# I Pit Darren Garrison **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [November 11, 2021, 3:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-darren-garrison/954165 "2021-11-11T03:27:15Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Jihi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jihi/32/17768_2.png) [@Jihi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jihi)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2021, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-darren-garrison/954165/61 "2021-11-11T18:57:50Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > Except for the people explicitly calling me a racist just for having this position. What position? This one? > [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > So are you of the opinion that any position that is any way negative towards someone who happens to be black is “racist”? Yeah. You’re racist for this. Nothing Arbury did deserved anything close to what happened to him based on what the defendants knew or saw. Having negative opinions of someone “who happens to be black” based on nothing else is the very definition of racism. This is your bed. Lay in it or change the sheets. I’m done for the day. ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2021, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-darren-garrison/954165/62 "2021-11-11T19:06:49Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > Who do you think you have refuted with this? Who is saying “they set out to kill a black man”? The person I was directly replying to, who explicitly compared it to a [planned lynching](https://www.fbi.gov/history/famous-cases/mississippi-burning)? ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2021, 7:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-darren-garrison/954165/63 "2021-11-11T19:13:54Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > And yeah, I’ve had this poster on ignore for years because of some racist bullshit he posted. When this thread popped up, I had to see what was up and I was not surprised at what I found. You didn’t seem to have me on ignore a few weeks ago when you complimented a photo I posted. > [@SDMB Photo Thread - Show us a photo!](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-photo-thread-show-us-a-photo/952641/135): > > Good composition on that one, eh. I’d love to see this history of racist posts you mention. I challenge you to dig them up. ---
**Author:** ![Jihi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jihi/32/17768_2.png) [@Jihi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jihi)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2021, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-darren-garrison/954165/64 "2021-11-11T19:33:03Z")
“A planned lynching” is exactly what this looked like. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2021, 7:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-darren-garrison/954165/65 "2021-11-11T19:42:58Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > The person I was directly replying to, who explicitly compared it to a [planned lynching](https://www.fbi.gov/history/famous-cases/mississippi-burning)? So, now you are claiming that it was just a chance encounter on the street? > [@Jihi](#): > > “A planned lynching” is exactly what this looked like. To be fair, the murderers in Mississippi burning thought that the best way to get away with it was to hide their crimes, rather than to video them, brag about them, and expect racists like @Darren_Garrison to defend them on the internet. ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2021, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-darren-garrison/954165/66 "2021-11-11T19:51:49Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > And BTW, you are wrong about this as well, as in the Mississippi burning case, the victims were shot, not lynched. “Lynch” is a term for extrajudicial mob killings, not a synonym for hanging. For instance, Joseph Smith was lynched, but there was no rope involved. [https://www.executedtoday.com/2016/06/27/1844-joseph-smith-founder-of-mormonism-lynched/](https://www.executedtoday.com/2016/06/27/1844-joseph-smith-founder-of-mormonism-lynched/) ---
**Author:** ![MandaJo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ac91a4/32.png) [@MandaJo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MandaJo)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2021, 8:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-darren-garrison/954165/67 "2021-11-11T20:13:01Z")
The thing that strikes me as super racist is the continued claim that if the victim had just submitted, all would have been well. One of the strongest held opinions amongst old fashioned racists is that minorities need to “know their place” and that if they fail to be appropriately differential, the consequences are their own fault. All they had to do was reinforce the norms of white supremacy. Now, even if the obligation to defer to white people had any legitimacy (which it doesn’t, of course), history is littered with examples of people killed despite observing the niceties. There is a real idea in some circles that if a black person gets “uppity”, making sure they don’t get away with it is an absolute requirement, because even if the inciting incident was the result of stupid white people being stupid or unfair, once it has escalated to violence, maintaining the idea that black people cannot ever expect to survive attempted violence on white people becomes the priority. So there will be racists who think these guys are idiots and assholes, but who will agree that once they started to chase Arbury, he had to be caught, and that once he tried to defend himself, he had to die. And they don’t blame the stupid white people for those actions, nor think they should be punished. Because maintaining white supremacy is more important than the fate of any individual. ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2021, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-darren-garrison/954165/68 "2021-11-11T20:32:32Z")
> [@MandaJo](#): > > The thing that strikes me as super racist is the continued claim that if the victim had just submitted, all would have been well. One of the strongest held opinions amongst old fashioned racists is that minorities need to “know their place” and that if they fail to be appropriately differential, the consequences are their own fault. All they had to do was reinforce the norms of white supremacy. And the thing that is a baseless assertion is insisting that I only say it because he is black and would not have the same position for a white person. ---
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2021, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-darren-garrison/954165/69 "2021-11-11T20:38:33Z")
That’s a pretty safe position to be in – there were also white people seen trespassing on that site, but somehow, the racists down there managed not to hunt them down. ---
**Author:** ![Ann\_Hedonia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ann_hedonia/32/319_2.png) [@Ann\_Hedonia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ann_Hedonia)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2021, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-darren-garrison/954165/70 "2021-11-11T21:25:03Z")
I’ve been watching the trial on and off, so I can’t say that I didn’t miss any testimony. But it’s pretty clear that there’s no evidence that they were aware that Arbery was at the construction site before they chased him down and killed him. The neighbor that saw Arbery there - and called the police non-emergency number- never made any contact with the McMichael gang until after the shooting. Larry English never discussed the trespassers on his property with the McMichaels, never asked them for help and never showed them his surveillance videos. After the shooting, the McMichaels repeatedly said that they didn’t know who the guy was, which the defense desperately tried to spin into “they didn’t know his name.”, but that’s not what they said. They said they didn’t know who he was. And - and here is where I may concede that I missed something- during the testimony of the first responding officers regarding the initial interviews at the scene- I don’t think the killers mentioned recognizing Arbery from the videos, I don’t think they mentioned the English construction site at all. It was all “black guy running, he must’ve done something” and “there’s been a rash of burglaries in the neighborhood”. And they had a “hunch”. That’s all. ---
**Author:** ![Ann\_Hedonia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ann_hedonia/32/319_2.png) [@Ann\_Hedonia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ann_Hedonia)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2021, 9:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-darren-garrison/954165/71 "2021-11-11T21:41:02Z")
It’s been established in the trial that it was NOT posted as No Trespassing. There weren’t any No Trespassing signs. There weren’t any Keep Out signs. Larry English was very clear that he had no interest in the McMichaels or anyone like them protecting his property, in fact he was primarily concerned with liability. But, for whatever reason, he wasn’t concerned enough to stick up a No Trespassing sign. Yeah, wandering onto an empty and unsecured construction site isn’t a good idea, but there are many possible reasons for doing so. Maybe he was looking for a bathroom. Maybe he was looking for someone to ask about work. Too bad a bunch of racist rednecks killed him before anyone found ask him. From the videos, it doesn’t seem like he was “casing the joint” or looking for stuff to steal, he wasn’t searching the place and he wasn’t paying attention to the construction supplies. Maybe you should watch the trial. ---
**Author:** ![Mundane\_Super\_Hero](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mundane_super_hero/32/6304_2.png) [@Mundane\_Super\_Hero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mundane_Super_Hero)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2021, 9:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-darren-garrison/954165/72 "2021-11-11T21:48:32Z")
> [@Monty](#): > > How about “Existing while Black”? That seems to be a popular crime to commit and a popular crime to kill someone for. Sometimes i wonder if the reason why Biden keeps Harris doing so much work abroad is because we have way too many itchy-trigger red neck hicks at home who are just aching to try to earn another black caricature stamp on the doors of their pick-up trucks to earn “Race Ace”. ---
**Author:** ![Folacin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/folacin/32/3195_2.png) [@Folacin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Folacin)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2021, 9:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-darren-garrison/954165/73 "2021-11-11T21:55:45Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > I do so love the “He attacked me because I was threatening to shoot him, and therefore my shooting him was self-defense!” arguments. History is written by the survivors. I’m sure I’ve mentioned this before, but the oldest child came home from either first grade or kindergarten and explained to me that “It is OK to hit someone if they hit you back”. > [@RitterSport](#): > > That’s a pretty safe position to be in – there were also white people seen trespassing on that site, but somehow, the racists down there managed not to hunt them down. To be fair (and I’m not sure why one would want to be in this case), we don’t have a case where a bunch of rednecks chased down a white guy who may or may not have been trespassing on a non-posted construction site leading to a confrontation where the white guy was killed. So while the rednecks in this case are pretty clearly racist, we can’t use it is absolute proof that DG is a racist. That he’s misrepresenting the facts and defending racists, sure - but maybe he’d do the same if Aubery had been white. Of course, the whole chain of events most likely wouldn’t occur in that case but there is the possibility. ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2021, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-darren-garrison/954165/74 "2021-11-11T22:09:33Z")
> [@Ann\_Hedonia](#): > > And - and here is where I may concede that I missed something- during the testimony of the first responding officers regarding the initial interviews at the scene- I don’t think the killers mentioned recognizing Arbery from the videos The younger McMichael personally witnessed one of the incidents, he didn’t need video of it. > **[‘It just startled me.’ Travis McMichael dialed 911 days before shooting](https://www.ajc.com/news/crime--law/just-startled-travis-mcmichael-dialed-911-days-before-shooting/cW9EyvfTBkwv6n16B4GT7I/)** > > NEW: Travis McMichael's legal team plans news conference  > On the night of Feb. 11, Travis McMichael was driving his red pickup truck past the construction site when he spotted someone he deemed suspicious, according to audio of a 911 call obtained by The Atlanta Journal-Constitution. > “I was leaving the neighborhood and I just caught a guy running into a house being built,” McMichael told the dispatcher. “When I turned around, he took off running into the house.” … > During the Feb. 11 call to 911, Travis McMichael told the dispatcher he’d seen a man at the construction site and was backing up his truck to check on things. > “I’ve never seen this guy before in the neighborhood,” he said. He was breathing heavily during the call; the dispatcher asked if was okay. > “Yeah, it just startled me,” McMichael responded. “When I turned around and saw him and backed up, he reached into his pocket and ran into the house. So I don’t know if he’s armed or not. But he looked like he was acting like he was.” > McMichael told the dispatcher that he was in his truck, across the street from the construction site, while as many as four neighbors were out looking for the man. Neighbor Diego Perez said he was armed when he left his home and walked up Satilla Drive that night. Gregory McMichael joined the search and also was armed, Perez said. ---
**Author:** ![Chisquirrel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6bbea6/32.png) [@Chisquirrel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chisquirrel)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2021, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-darren-garrison/954165/75 "2021-11-11T22:19:03Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > I am fighting the narrative that they deliberately chased him down with the intent of murdering him Nope, just kidnap him. And when Arbery (arguably, still requires evidence) tried to defend himself from his attackers after trying to leave the area, he was shot and killed. Far more clearcut self-defense (again, assuming he was trying to take a firearm away from his assailants, which has yet to be shown) than Zimmerman. But you’re defending murderers, so have at it. Arbery didn’t turn back and attack them. He turned around after they blocked his escape from armed men, they blocked him again, and by all accepted eyewitness acounts not belonging to murderers, he tried to push by one of the armed men, at which point he was shot and killed. It’s not spin to call a construction site a construction site, you mentally-deficient asshat. It’s factual information that is relevant to the context. ---
**Author:** ![Chisquirrel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6bbea6/32.png) [@Chisquirrel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chisquirrel)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2021, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-darren-garrison/954165/76 "2021-11-11T22:23:25Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > The younger McMichael personally witnessed one of the incidents, he didn’t need video of it. A previous incident. That has no relevance to the one where Arbery was murdered. I could dig deeper, but…ya know. ---
**Author:** ![Ann\_Hedonia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ann_hedonia/32/319_2.png) [@Ann\_Hedonia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ann_Hedonia)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2021, 10:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-darren-garrison/954165/77 "2021-11-11T22:25:43Z")
Any evidence that it was Arbery? Or do they all look alike, and that’s close enough for killing? One thing I did hear during the trial today is that on at least one occasion the McMichaels harassed and reported a black man that wasn’t Arbery (a homeless man that they thought was breaking into cars because he looked “shady”.) Of course, this is all digression because it’s undeniable that they had no reason to detain anyone unless they’d personally witnessed them commit a felony right then. There’s no evidence that Arbery committed a felony, and it’s questionable whether or not him walking into a construction site was even a misdemeanor. And it’s undisputed that the McMichaels didn’t witness him doing anything right before they chased him down with long guns in a truck with Confederate flag plates, called him an asshole and threatened to blow his head off before killing him. At no point did they indicate that they were trying to arrest him. Now, it possible that Travis McMichael admitted to recognizing the guy after they murdered him, although the other two didn’t. I believe the prosecution has decided not to use Travis’s statements, if there’s anything exculpatory they’re going to have to put him on the stand - which won’t turn out well because Travis is on tape calling him a “fucking n\*\*\*\*r” after he blew a hole in his chest, IIRC. ---
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2021, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-darren-garrison/954165/78 "2021-11-11T22:39:06Z")
> [@Folacin](#): > > To be fair (and I’m not sure why one would want to be in this case), we don’t have a case where a bunch of rednecks chased down a white guy who may or may not have been trespassing on a non-posted construction site leading to a confrontation where the white guy was killed. Exactly. That’s why I’m saying it’s a pretty safe statement to make – the likelihood of a random white jogger getting hunted down and murdered for doing nothing is minuscule. It’s sort of a “the law prevents both the rich and the poor from sleeping under bridges” type of thing, in a way I can’t properly articulate. ---
**Author:** ![naita](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naita/32/5862_2.png) [@naita](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/naita)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2021, 10:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-darren-garrison/954165/79 "2021-11-11T22:48:01Z")
Wow. What a hill to chose to die on. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2021, 11:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-darren-garrison/954165/80 "2021-11-11T23:02:44Z")
I think you meant “a hole to choose to die in”. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-darren-garrison/954165.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-darren-garrison/954165.md?page=5)