# I pit images of drowned little boy. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [September 3, 2015, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-images-of-drowned-little-boy/729826 "2015-09-03T17:31:21Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Steophan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steophan/32/9595_2.png) [@Steophan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steophan)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2015, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-images-of-drowned-little-boy/729826/61 "2015-09-03T22:41:41Z")
> [@A\_isha](#): > > Not only has Greece has taken in almost as many as Germany, the Eastern European countries are hideously xenophobic, have mistreated Syrians, and (in some cases) closed their borders to the refugees entirely. Poland, the Czech Republic, Bulgaria, and Slovakia, for instance, [are only willing to accept Syrian refugees if they’re non-Muslim.](http://qz.com/490973/these-european-countries-are-willing-to-accept-some-syrian-migrants-but-only-if-theyre-christian/) Which of those countries borders Syria? Any that don’t can freely choose who they want to enter the country. You seem to be confusing what you think the rules and laws _should_ be with what they actually are. ---
**Author:** ![lisiate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f05b48/32.png) [@lisiate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lisiate)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2015, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-images-of-drowned-little-boy/729826/62 "2015-09-03T22:47:56Z")
> [@psychobunny](#): > > In this case the family was not trying to go to the European countries listed above but to Canada because they had relatives there. They weren’t seeking to go someplace because it was a welfare state; they were trying to get someplace where they had family who could presumably provide them with shelter and help in establishing a life. Indeed, you can see Aylan’s aunt [talking about it here.](http://www.theguardian.com/world/video/2015/sep/03/aylans-aunt-emotional-appeal-refugees-mediterranean-crossing-video) They’d applied through the regular channels but been rejected. ---
**Author:** ![A\_isha](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9fc348/32.png) [@A\_isha](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/A_isha)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2015, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-images-of-drowned-little-boy/729826/63 "2015-09-03T22:59:26Z")
> [@Steophan](#): > > You seem to be confusing what you think the rules and laws _should_ be with what they actually are. Says the guy who thinks refugees should just sit there and accept maltreatment from a country that doesn’t follow the laws on the treatment of refugees and doesn’t even consider them refugees because, hey, they aren’t being _shot at_ any more. So I hope you’ll forgive me if I take your dedication to the rule of law regarding refugees less than seriously. ---
**Author:** ![Emiliana](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f0a364/32.png) [@Emiliana](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Emiliana)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2015, 11:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-images-of-drowned-little-boy/729826/64 "2015-09-03T23:50:14Z")
I’m sorry about your child, **lowdown**. When my kids were small, I too freaked out a bit more than usual about any tragedy involving young children. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 12:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-images-of-drowned-little-boy/729826/65 "2015-09-04T00:11:11Z")
> [@Steophan](#): > > The laws on claiming refugee status are quite clear, you go to the nearest safe country (as determined by the UN, not by posters on a message board who don’t like Turkey) and seek asylum there. Cite on the assertion that the UN determines which nearest country people may seek asylum in? ---
**Author:** ![elbows](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/b3f665/32.png) [@elbows](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elbows)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 12:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-images-of-drowned-little-boy/729826/66 "2015-09-04T00:19:45Z")
No, actually, she had applied for her other brother, but the forms were returned for being incomplete, actually. She was intending to, but hadn’t yet, filed for this family. Both federal and provincial governments have made it much more complicated to file the paperwork to bring over refugees. Including denying them medical coverage for several months! Unbelievably callous to make them wait months to qualify for needed medical attention. While two candidates are finally expressing outrage that we’re not doing more, our Prime minister maintains its more important we focus on fighting ISIS. But then he’s kind of a dick. ---
**Author:** ![Steophan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steophan/32/9595_2.png) [@Steophan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steophan)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 1:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-images-of-drowned-little-boy/729826/67 "2015-09-04T01:05:02Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > Cite on the assertion that the UN determines which nearest country people may seek asylum in? Are you serious? [http://lmgtfy.com/?q=unhcr](http://lmgtfy.com/?q=unhcr) ---
**Author:** ![A\_isha](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9fc348/32.png) [@A\_isha](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/A_isha)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 1:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-images-of-drowned-little-boy/729826/68 "2015-09-04T01:51:59Z")
> [@Steophan](#): > > Are you serious? > > [http://lmgtfy.com/?q=unhcr](http://lmgtfy.com/?q=unhcr) [http://www.unhcr.org/3f7aa8704.html](http://www.unhcr.org/3f7aa8704.html) > [@](#): > > With regard to the return of people to transit countries, UNHCR has suggested there should be “a meaningful link or connection that would make it reasonable for an applicant to seek asylum in that State… Mere transit through a third country does generally not constitute such a meaningful link.” ---
**Author:** ![Sitnam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Sitnam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sitnam)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 2:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-images-of-drowned-little-boy/729826/69 "2015-09-04T02:13:29Z")
The little boy’s death is a tragedy, this entire exodus is heartwrenching. Still, I’m glad the Greek officer had the presence of mind to not make this a juicer photo op by doing his best to carry the little guy away from the photographers. And that is what doesn’t sit well with me. This is a tragic circumstance of a tragic situation and yet there is an element of dehumanization in this specific coverage. ---
**Author:** ![Steophan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steophan/32/9595_2.png) [@Steophan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steophan)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 3:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-images-of-drowned-little-boy/729826/70 "2015-09-04T03:27:49Z")
> [@A\_isha](#): > > [http://www.unhcr.org/3f7aa8704.html](http://www.unhcr.org/3f7aa8704.html) Yep, that’s a link to the UNHCR where they set out their criteria for what is a safe country. Conveniently, it also points out that EU law requires refugees to seek asylum in the first safe country, or be returned to that country. It’s almost like I know what I’m talking about… But hey, keep pretending that Turkey isn’t a safe country for Muslims to flee to, and they need to come to the UK or Germany instead. ---
**Author:** ![even\_sven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/dfb087/32.png) [@even\_sven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/even_sven)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 5:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-images-of-drowned-little-boy/729826/71 "2015-09-04T05:56:58Z")
> [@Steophan](#): > > Yep, that’s a link to the UNHCR where they set out their criteria for what is a safe country. Conveniently, it also points out that EU law requires refugees to seek asylum in the first safe country, or be returned to that country. > > It’s almost like I know what I’m talking about… But hey, keep pretending that Turkey isn’t a safe country for Muslims to flee to, and they need to come to the UK or Germany instead. You said UN law requires refugees to stay in their country of first refuge. That’s not true. EU law does. ---
**Author:** ![Leaffan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leaffan/32/299_2.png) [@Leaffan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaffan)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 6:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-images-of-drowned-little-boy/729826/72 "2015-09-04T06:04:36Z")
> [@elbows](#): > > No, actually, she had applied for her other brother, but the forms were returned for being incomplete, actually. She was intending to, but hadn’t yet, filed for this family. > > Both federal and provincial governments have made it much more complicated to file the paperwork to bring over refugees. Including denying them medical coverage for several months! Unbelievably callous to make them wait months to qualify for needed medical attention. > > While two candidates are finally expressing outrage that we’re not doing more, our Prime minister maintains its more important we focus on fighting ISIS. But then he’s kind of a dick. No he isn’t. This is totally unwarranted and I just made up my mind to not stand for these attacks on our prime minister any more. I’m tired of it and I will defend him in every thread henceforth. He’s probably the best prime minister we’ve had in two generations. ---
**Author:** ![elbows](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/b3f665/32.png) [@elbows](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elbows)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 10:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-images-of-drowned-little-boy/729826/73 "2015-09-04T10:45:52Z")
Hey, you’re entitled to your opinion, have at it. Not sure this thread is the appropriate place but whatever. But, “No, he isn’t”, is not really a defence. Just sayin’! ---
**Author:** ![Leaffan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leaffan/32/299_2.png) [@Leaffan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaffan)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 10:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-images-of-drowned-little-boy/729826/74 "2015-09-04T10:54:27Z")
And “He’s kind of a dick” is your original proposition? Great. ---
**Author:** ![snowthx](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowthx/32/10660_2.png) [@snowthx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snowthx)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 12:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-images-of-drowned-little-boy/729826/75 "2015-09-04T12:24:16Z")
These people are displaced because their homes, schools, and places of business are all destroyed or over-run by the filth of humanity. Call them whatever you want - it’s easy for us on a message board to niggle over wording and minutia of treaties and international agreements while we sip coffee in the safety and security of our homes or offices, but the stark reality is that every day people are growing hungrier and more desperate to find safety and stability. It’s not like these families hatched a plan over dinner last night to see of they can get to one of those countries where they can suck off whitey’s hind teat. Eastern Europe appears to have rolled out the “un”-welcome mat, so it seems predictable refugees will try to move on to the next country on the map. Perhaps the image the OP references becomes a catalyst for nations and people like all of us to do something more. ---
**Author:** ![Moonshine](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/5e9695/32.png) [@Moonshine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moonshine)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 12:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-images-of-drowned-little-boy/729826/76 "2015-09-04T12:30:50Z")
Well, the shamefull assertion that a refugee only gets to go to the next country along before they count as a job-stealing, benefits-scrounging economic migrant certainly would work well for the UK, which doesn’t border any war torn countries. Let the Greeks, Italians and apparently the Turks (who aren’t even in the EU) deal with it… :smack: ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 1:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-images-of-drowned-little-boy/729826/77 "2015-09-04T13:04:05Z")
> [@Steophan](#): > > Are you serious? > > [http://lmgtfy.com/?q=unhcr](http://lmgtfy.com/?q=unhcr) First of all, you are a lazy asshole. If you asked me for a cite that murder is illegal, I would cite the law, not LMGTFY for “Department of Justice” and be all pissy about it. Second, your original statement either plainly said or strongly implied that the UN only allows refugees to seek asylum in certain countries. Do you mean to say that a Syrian refugee is prevented by the UN from seeking asylum in, say, the United States? ---
**Author:** ![phantom\_lamb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/5f9b8f/32.png) [@phantom\_lamb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/phantom_lamb)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 1:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-images-of-drowned-little-boy/729826/78 "2015-09-04T13:21:30Z")
I don’t know, it kind of bothers me that it’s entering into “internet clickbait” territory, but at the same time it bothers me a lot more that people are dying because of this and the fact that this child is dead. And I guess no response from the public at all is not exactly a better thing. So it’s a lose-lose, unless something actually gets done as a result of this. ---
**Author:** ![JoseB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/joseb/32/1530_2.png) [@JoseB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JoseB)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 1:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-images-of-drowned-little-boy/729826/79 "2015-09-04T13:26:02Z")
FWIW a couple of weeks ago (on August 24) Germany made use of the “sovereignty clause” of the Dublin convention, suspending it in respect of Syrian Nationals. The Dublin convention is the convention that specifies that refugees coming to an EU country must be processed in the country of entry in the EU, and that if they go to another EU country, the latter must send them back to the former for their asylum petition to be processed there. What Germany did was to say that, for Syrian nationals who present their asylum request in Germany after getting into the EU via some other country, Germany would NOT be sending them back to Greece (or wherever they first entered the EU) and would allow them to have their asylum request be processed in Germany itself. This applies only to Germany and only with respect to Syrian refugees, but it is an important measure, in any case. Relevant links: [First link, from the “asylum in Europe” webpage.](http://www.asylumineurope.org/news/24-08-2015/germany-halt-dublin-procedures-syrians) [Second link, from the “Washington Post”.](http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2015/08/26/germanys-small-yet-important-change-to-the-way-it-deals-with-syrian-refugees/) [Third link, from “The Guardian”.](http://www.theguardian.com/world/shortcuts/2015/sep/01/mama-merkel-the-compassionate-mother-of-syrian-refugees) Also, there is a popular movement in Germany (and now in my country of residence, the Netherlands) wherein people are volunteering to offer their home to house a refugee. The German organization coordinating this initiative said that the response had been so overwhelmingly positive that they were almost unable to deal with it. It appears that something is moving, if slowly and haltingly, and had been moving since before this poor kid drowned. As we say in Spanish, “menos da una piedra” (“it is at least something”). ---
**Author:** ![Whiskey\_Dickens](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/9fc348/32.png) [@Whiskey\_Dickens](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whiskey_Dickens)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 2:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-images-of-drowned-little-boy/729826/80 "2015-09-04T14:46:53Z")
> [@Leaffan](#): > > No he isn’t. This is totally unwarranted and I just made up my mind to not stand for these attacks on our prime minister any more. I’m tired of it and I will defend him in every thread henceforth. He’s probably the best prime minister we’ve had in two generations. Way to fight for the underdog in a comparison of ethics. You are truly the reason we can’t have nice things. Enjoy your politically motivated underfundings, backroom politics, cover ups, information request denials, and misleading robo calls while they last. Harper isn’t going to survive this election, and for good reason. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-images-of-drowned-little-boy/729826.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-images-of-drowned-little-boy/729826.md?page=5)