# I Pit Martin Hyde **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [June 16, 2021, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-martin-hyde/944407 "2021-06-16T16:18:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2021, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-martin-hyde/944407/41 "2021-06-16T18:35:24Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > Understanding that doesn’t make me think what happened was “okay,” or excusable, or cause me to categorize this as something other than genocide. But does it make you think that it wasn’t as bad as your originally thought it was? > [@Miller](#): > > Anyone going into a Holocaust thread and saying, “They didn’t kill _all_ the Jews” is being obviously disingenuous, because everyone knows that there are still Jewish people alive in the world. They also didn’t kill all the Jews in Germany. Does everyone know that there are still Jewish people living in Germany? ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2021, 7:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-martin-hyde/944407/42 "2021-06-16T19:02:13Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > But does it make you think that it wasn’t as bad as your originally thought it was? I still think it was genocide and an atrocity. Isn’t that bad enough? I don’t see any point in saying, “This was the worst genocide, and this was the _second_ worst genocide, and this was the _third_ worst…” but it’s still useful to understand the actual contours of what happened. > [@k9bfriender](#): > > They also didn’t kill all the Jews in Germany. Does everyone know that there are still Jewish people living in Germany? The distinction between “All the Jews in the world,” and “All the Jews in Germany,” is entirely meaningless to the point I was making. ---
**Author:** ![crowmanyclouds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crowmanyclouds/32/19884_2.png) [@crowmanyclouds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crowmanyclouds)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2021, 8:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-martin-hyde/944407/43 "2021-06-16T20:17:54Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > It is this bit that reveals how he feels about this board that intrigues me. {…} He’s felt that way for a looonnngg time! > [@Martin Hyde, you're a fucking idiot](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-hyde-youre-a-fucking-idiot/344078/80): > > {…} Also, the majority of this board is nothing but the representation of the worst and most despicable section of America. Degenerates, the mentally ill, the unwashed masses of extreme leftism that are literally a cancer upon mainstream society. The _more_ credible I’m held by a bunch of degenerates the worse off I am as a person. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2021, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-martin-hyde/944407/44 "2021-06-16T20:46:03Z")
Seems the only reason he is here is that he hates everyone on the SDMB, and so enters threads to pick fights, spew insults and then play the martyr. Seems like a shitty way to spend your free time but whatever. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2021, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-martin-hyde/944407/45 "2021-06-16T20:49:11Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > I don’t see any point in saying, “This was the worst genocide, and this was the _second_ worst genocide, and this was the _third_ worst…” But that’s not what is happening here. What happened was that it was claimed that _some_ of the children got to occasionally see their families, and that was meant as a counter to the point that white people don’t value the family structure of non-whites. > [@Miller](#): > > but it’s still useful to understand the actual contours of what happened. Sure, and in some contexts that is true. But when it is offered as a rebuttal as to the callousness with which the white people treated the indigenous, it’s not being offered simply as a means of describing the contours. > [@Miller](#): > > The distinction between “All the Jews in the world,” and “All the Jews in Germany,” is entirely meaningless to the point I was making. The distinction between children forcibly taken from their homes, and that some of the children were allowed to see their families occasionally was entirely meaningless to the point that @MandaJo was making. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2021, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-martin-hyde/944407/46 "2021-06-16T20:53:23Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > Seems the only reason he is here is that he hates everyone on the SDMB, and so enters threads to pick fights, spew insults and then play the martyr. As quickly as he turned to hostility and insults over a misunderstanding, it does seem as though his motive was to pick a fight, not have a productive conversation. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2021, 9:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-martin-hyde/944407/47 "2021-06-16T21:05:49Z")
All I can think of is this XKCD… > **[Sheeple](https://xkcd.com/610/)** > > Hey, what are the odds -- five Ayn Rand fans on the same train! Must be going to a convention. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2021, 9:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-martin-hyde/944407/48 "2021-06-16T21:24:53Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > As quickly as he turned to hostility and insults over a misunderstanding, it does seem as though his motive was to pick a fight, not have a productive conversation. That’s exactly where I was going to go from just reading the OP of this thread. Why in the world would @Martin_Hyde think that a post like this would help? If you think you’re being misunderstood, then the usual action is to try and make yourself understood better. It’s not to call everyone who disagrees with you sheep, or—far worse in my not so humble opinion—saying that anyone who disagrees with you has a mental illness. (Fuck acting like an illness is an insult!) I get needing to vent because it feels like people are willfully misunderstanding you. I feel that happens to me, too. I get that the topic at hand is a rather contentious topic where things get heated. But this type of response? I can’t say I read everything you wrote in that thread, @Martin_Hyde, as people were making me angry and so I left. But the posts I did read from you didn’t come across as badly as all this. I thought they were a bit naive, but not horrible. However, this response completely changed my mind about all of that. It seems we saw what you were really thinking the whole time. You were just posting to attack the leftists who dared considered this admitted genocide to be a horrible thing. You weren’t just trying to discuss the topic. You were trying to “slap sheep.” ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2021, 9:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-martin-hyde/944407/49 "2021-06-16T21:36:13Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > Anyone going into a Holocaust thread and saying, “They didn’t kill _all_ the Jews” is being obviously disingenuous, because everyone knows that there are still Jewish people alive in the world. The nature of the Canadian boarding school system and the specific ways they victimized native children are much less well known. Personally, I was not aware that some children were still allowed to have contact with their parents until I read **Martin** ’s post. Understanding that doesn’t make me think what happened was “okay,” or excusable, or cause me to categorize this as something other than genocide. The problem with an argument of ignorance is that the information about the subject was already available in the thread before the post, and was made clear after said post. Yet the response was not “Oh, I didn’t know that. It wasn’t to try and be more informed.” It was to get mad that anyone would dare get offended, and attack everyone who disagreed as sheep and mentally ill, while admitting their actual goal was to slap people rather than to actually discuss the topic. It’s one thing to be ignorant and willing to learn. It’s another to be defiantly ignorant on a topic that involves such a huge moral horror. Ignorance is only an excuse before the information has been spoonfed to you. And it’s definitely not an excuse to say the shit they are being pitted for. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2021, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-martin-hyde/944407/50 "2021-06-16T21:37:02Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > As quickly as he turned to hostility and insults over a misunderstanding, it does seem as though his motive was to pick a fight, not have a productive conversation. How many times do you someone should be accused of genocide denial before it’s acceptable to get angry about it? ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2021, 9:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-martin-hyde/944407/51 "2021-06-16T21:47:45Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > > [@k9bfriender](#): > > > > As quickly as he turned to hostility and insults over a misunderstanding, it does seem as though his motive was to pick a fight, not have a productive conversation. > > How many times do you think its appropriate to be accused of genocide denial before it’s acceptable to get angry about it? Since when is being angry an excuse to say that the only reason why you ever post here is to attack everyone on the left, calling us sheep and mentally ill? It feels like you’re ignoring the actual reason the poster was pitted. It’s not about being angry. It’s about admitting he was only here to troll. Your defense make no sense, as they clearly were not what he was thinking. He was thinking “I need to slap some leftist sheep.” He admitted that. If someone tells you their true motivations, you believe them. It’s bizarre to try and find excuses for them. @Martin_Hyde told us who he is, and why he’s here. ---
**Author:** ![Do\_Not\_Taunt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/do_not_taunt/32/2968_2.png) [@Do\_Not\_Taunt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Do_Not_Taunt)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2021, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-martin-hyde/944407/52 "2021-06-16T21:58:48Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > If someone tells you their true motivations, you believe them. It’s bizarre to try and find excuses for them. @Martin_Hyde told us who he is, and why he’s here. I found the quoted blurb in the OP to be quite disgusting, but this is in no way a reasonable restatement of what Martin said. He did not say that he’s only here (in that thread) to slap sheep, nor did he say that was his principal reason for beginning engagement with that thread. You’ve been an advocate of the principle of charity in the past - use it. The charitable, and IMHO reasonable, interpretation is, “I showed in in that thread to have a legitimate argument. Unfortunately, excessive group-think from the left made that impossible, so once that was clear, I was happy to slap the sheep around a bit.” Yeah, there are some problems with that, but not what you’re saying. ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2021, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-martin-hyde/944407/53 "2021-06-16T22:09:11Z")
> [@Do\_Not\_Taunt](#): > > He did not say that he’s only here (in that thread) to slap sheep, nor did he say that was his principal reason for beginning engagement with that thread. 15 years ago: > [@Martin Hyde, you're a fucking idiot](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/martin-hyde-youre-a-fucking-idiot/344078/80): > > the majority of this board is nothing but the representation of the worst and most despicable section of America. Degenerates, the mentally ill, the unwashed masses of extreme leftism that are literally a cancer upon mainstream society. Five hours ago: > [@How is genocide defined, with an emphasis on cultural genocide?](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-genocide-defined-with-an-emphasis-on-cultural-genocide/944198/137): > > at its core there are always threads like this one that remind that this is a den of groupthink lefties that get really mad and hateful if you disagree with them even in part. ---
**Author:** ![Do\_Not\_Taunt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/do_not_taunt/32/2968_2.png) [@Do\_Not\_Taunt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Do_Not_Taunt)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2021, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-martin-hyde/944407/54 "2021-06-16T22:11:31Z")
And ? ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2021, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-martin-hyde/944407/55 "2021-06-16T22:13:37Z")
Why bother participating in such a thread in “a den of groupthink lefties” if the goal wasn’t “sheep slapping” from the beginning? ---
**Author:** ![Do\_Not\_Taunt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/do_not_taunt/32/2968_2.png) [@Do\_Not\_Taunt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Do_Not_Taunt)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2021, 10:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-martin-hyde/944407/56 "2021-06-16T22:14:42Z")
Look, I’m not Martin Hyde. I can only guess. Maybe it’s this part? > [@How is genocide defined, with an emphasis on cultural genocide?](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-genocide-defined-with-an-emphasis-on-cultural-genocide/944198/112): > > I try to find discussions with those who are not [bleating sheep] ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2021, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-martin-hyde/944407/57 "2021-06-16T22:18:19Z")
> [@Do\_Not\_Taunt](#): > > Maybe it’s this part? In his own words, the majority are bleating sheep so finding such a discussion – especially in the Pit – would be rather difficult for him. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2021, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-martin-hyde/944407/58 "2021-06-16T22:19:51Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > How many times do you someone should be accused of genocide denial before it’s acceptable to get angry about it? One time more than whatever the arbitrary threshold is for **Banquet\_Bear** to not get angry, and not a post less… ---
**Author:** ![Do\_Not\_Taunt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/do_not_taunt/32/2968_2.png) [@Do\_Not\_Taunt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Do_Not_Taunt)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2021, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-martin-hyde/944407/59 "2021-06-16T22:20:32Z")
Maybe he likes a challenge? Look, I don’t know. Ask him. But don’t pretend that the very words he wrote here prove that his only intent is sheep slapping. That’s just not what he wrote. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2021, 10:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-martin-hyde/944407/60 "2021-06-16T22:22:14Z")
No, he’s also here for the ~~bear fucking~~ hunting… [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-martin-hyde/944407.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-martin-hyde/944407.md?page=4)