# I Pit damuriajashi and DemonTree **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [December 18, 2020, 12:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-damuriajashi-and-demontree/928300 "2020-12-18T00:49:58Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 50
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2025, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-damuriajashi-and-demontree/928300/983 "2025-02-13T14:15:53Z")
> [@Babale](#): > > It’s pretty telling how hard you assholes are going after me because I disagree with you over a _word_. Yes, it’s very telling indeed the multiple ways in which you have deliberately minimized many very real attacks on trans people - and, laterally, on others. Perhaps that might explain why so many think you _approve_ of them. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2025, 2:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-damuriajashi-and-demontree/928300/984 "2025-02-13T14:17:52Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > Yes, it’s very telling indeed the multiple ways in which you have deliberately minimized many very real attacks on trans people What the fuck are you talking about, you lying piece of fucking shit? When the fuck did I do that? Put up or shut up. I don’t know if this is you confusing me with someone else, or if you are deliberately lying. Either way, it is fucked up. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2025, 2:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-damuriajashi-and-demontree/928300/985 "2025-02-13T14:18:40Z")
> [@Johanna](#): > > Hey, guys! I posted something relevant to the thread, a few places up. You did, and thank you. I too have noticed that her previously poisonous attacks on trans folk seem to be lessened; and I agree that if she explicitly renounces some of what she said before, it’ll be a lot easier to engage in fruitful conversation with her. I worry that she’s going to act like it’s all our fault, and that she’s just been kind and civil throughout her tenure here and it’s just us meanies misrepresenting her. But if she can avoid that short of irresponsible behavior, I’ll be delighted to reconsider her contributions to the board, and society. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2025, 2:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-damuriajashi-and-demontree/928300/986 "2025-02-13T14:36:36Z")
I am still waiting for the lying piece of shit @Gyrate to retract his claim that I have, in “multiple ways”, “deliberately minimized many very real attacks on trans people”, given the fact that he will not be able to post a link to me doing any such thing. Being a lying piece of shit, I expect he will instead slink off only to throw the same accusation (once again unsupported) at an unspecified future point in time. The purpose of _this_ post is to link it in reply to the lying piece of shit @Gyrate the next time he pulls this stunt. ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2025, 2:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-damuriajashi-and-demontree/928300/987 "2025-02-13T14:59:00Z")
Someone needs to switch to decaf. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2025, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-damuriajashi-and-demontree/928300/988 "2025-02-13T15:06:38Z")
There are “put-ups” all over the fucking place on this board, so why don’t you shut up? ---
**Author:** ![TroutMan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/troutman/32/6721_2.png) [@TroutMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TroutMan)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2025, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-damuriajashi-and-demontree/928300/989 "2025-02-13T15:06:56Z")
But he’s so close to winning everyone to his side! ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2025, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-damuriajashi-and-demontree/928300/990 "2025-02-13T15:16:01Z")
You seem triggered. Did the conversation between [this post](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-damuriajashi-and-demontree/928300/922) and [this post](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-damuriajashi-and-demontree/928300/922) not happen? How’s that wiggle room working out for you? Still wiggling? Funny how you accuse others of a “If it’s not 100% good it’s bad” approach as you continue to claim “If it’s not 100% bad there’s ‘wiggle room’.” Weren’t you just quibbling about whether the Reagan administration [deliberately](https://works.swarthmore.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1167&context=suhj) [ignoring](https://www.vox.com/2015/12/1/9828348/ronald-reagan-hiv-aids) [the AIDS epidemic](https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC4896216/#B23) for several years constituted a “genocide”, something it was [certainly considered by vulnerable populations at the time](https://www.bbc.co.uk/culture/article/20201019-the-drama-that-raged-against-reagans-america)? > [@Babale](#): > > You haven’t provided any evidence of that claim, either. I linked the sort of evidence that Ukranians use to prove that the Soviet’s handling of the Holodomor was intentional, not neglectful. Where is the similar evidence for the US government? Any of those fucking links work for you? But please keep pretending that unless we have a signed affidavit from Ronnie saying “Do not take any effective action to deal with the burgeoning AIDS epidemic because I would like all gay people to die” the YEARS of deliberate inaction don’t count as “genocide”. You know - like this: > [@](#): > > Unless you’ve got a link to government documentation showing intent to use neglect of the AIDS epidemic to wipe out the gay population - [you know, the kind of evidence that exists aplenty for actual genocides-by-neglect, like the Holodomor](https://holodomor.ca/resources/documents-and-sources/documents/) - then it’s pretty insulting to all parties involved to make that comparison. What’s “insulting to all parties involved” is to decide to pick little semantic arguments about the appropriate term to call mass deaths caused by the aforementioned government inaction. And you know it, because you’ve defined it so narrowly (“Must be exactly like the Holodomor”) to be able to make your pointless argument in the first place. Because you’re a disingenuous piece of shit who will “pull this stunt” again. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2025, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-damuriajashi-and-demontree/928300/991 "2025-02-13T15:30:14Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > Did the conversation between [this post](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-damuriajashi-and-demontree/928300/922) and [this post](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-damuriajashi-and-demontree/928300/922) not happen? How’s that wiggle room working out for you? Still wiggling? So, you got nothing? It’s all “you didn’t use my special word, that means you approve of everything that was done to gay and trans people”? ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2025, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-damuriajashi-and-demontree/928300/992 "2025-02-13T15:32:09Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > Weren’t you just quibbling about whether the Reagan administration [deliberately](https://works.swarthmore.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1167&context=suhj) [ignoring](https://www.vox.com/2015/12/1/9828348/ronald-reagan-hiv-aids) [the AIDS epidemic](https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC4896216/#B23) for several years constituted a “genocide”, something it was [certainly considered by vulnerable populations at the time](https://www.bbc.co.uk/culture/article/20201019-the-drama-that-raged-against-reagans-america)? Are you so fucking stupid that you think the statements below are equivalent? What Reagan did was not a genocide What Reagan did was fine What Reagan did by ignoring the AIDS epidemic was an evil crime against humanity. The specific crime in question was not “genocide”, though. Not using the term “genocide” in a context that is very much not a genocide doesn’t _minimize_ every other crime that isn’t _genocide_. ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2025, 3:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-damuriajashi-and-demontree/928300/993 "2025-02-13T15:33:50Z")
Sorry about that, **Babale** and **LHOD** have to rehash unrelated crap that spans many, many threads. They could go get their own thread or find one more appropriate. Yours was a good post. ---
**Author:** ![Mighty\_Mouse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mighty_mouse/32/7776_2.png) [@Mighty\_Mouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mighty_Mouse)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2025, 3:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-damuriajashi-and-demontree/928300/994 "2025-02-13T15:38:18Z")
Thanks for that very thoughtful post. ---
**Author:** ![Ulfreida](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ulfreida/32/8014_2.png) [@Ulfreida](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ulfreida)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2025, 3:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-damuriajashi-and-demontree/928300/995 "2025-02-13T15:52:30Z")
I lived in San Francisco in the early 1980’s, during the AIDS epidemic. All the gay friends I had then died. Deaths seemed endless, every day there were more. Hospitals full of the dying. Maybe it wasn’t “technically” genocide, but if an activity or lack thereof has the same effect as genocide, and those unaffected had the same callous smugness about it as it was happening, then arguing about what we should call it seems like a pointless spectacle of snappiness. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2025, 3:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-damuriajashi-and-demontree/928300/996 "2025-02-13T15:56:25Z")
Oh, fuck off. Your purpose here is very clear, troll-To get people so frustrated that they give up on the subject and walk away, giving you your “win”. You are only here to throw sand in the gears. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2025, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-damuriajashi-and-demontree/928300/997 "2025-02-13T16:11:16Z")
> [@Ulfreida](#): > > Maybe it wasn’t “technically” genocide, but if an activity or lack thereof has the same effect as genocide, and those unaffected had the same callous smugness about it as it was happening, then arguing about what we should call it seems like a pointless spectacle of snappiness. Holy shit, no, it’s not nitpicking or callous smugness. It’s that _genocide_ is a very specific, and heinous, thing; the specificity is what makes the charge so serious. If we broaden genocide to the point that anything qualifies, then it loses its value as an accusation to make. This isn’t just my opinion; there is _tons_ of international legal framework underlying this: > [@](#): > > This chapter examines the role of special intent in the international law on genocide. It argues that the perpetrator’s ultimate purpose, rather than the nature of the underlying act, is central to the crime of genocide. By their conduct, the perpetrator must have intended to contribute to the destruction, in whole or in part, of a protected group. **This particular intent element is what makes genocide a unique crime and what triggers its application. Moreover, this special intent and the associated concern for the protection of certain groups are what give the crime of genocide its particular currency.** Emphasis mine. [https://academic.oup.com/book/57761/chapter-abstract/470835239?redirectedFrom=fulltext](https://academic.oup.com/book/57761/chapter-abstract/470835239?redirectedFrom=fulltext) > [@](#): > > The intent is the most difficult element to determine. To constitute genocide, there must be a proven intent on the part of perpetrators to physically destroy a national, ethnical, racial or religious group. Cultural destruction does not suffice, nor does an intention to simply disperse a group. **It is this special intent, or dolus specialis, that makes the crime of genocide so unique.** In addition, case law has associated intent with the existence of a State or organizational plan or policy, even if the definition of genocide in international law does not include that element. > **[Definitions of Genocide and Related Crimes | United Nations](https://www.un.org/en/genocide-prevention/definition)** When you strip _dolus specialis_ from the charge of genocide, you render it meaningless. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2025, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-damuriajashi-and-demontree/928300/998 "2025-02-13T16:13:08Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Oh, fuck off. Your purpose here is very clear, troll-To get people so frustrated that they give up on the subject and walk away, giving you your “win”. Ahhh, I disagree with you, so I must be a troll. It must be comforting to live with such blind moral certainty that no one can possibly genuinely disagree with me. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2025, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-damuriajashi-and-demontree/928300/999 "2025-02-13T16:15:40Z")
Why don’t you go put words in your _own_ mouth? You weren’t even mentioned, even though you are well known as a “me, too!!” when it comes to shit like this. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2025, 4:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-damuriajashi-and-demontree/928300/1000 "2025-02-13T16:21:05Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > You weren’t even mentioned, even though you are well known as a “me, too!!” when it comes to shit like this. So when you replied to my post in the quote below (my avatar is on the top right of the post), you _didn’t_ mean to speak to me? Who was this post (that “didn’t even mention me” but replied to my earlier post in Discourse terms) _supposed_ to be directed at? > [@Czarcasm](#): > > Oh, fuck off. Your purpose here is very clear, troll-To get people so frustrated that they give up on the subject and walk away, giving you your “win”. You are only here to throw sand in the gears. ---
**Author:** ![crowmanyclouds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crowmanyclouds/32/19884_2.png) [@crowmanyclouds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crowmanyclouds)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2025, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-damuriajashi-and-demontree/928300/1001 "2025-02-13T16:23:45Z")
Genocide defined by Babale, [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/aUQkbXWwJhQ/hqdefault.jpg "'what i win?' the jerk.") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aUQkbXWwJhQ) ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2025, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-damuriajashi-and-demontree/928300/1002 "2025-02-13T16:26:09Z")
> [@What\_Exit](#): > > Sorry about that, **Babale** and **LHOD** have to rehash unrelated crap that spans many, many threads. They could go get their own thread or find one more appropriate. What a shittastic reading of what transpired. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-damuriajashi-and-demontree/928300.md?page=49) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-damuriajashi-and-demontree/928300.md?page=51)