’m using this definition: _urge to act or feel in a particular way; a disposition or propensity._ If you object, I will withdraw the descriptor. It’s not important. I am satisfied that I have felt and acted on the inclination to offer corrections to arguments (even those with ends that I support) when it suits me. I tend to start such posts with “To be fair…” I was never under any obligation to do so, though. > [@](#): > > I think the litter analogy is particularly apt. We should all ignore bullshit arguments. However, if we leave the litter unaddressed it brings down the quality of the neighborhood. Maybe people will stop littering on their own but it doesn’t seem to be happening, IMO. Then the approach should be to report such posts to the Mods to get the poster warned or banned. Posting a disagreement requires quoting the bullshit argument then addressing it. It’s like reacting to a piece of litter by slapping a Post-It Note on it saying “I disagree with this!” It doesn’t remove the litter, it just calls attention to it. I suppose arguably enough objections to litter might get the litterer to stop, assuming the litterer is just careless and not a willful vandal (ie a troll) who just LOVES it when his litter gets attention. If you want to do the sorting, be my guest, but if you want to demand I join you, you can go pound salt, bub. ---
**Author:** ![Hamlet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hamlet/32/2818_2.png) [@Hamlet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hamlet)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2014, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-bricker-for-admitting-he-plans-to-make-posts-that-are-clearly-and-utterly-unreasonable/706080/104 "2014-12-02T18:18:43Z")
> [@Fotheringay-Phipps](#): > > Nothing “solves” the problem, but while responding in kind exacerbates the problem in terms of setting the overall tone of the discussion, it also tends to level the playing field somewhat. Great. So the field of name-calling, insults, and stupidity is level. > [@FP](#): > > In my opinion and experience, no poster can get by as a minority ideology on a MB (unless tightly controlled by unbiased moderators) without a good left jab, just to keep things level. I’ve never seen it done by anyone, on any MB (or blog), and don’t think it can be. I don’t have a problem with the occasional jab back, a quick retort, or a clever putdown. Hell, that’s what makes this board both interesting and fun. And I think Shodan, for all his many, many, many flaws, is quite good at that part of it. But when that’s the majority of things you do now, as is the case with Bricker (and Shodan), then it’s not redeeming in the slightest. Add in Brickers’ apparent belief that he is better than the idiots he engages with, and it’s not just unredeeming, it’s deluded. ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2014, 6:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-bricker-for-admitting-he-plans-to-make-posts-that-are-clearly-and-utterly-unreasonable/706080/105 "2014-12-02T18:22:54Z")
> [@FuriousGeorge](#): > > Seems pointless to go through the effort of putting in the time and effort that I have seem from him for the sideswipes and horseshit from \*\*'Luci \*\*and **Septimus** and **Bob**. He’s gotta trawl through all of that to find one half a sentence of legible legitmate point clarification? . I once treated Bricker as an equal. He would plow through my posts to find one misplaced comma or such and respond only to that. I finally had my fill when he refused to admit Karl Rove was slimy, and claimed that Clinton’s infidelity was more significant that Bush’s lies to go to stupid war. Now I treat him the way I’d treat a dog who can’t stop going poo on the carpet – I rub his nose in his shit. Yes, I’m childish, but at least I’m not a lying immoral scumbag. ---
**Author:** ![FuriousGeorge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ecae2f/32.png) [@FuriousGeorge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FuriousGeorge)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2014, 6:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-bricker-for-admitting-he-plans-to-make-posts-that-are-clearly-and-utterly-unreasonable/706080/106 "2014-12-02T18:27:25Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > Yes, I’m childish, but at least I’m not a lying immoral scumbag. You sell yourself short… ---
**Author:** ![VarlosZ](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/d78d45/32.png) [@VarlosZ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VarlosZ)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2014, 6:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-bricker-for-admitting-he-plans-to-make-posts-that-are-clearly-and-utterly-unreasonable/706080/107 "2014-12-02T18:32:02Z")
> [@FuriousGeorge](#): > > If **Bricker** shows up to a fight against a given poster expecting the Marquess de Queensberry rules while said poster shows up with a mob of others who are weilding pitchforks, torches and buckets of pig shit, I wouldn’t lose a drop of respect if he drops the gloves and starts flinging shit back. Understand, the distinction isn’t between people who are polite and people who are snarky. The distinction is between people who post stupid, obviously false things and those who do not. More than right & left, and more than people who agree with me & those who disagree, these are the two categories I primarily group posters into, and I absolutely lose respect for people in the former category. As should you. > [@Fotheringay-Phipps](#): > > More significantly, you’re ignoring the extent to which even a minority with pitchforks and torches can change the dynamic of the entire discussion, and weigh it in favor of their side, especially when more thoughtful allies on their side provide some intellectual heft. The more thoughtful responders benefit twice, both from having their opponents denigrated and again by themselves appearing all the more thoughtful for not engaging in it themselves. Wait, you think we _benefit_ when dumbasses on our “side” post idiotic or offensive things? I’m fucking embarrassed when that happens. I bet you are, too. When you’re involved in a debate with someone, and a third party pops up and engages in trollish attacks against your opponent, do you think to yourself, “Oh, good. That helps me out.” If not, I don’t think your criticism makes a lot of sense. Of course it feels worse to receive attacks from both the high road and the low simultaneously, but that doesn’t mean your debate opponent benefits from the low-road attacks. It’s not zero-sum. > [@Bricker](#): > > So according to the weight of commentary here, I should ignore this incredibly retarded observation? Probably that would be best, but at least it would be wise not to engage in more than one simple, corrective reply. And it would _certainly_ be a mistake if it inspired me to write posts that are so bad they begin to affect my reputation. ---
**Author:** ![Fotheringay-Phipps](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/d9b06d/32.png) [@Fotheringay-Phipps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fotheringay-Phipps)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2014, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-bricker-for-admitting-he-plans-to-make-posts-that-are-clearly-and-utterly-unreasonable/706080/108 "2014-12-02T18:33:28Z")
> [@Hamlet](#): > > I don’t have a problem with the occasional jab back, a quick retort, or a clever putdown. Hell, that’s what makes this board both interesting and fun. And I think Shodan, for all his many, many, many flaws, is quite good at that part of it. But when that’s the majority of things you do now, as is the case with Bricker (and Shodan), then it’s not redeeming in the slightest. Add in Brickers’ apparent belief that he is better than the idiots he engages with, and it’s not just unredeeming, it’s deluded. Well I agree with you about it not being the majority of what you do (unless you’re really really good at it and can entertain the masses) but I suspect that we disagree about who the main offenders are in this area. In fact there are others lending their august opinions to this very thread whose substance-to-flippancy ratios are far far lower than those you name. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2014, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-bricker-for-admitting-he-plans-to-make-posts-that-are-clearly-and-utterly-unreasonable/706080/109 "2014-12-02T18:34:56Z")
> [@Hamlet](#): > > Great. So the field of name-calling, insults, and stupidity is level. Well, I’m glad this board is mostly above the “lol u fag” level of discourse and even at the height of the gamergate argument we didn’t degenerate to the level of the people who were actually involved in gamergate. ---
**Author:** ![FuriousGeorge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ecae2f/32.png) [@FuriousGeorge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FuriousGeorge)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2014, 6:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-bricker-for-admitting-he-plans-to-make-posts-that-are-clearly-and-utterly-unreasonable/706080/110 "2014-12-02T18:46:58Z")
> [@VarlosZ](#): > > Understand, the distinction isn’t between people who are polite and people who are snarky. The distinction is between people who post stupid, obviously false things and those who do not. More than right & left, and more than people who agree with me & those who disagree, these are the two categories I primarily group posters into, and I absolutely lose respect for people in the former category. As should you. > Wait, you think we _benefit_ when dumbasses on our “side” post idiotic or offensive things? I’m fucking embarrassed when that happens. I bet you are, too. When you’re involved in a debate with someone, and a third party pops up and engages in trollish attacks against your opponent, do you think to yourself, “Oh, good. That helps me out.” > > If not, I don’t think your criticism makes a lot of sense. Of course it feels worse to receive attacks from both the high road and the low simultaneously, but that doesn’t mean your debate opponent benefits from the low-road attacks. It’s not zero-sum. > Probably that would be best, but at least it would be wise not to engage in more than one simple, corrective reply. And it would _certainly_ be a mistake if it inspired me to write posts that are so bad they begin to affect my reputation. I guess I don’t disagree with what you are saying as an ideal or a principle. That’s just not reality though. Its not just one post that needs a simple corrective response. If I have to trawl through five, six posts of snarky backwards idiotic pile on bulshit to get to one semi serious point hidden in three paragraphs of the same snarky bullshit and then be piled on even more if I don’t IMMEDIATELY respond begging forgiveness the error of my lifetime of misinformation with full quotes, cites, and letters from my mum, fuck it. The reality is I am gonna start to feel some negative shit and fling back. I don’t think the “other side benefits” from an idealistic point of view, as such, but it definitely distracts the conversation away from the honesty and focus of the debate (as much as a real debate happens in the Pit) and turns into a pile on frenzy. To sorta give back some of that I think is warranted. You have folks saying yeah these pile ons happen and if it aligns with my idelogical viewpoint I’m gonna sit by and watch and quite possibly give a quick kick while I am at it. Then at the same time, complain when the piled on person starts kicking back. It’s kinda horseshit. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2014, 7:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-bricker-for-admitting-he-plans-to-make-posts-that-are-clearly-and-utterly-unreasonable/706080/111 "2014-12-02T19:00:49Z")
> [@FuriousGeorge](#): > > I guess I don’t disagree with what you are saying as an ideal or a principle. That’s just not reality though. Its not just one post that needs a simple corrective response. If I have to trawl through five, six posts of snarky backwards idiotic pile on bulshit to get to one semi serious point hidden in three paragraphs of the same snarky bullshit and then be piled on even more if I don’t IMMEDIATELY respond begging forgiveness the error of my lifetime of misinformation with full quotes, cites, and letters from my mum, fuck it. The reality is I am gonna start to feel some negative shit and fling back. Sure, if you want to be LAZY about it. Or at least if that’s what you want to do, don’t WHINE about it and expect to be taken seriously. ---
**Author:** ![VarlosZ](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/d78d45/32.png) [@VarlosZ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VarlosZ)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2014, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-bricker-for-admitting-he-plans-to-make-posts-that-are-clearly-and-utterly-unreasonable/706080/112 "2014-12-02T19:05:50Z")
When assholes are saying stupid things to you it’s more than understandable to want to respond in kind, and it’s NEARLY as understandable to actually do so. Nonetheless, if you get to the point where most of your time is spent going tit-for-tat with snarky assholes, well … guess what that makes you? If you lie down with dogs, etc. ---
**Author:** ![FuriousGeorge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ecae2f/32.png) [@FuriousGeorge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FuriousGeorge)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2014, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-bricker-for-admitting-he-plans-to-make-posts-that-are-clearly-and-utterly-unreasonable/706080/113 "2014-12-02T19:05:56Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > Sure, if you want to be LAZY about it. > > Or at least if that’s what you want to do, don’t WHINE about it and expect to be taken seriously. I did lol, I’ll give you that. ---
**Author:** ![FuriousGeorge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ecae2f/32.png) [@FuriousGeorge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FuriousGeorge)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2014, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-bricker-for-admitting-he-plans-to-make-posts-that-are-clearly-and-utterly-unreasonable/706080/114 "2014-12-02T19:06:58Z")
> [@VarlosZ](#): > > When assholes are saying stupid things to you it’s more than understandable to want to respond in kind, and it’s NEARLY as understandable to actually do so. Nonetheless, if you get to the point where most of your time is spent going tit-for-tat with snarky assholes, well … guess what that makes you? > > If you lie down with dogs, etc. Again, don’t disagree, but don’t blame them for the flea ridden threads. ---
**Author:** ![FXMastermind](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fxmastermind/32/7289_2.png) [@FXMastermind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FXMastermind)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2014, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-bricker-for-admitting-he-plans-to-make-posts-that-are-clearly-and-utterly-unreasonable/706080/115 "2014-12-02T19:07:49Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > expect to be taken seriously. Srsly? Does anyone expect to be taken “seriously” in the Pit? I will admit the thought made me chuckle. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2014, 7:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-bricker-for-admitting-he-plans-to-make-posts-that-are-clearly-and-utterly-unreasonable/706080/116 "2014-12-02T19:47:33Z")
> [@FXMastermind](#): > > Srsly? Does anyone expect to be taken “seriously” in the Pit? > > I will admit the thought made me chuckle. Yeah, I know, the whole thing is pretty meta-absurd. Still, I’ve made serious arguments in Pit threads, to be met by Bricker’s “Waaahhh, the meanies are being so mean and the people making serious arguments (which I am currently ignoring and/or flippantly dismissing) are being so mean by not being mean to the meanies, and they’re forcing _me_ to be mean…! Waaahhh!” Like that but, y’know, serious. ---
**Author:** ![FuriousGeorge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ecae2f/32.png) [@FuriousGeorge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FuriousGeorge)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2014, 7:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-bricker-for-admitting-he-plans-to-make-posts-that-are-clearly-and-utterly-unreasonable/706080/117 "2014-12-02T19:55:13Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > Yeah, I know, the whole thing is pretty meta-absurd. Still, I’ve made serious arguments in Pit threads, to be met by Bricker’s “Waaahhh, the meanies are being so mean and the people making serious arguments (which I am currently ignoring and/or flippantly dismissing) are being so mean by not being mean to the meanies, and they’re forcing _me_ to be mean…! Waaahhh!” > Like that but, y’know, serious. Quit whining, ya pussy. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2014, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-bricker-for-admitting-he-plans-to-make-posts-that-are-clearly-and-utterly-unreasonable/706080/118 "2014-12-02T20:06:04Z")
> [@FXMastermind](#): > > Srsly? Does anyone expect to be taken “seriously” in the Pit? > > I will admit the thought made me chuckle. Was it one of the Pit threads on Fukushima or on global warming that finally convinced you? 😛 ---
**Author:** ![FXMastermind](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fxmastermind/32/7289_2.png) [@FXMastermind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FXMastermind)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2014, 8:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-bricker-for-admitting-he-plans-to-make-posts-that-are-clearly-and-utterly-unreasonable/706080/119 "2014-12-02T20:13:01Z")
[I thought I was pretty clear about my view of things](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=14164560&postcount=121). ---
**Author:** ![FXMastermind](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fxmastermind/32/7289_2.png) [@FXMastermind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FXMastermind)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2014, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-bricker-for-admitting-he-plans-to-make-posts-that-are-clearly-and-utterly-unreasonable/706080/120 "2014-12-02T20:14:57Z")
I got an official goddamn censorship spanking/warming for that post, but it was worth it. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-bricker-for-admitting-he-plans-to-make-posts-that-are-clearly-and-utterly-unreasonable/706080.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-bricker-for-admitting-he-plans-to-make-posts-that-are-clearly-and-utterly-unreasonable/706080.md?page=7)