# I pit everybody who says "play-in game" **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [March 13, 2017, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-everybody-who-says-play-in-game/782098 "2017-03-13T16:30:04Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![That\_Don\_Guy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/that_don_guy/32/538_2.png) [@That\_Don\_Guy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/That_Don_Guy)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2017, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-everybody-who-says-play-in-game/782098/1 "2017-03-13T16:30:04Z")
For some reason, a number of media outlets - including some from universities - refer to the “first four” games in the NCAA Division I men’s basketball tournament as “play-in games,” implying that the four teams that lose were not actually “in the tournament.” The NCAA tried to remedy this by calling the round of 64 the “second round” for a few years, but, you guessed it, too many people complained that this meant the “first round” games were actually part of the tournament. Guess what? They are - and this goes back to when it was just one game in Dayton. The NCAA says there are 68 teams in the tournament, not 64. Yes, it is, in effect, a 128-team tournament with 60 byes in the first round; how about that? IIRC, there were actual “play-in games” when the field expanded from 48 to 64; because of the number of conferences, six of them were told before the season began that their champion would have to face another of the six just before the bracket was announced, and only the three winners would be in the tournament. I think they quickly decided to get rid of some of the automatic conference champion spots to get it back down to 64. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2017, 5:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-everybody-who-says-play-in-game/782098/2 "2017-03-13T17:35:44Z")
Play-in game. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2017, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-everybody-who-says-play-in-game/782098/3 "2017-03-13T17:59:50Z")
Oh yeah? Huh! _\_ ---
**Author:** ![Covfefe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ee7513/32.png) [@Covfefe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Covfefe)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2017, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-everybody-who-says-play-in-game/782098/4 "2017-03-13T18:17:37Z")
I’ve never known of anyone who liked the labeling of the round of 64 the “2nd round.” MLB expanded a few years ago to include another wild card team and these commonly are known as “play-in games”, so I don’t see a problem. ---
**Author:** ![russian\_heel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f05b48/32.png) [@russian\_heel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/russian_heel)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2017, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-everybody-who-says-play-in-game/782098/5 "2017-03-13T18:21:26Z")
I resent Conference Champions or Conference Tourney winners being placed in the First 4 because to me they ARE “play in” games. When you win a conference tourney there is a promise that means your ticket is punched for the Big Dance, which lets be honest, to the public, really starts Thursday with the Field of 64. NO ONE gets excited about Tuesday and Wednesday in Dayton and no one wants to be in the First 4: to me its a punishment. For that reason I feel the First 4 should be 8 “bubble” teams that neither won their Conference or Conference title. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2017, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-everybody-who-says-play-in-game/782098/6 "2017-03-13T19:31:46Z")
I think every conference champ deserves to be in the final 64. The 8 play-in teams should be non-champions only. Each of them should wind up with a 16 seed. To me it makes no sense that half of the play-in winners get 16 seeds and half get something better. Every 15 seed should be considered better than every play-in team. ---
**Author:** ![Ike\_Witt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ike_witt/32/283_2.png) [@Ike\_Witt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ike_Witt)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2017, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-everybody-who-says-play-in-game/782098/7 "2017-03-13T19:33:05Z")
Where else are you supposed to play if not in game? Play in street? ---
**Author:** ![BubbaDog](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bubbadog/32/333_2.png) [@BubbaDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BubbaDog)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2017, 7:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-everybody-who-says-play-in-game/782098/8 "2017-03-13T19:41:06Z")
I believe the correct term is Bison. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2017, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-everybody-who-says-play-in-game/782098/9 "2017-03-13T19:49:29Z")
Well, they tried playing the _out_ game but, y’know… it’s _cold_. ---
**Author:** ![watchwolf49](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e9c0ed/32.png) [@watchwolf49](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/watchwolf49)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2017, 8:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-everybody-who-says-play-in-game/782098/10 "2017-03-13T20:13:42Z")
I must be out of the loop … I’m pissed about ESPN not posting the Women’s Bracket yet … WTF? ---
**Author:** ![Amateur\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/59ef9b/32.png) [@Amateur\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amateur_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2017, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-everybody-who-says-play-in-game/782098/11 "2017-03-13T20:29:30Z")
I just pit the whole idea of “playoff madness” every time I turn around. The craziness about the craziness of the craziness just effing wears me out. ---
**Author:** ![JeffB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jeffb/32/188_2.png) [@JeffB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JeffB)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2017, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-everybody-who-says-play-in-game/782098/12 "2017-03-13T20:33:23Z")
> [@Amateur\_Barbarian](#): > > I just pit the whole idea of “playoff madness” every time I turn around. The craziness about the craziness of the craziness just effing wears me out. So, you’re _mad_ in _March_? ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2017, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-everybody-who-says-play-in-game/782098/13 "2017-03-13T20:46:42Z")
> [@JeffB](#): > > So, you’re _mad_ in _March_? That’s in between “Furious in February” and “Angry in April”, right? ---
**Author:** ![Amateur\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/59ef9b/32.png) [@Amateur\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amateur_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2017, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-everybody-who-says-play-in-game/782098/14 "2017-03-13T20:49:42Z")
> [@JeffB](#): > > So, you’re _mad_ in _March_? No, just wishing for Mutual Assured Destruction this year so the males of the US can finally fucking grow up. Being interested in a sport is one thing. Following a team is another. Being March Hare fucking batshit over every team and bracket and breakout and spread and whatnot for a solid month of incomprehensible matchups is… the odd combination of testosterone-fueled juvenalia. ---
**Author:** ![Ponch8](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ponch8/32/9883_2.png) [@Ponch8](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ponch8)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2017, 9:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-everybody-who-says-play-in-game/782098/15 "2017-03-13T21:36:20Z")
> [@watchwolf49](#): > > I must be out of the loop … I’m pissed about ESPN not posting the Women’s Bracket yet … WTF? You mean the bracket that hasn’t even been released yet? ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2017, 9:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-everybody-who-says-play-in-game/782098/16 "2017-03-13T21:38:16Z")
> [@Ponch8](#): > > You mean the bracket that hasn’t even been released yet? Well it’d called _ESP_N, isn’t it? ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2017, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-everybody-who-says-play-in-game/782098/17 "2017-03-14T14:39:58Z")
> [@watchwolf49](#): > > I must be out of the loop … I’m pissed about ESPN not posting the Women’s Bracket yet … WTF? They don’t need a bracket- just give the trophy to UConn and skip the rest. ---
**Author:** ![Omar\_Little](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omar_little/32/269_2.png) [@Omar\_Little](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omar_Little)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2017, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-everybody-who-says-play-in-game/782098/18 "2017-03-14T15:01:26Z")
> [@russian\_heel](#): > > no one wants to be in the First 4: to me its a punishment. There are several teams in the NIT, that would love to be in the First 4. ---
**Author:** ![Barkis\_is\_Willin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a183cd/32.png) [@Barkis\_is\_Willin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Barkis_is_Willin)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2017, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-everybody-who-says-play-in-game/782098/19 "2017-03-14T17:16:02Z")
Play-in game makes more sense than Round 1. I think the teams that get bounced in those games should go directly to the 2nd round of the NIT. ---
**Author:** ![Buck\_Godot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/buck_godot/32/6573_2.png) [@Buck\_Godot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buck_Godot)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2017, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-everybody-who-says-play-in-game/782098/20 "2017-03-14T17:20:52Z")
A first round where 88% of the teams get a bye isn’t much of a first round. Even in the pro teams, the wild card games aren’t really considered part of the play-offs. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-everybody-who-says-play-in-game/782098.md?page=2)