# I pit images of drowned little boy. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [September 3, 2015, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-images-of-drowned-little-boy/729826 "2015-09-03T17:31:21Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2015, 7:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-images-of-drowned-little-boy/729826/21 "2015-09-03T19:57:21Z")
Those fleeing Syria/Libya and landing in Turkey/Greece are refugees. Those that are afterwards fleeing Turkey/Greece and trying to get to Western Europe (which is what the brouhaha on the news is about) are not refugees. They are economic migrants. ---
**Author:** ![A\_isha](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9fc348/32.png) [@A\_isha](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/A_isha)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2015, 8:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-images-of-drowned-little-boy/729826/22 "2015-09-03T20:00:13Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > Those fleeing Syria/Libya and landing in Turkey/Greece are refugees. > > Those that are afterwards fleeing Turkey/Greece and trying to get to Western Europe (which is what the brouhaha on the news is about) are not refugees. They are economic migrants. That’s some of the most heartless bullshit I’ve ever seen. EDIT: The father of the two boys who drowned, for instance, [was fleeing Syria and trying to get to Canada with his wife and children](http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/sep/03/refugee-crisis-syrian-boy-washed-up-on-beach-turkey-trying-to-reach-canada). And they sure as fuck weren’t “economic migrants”. ---
**Author:** ![monstro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@monstro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monstro)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2015, 8:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-images-of-drowned-little-boy/729826/23 "2015-09-03T20:01:10Z")
I have no sympathy for the OP. ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2015, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-images-of-drowned-little-boy/729826/24 "2015-09-03T20:02:34Z")
> [@A\_isha](#): > > That’s some of the most heartless bullshit I’ve ever seen. Doesn’t make it any less true. ---
**Author:** ![Baron\_Greenback](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baron_greenback/32/48_2.png) [@Baron\_Greenback](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baron_Greenback)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2015, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-images-of-drowned-little-boy/729826/25 "2015-09-03T20:05:25Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > Those fleeing Syria/Libya and landing in Turkey/Greece are refugees. > > Those that are afterwards fleeing Turkey/Greece and trying to get to Western Europe (which is what the brouhaha on the news is about) are not refugees. They are economic migrants. I wouldn’t be too harsh on a Syrian Kurdish refugee family trying to leave Turkey for somewhere in the EU, to be honest. ---
**Author:** ![A\_isha](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9fc348/32.png) [@A\_isha](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/A_isha)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2015, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-images-of-drowned-little-boy/729826/26 "2015-09-03T20:06:16Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > Doesn’t make it any less true. The “heartless” part, no. The “bullshit” part, though, is what makes it not true. ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2015, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-images-of-drowned-little-boy/729826/27 "2015-09-03T20:12:39Z")
> [@A\_isha](#): > > The “heartless” part, no. The “bullshit” part, though, is what makes it not true. From Syria/Lybia, they were fleeing death/bombs/destruction/starvation. Other than potential economic hardships, what is the cause of them fleeing from Turkey/Greece/Hungary? ---
**Author:** ![Spavined\_Gelding](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/958977/32.png) [@Spavined\_Gelding](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spavined_Gelding)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2015, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-images-of-drowned-little-boy/729826/28 "2015-09-03T20:14:10Z")
It is not the duty of the press ,internet or otherwise, to protect your rose colored view of the world. punctuated by occasional photos of Miley Cyrus’ breasts. You may wish and hope to remain ignorant of the bad things that happen all around us, some of those bad things done in our name, but you lack of knowledge, and maybe lack of empathy, should not be because the information is not available to you. ---
**Author:** ![Baron\_Greenback](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baron_greenback/32/48_2.png) [@Baron\_Greenback](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baron_Greenback)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2015, 8:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-images-of-drowned-little-boy/729826/29 "2015-09-03T20:17:48Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > Those fleeing Syria/Libya and landing in Turkey/Greece are refugees. There won’t be many from Libya landing in Turkey, Terr. Sicily, Southern Italy are much shorter crossings ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2015, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-images-of-drowned-little-boy/729826/30 "2015-09-03T20:28:30Z")
> [@Baron\_Greenback](#): > > There won’t be many from Libya landing in Turkey, Terr. Sicily, Southern Italy are much shorter crossings Yes. The point is, the refugees are not satisfied to be in relative safety in Turkey or Greece or Serbia or Hungary - or Italy, for that matter. No, it’s the developed welfare systems of Germany/UK/Denmark/Norway that are the main attraction, it seems. ---
**Author:** ![Memnon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f1d935/32.png) [@Memnon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Memnon)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2015, 8:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-images-of-drowned-little-boy/729826/31 "2015-09-03T20:30:09Z")
> [@A\_isha](#): > > It’s an image of a rescuer carrying the body of one of two young Syrian brothers who drowned off the coast of Turkey (their father, who was fleeing the violence in Syria with them, survived). > > I’m not linking to it, because I’m furious that it takes the image of a drowned little boy being shoved in their faces by the tabloid media for many Europeans to get over their indifference to the horrific plight of refugees (or, in far too many cases, the outright bigotry and hatred towards the “brown hordes invading Europe” that said tabloid media has been pushing regarding the refugees). > > But if you really want to see it for yourself, my description above should give you enough to Google it. It annoys me that Europeans are being singled out for criticism in this regard. It’s not like the other Gulf states are all sympathy and heartstrings for the Syrian refugees, [is it?](http://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-34132308) Maybe if countries like Saudi Arabia and Yemen actually did something meaningful to help these people they wouldn’t have to sail halfway round the world on scraps of fucking driftwood in the hopes of finding a little sanctuary. ---
**Author:** ![Lowdown](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/c57346/32.png) [@Lowdown](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lowdown)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2015, 8:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-images-of-drowned-little-boy/729826/32 "2015-09-03T20:31:35Z")
Okay. I was on the wrong side of this. You guys are right. I got a little feisty when you told me I wasn’t! My youngest turns one on Monday, and he has been very sick since last Monday and got admitted to the hospital after an ER visit. He finally came home a few days ago. It was terrifying and he’s still a little off and keeping us up at night. The last thing on earth I expected or needed to see this morning was a dead child about the shape and size of my eldest son, since I’ve been pretty much worrying about my kid dying for about a week straight. I didn’t handle it well. So I thought I’d switch from news to shopping for drums, and it followed me there. Fuck! So I thought it’d be a good idea to bitch about it here. Whoops! I’m still not handling it well, because every time I see it I think it looks like my son, and I can’t avoid it because it’s everywhere. ---
**Author:** ![Baron\_Greenback](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baron_greenback/32/48_2.png) [@Baron\_Greenback](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baron_Greenback)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2015, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-images-of-drowned-little-boy/729826/33 "2015-09-03T20:38:01Z")
> [@Tithonus](#): > > Maybe if countries like Saudi Arabia and Yemen actually did something meaningful to help these people they wouldn’t have to sail halfway round the world on scraps of fucking driftwood in the hopes of finding a little sanctuary. You make a good point about Saudi Arabia and the wealthy Gulf States. But, c’mon, Yemen!? Did you just look at a map and pick a name without looking to see how much a clusterfuck Yemen is these days? ---
**Author:** ![A\_isha](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9fc348/32.png) [@A\_isha](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/A_isha)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2015, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-images-of-drowned-little-boy/729826/34 "2015-09-03T20:38:19Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > From Syria/Lybia, they were fleeing death/bombs/destruction/starvation. Other than potential economic hardships, what is the cause of them fleeing from Turkey/Greece/Hungary? Because the conditions in the camps range from dangerous to horrific, there are about four times as many refugees living _outside_ the camps since the camps themselves are overflowing, humanitarian aid for those refugees is scarce, and the Turkish government prevents the adults from doing any work and the children from attending schools, meaning that for the vast majority of refugees who don’t get aid there is no way for them to pay for food or shelter and their children aren’t getting any education _period_. Calling people who are trying to flee those conditions “economic migrants”, as if they’re merely fed up with their current low-paying jobs and are just seeking a cushier one somewhere else, is, as I said, unmitigated bullshit. ---
**Author:** ![A\_isha](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9fc348/32.png) [@A\_isha](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/A_isha)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2015, 8:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-images-of-drowned-little-boy/729826/35 "2015-09-03T20:44:39Z")
> [@Tithonus](#): > > It annoys me that Europeans are being singled out for criticism in this regard. It’s not like the other Gulf states are all sympathy and heartstrings for the Syrian refugees, [is it?](http://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-34132308) Maybe if countries like Saudi Arabia and Yemen actually did something meaningful to help these people they wouldn’t have to sail halfway round the world on scraps of fucking driftwood in the hopes of finding a little sanctuary. The Gulf states certainly have been criticized for not taking in refugees. And as your own link notes, Lebanon, Jordan, and Turkey have been taking in refugees (along with a bunch of other Muslim nations not mentioned in the article). They’ve also taken in far more refugees than European countries have. Fuck, _Egypt alone_ has taken in more Syrian refugees than Germany, Italy, France, the UK, and the United States _combined._ ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2015, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-images-of-drowned-little-boy/729826/36 "2015-09-03T20:46:30Z")
> [@A\_isha](#): > > Because the conditions in the camps range from dangerous to horrific, there are about four times as many refugees living _outside_ the camps since the camps themselves are overflowing, humanitarian aid for those refugees is scarce, and the Turkish government prevents the adults from doing any work and the children from attending schools, meaning that for the vast majority of refugees who don’t get aid there is no way for them to pay for food or shelter and their children aren’t getting any education _period_. So - economic hardships… > [@](#): > > Calling people who are trying to flee those conditions “economic migrants”, as if they’re merely fed up with their current low-paying jobs and are just seeking a cushier one somewhere else, is, as I said, unmitigated bullshit. Economic migrants are those who flee economic hardship (vs. some horrible persecution). ---
**Author:** ![Bill\_Door](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/50afbb/32.png) [@Bill\_Door](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bill_Door)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2015, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-images-of-drowned-little-boy/729826/37 "2015-09-03T20:48:10Z")
There’s a [picture of a nine year old Vietnamese girl with napalm burns](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phan_Thi_Kim_Phuc)that may have altered the course of the war. You probably shouldn’t look at that, either. ---
**Author:** ![andros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@andros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andros)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2015, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-images-of-drowned-little-boy/729826/38 "2015-09-03T20:48:53Z")
> [@A\_isha](#): > > Calling people who are trying to flee those conditions “economic migrants”, as if they’re merely fed up with their current low-paying jobs and are just seeking a cushier one somewhere else, is, as I said, unmitigated bullshit. But they should be satisfied–nay, happy!–with “relative safety!” They sure as hell shouldn’t want anything beyond that. After all, they should know their place and be grateful! Right, **Terr**? ---
**Author:** ![elbows](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/b3f665/32.png) [@elbows](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elbows)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2015, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-images-of-drowned-little-boy/729826/39 "2015-09-03T20:50:09Z")
Well, Dude, I check CNN, Huffpost, Zite and several Daily papers, every morning. (Mostly international but also local!) it’s not like I’m living in some sheltered bubble or anything. All these sites had the photo, properly titled and a click away. When I don’t like how a site presents the news, I don’t return. Just that easy. Your complaint is with a single newsfeed that you are not forced to view. If you really wish to express your outrage, do so by not visiting their site again. ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2015, 8:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-images-of-drowned-little-boy/729826/40 "2015-09-03T20:51:35Z")
> [@andros](#): > > But they should be satisfied–nay, happy!–with “relative safety!” They sure as hell shouldn’t want anything beyond that. After all, they should know their place and be grateful! Right, **Terr**? I don’t fault people for wanting more. Everyone wants more. But I wouldn’t call someone who is fleeing economic hardship in Turkey in order to get to much cushier accommodations in Germany (passing, but not stopping in, Greece, Macedonia, Serbia and Hungary) a “refugee”. In fact, neither does EU. AFAIU, EU’s laws do not allow someone to claim asylum in an EU country different from the one he arrived at. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-images-of-drowned-little-boy/729826.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-images-of-drowned-little-boy/729826.md?page=3)