# I Pit people who misrepresent Christianity as polytheistic **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [December 17, 2009, 4:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-people-who-misrepresent-christianity-as-polytheistic/521594 "2009-12-17T04:10:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![The\_Urban\_Spaceman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8c91f0/32.png) [@The\_Urban\_Spaceman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Urban_Spaceman)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2009, 8:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-people-who-misrepresent-christianity-as-polytheistic/521594/81 "2009-12-17T08:49:07Z")
> [@Measure\_for\_Measure](#): > > Ok, but it’s not arbitrary: it’s mainstream Christian doctrine. Or rather it’s only arbitrary in the sense that the edges of any definition are arbitrary. The doctrine is arbitrary, not as a result of language-games, but because any number of conflicting positions can be justified according to various passages of scripture. Unless God is directly involved in the divination of this decision, it has no solid theological basis, and instead relies on human agency. ---
**Author:** ![DanBlather](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/f4b2a3/32.png) [@DanBlather](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DanBlather)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2009, 9:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-people-who-misrepresent-christianity-as-polytheistic/521594/82 "2009-12-17T09:03:01Z")
> [@The\_Second\_Stone](#): > > I > Christianity is a monotheistic religion. Nobody within the religion contends that there is more than one diety, and the only outsiders who contend otherwise are ignorant, which may be forgiven Does God count as being inside the religion? He said that he is a jealous god, so who is he jealous of if not other gods? Then he said to have no other gods before him. That is odd wording unless he thought there were other gods that could be put before him. Now I know that people like you think that the Bibles is not literal and can be interpreted to “meet the times”, but who are you to doubt God’s word? He said, I believe it, case closed. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2009, 9:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-people-who-misrepresent-christianity-as-polytheistic/521594/83 "2009-12-17T09:05:40Z")
> [@The\_Second\_Stone](#): > > 99.999% of the world’s Christians are not Fred Phelps and his ilk. Some are ignorant and culturally self centered and superior, but most Christians want to take Christ’s commandments and teachings to be good to each other seriously. I understand and sympathize that a lot of people have been hurt by people acting under the color of Christian authority and that they want some justice. But hurting people deliberately who did not do that injustice isn’t going to get justice or comfort, it will only hurt someone else. Being so ultrasensitive that a disagreement over nomenclature “hurts” them isn’t my problem. And the vast majority of them certainly aren’t going to be anything but nasty to me and my fellow unbelievers, so I see no reason to pander to them like you want me to. And following Christianity doesn’t as a rule involve being “good to each other”. Christianity is not and never has been a nice thing to be. Or in other words, I really don’t care if I hurt the feelings of hypersensitive followers of a nasty guilt-and-death cult who aren’t ever going to like me anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2009, 9:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-people-who-misrepresent-christianity-as-polytheistic/521594/84 "2009-12-17T09:09:09Z")
> [@Measure\_for\_Measure](#): > > Was the Trinity a compromise between 2 groups or a larger number of POVs? Reading Wikipedia, it seems that the heretical Arius was concerned about a possible re-emergence of the heretical doctrine of [Sabellianism](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sabellianism), which posited that the Trinity was in the eye of the believer and not a characteristic of God himself. So the 3 in 1 controversy at least predated Arius. (Not that DtC said otherwise). > [@Spaceman](#): > > The doctrine is arbitrary, not as a result of language-games, but because any number of conflicting positions can be justified according to various passages of scripture. Unless God is directly involved in the divination of this decision, it has no solid theological basis, and instead relies on human agency. I agree with the “Conflicting positions can be justified” part, but disagree that “No solid theological basis” exists. That does not follow. By analogy, conflicting passages of law and precedent can be found, but some legal opinions can nonetheless have more solid grounding than others. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2009, 9:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-people-who-misrepresent-christianity-as-polytheistic/521594/85 "2009-12-17T09:23:38Z")
> [@Measure\_for\_Measure](#): > > I agree with the “Conflicting positions can be justified” part, but disagree that “No solid theological basis” exists. What constitutes a solid theological basis? ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2009, 9:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-people-who-misrepresent-christianity-as-polytheistic/521594/86 "2009-12-17T09:28:47Z")
> [@The\_Second\_Stone](#): > > It has nothing to do with logic, it is a religion. Oh, man, I needed a new sig quote… ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2009, 9:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-people-who-misrepresent-christianity-as-polytheistic/521594/87 "2009-12-17T09:33:35Z")
> [@The\_Second\_Stone](#): > > They should not be instigated simply to amuse oneself, divide one’s enemies or for other reasons. Fuck religion. It’s getting the respect it deserves. And I wouldn’t stir up religious strife just to amuse myself. I’d do it to amuse myself A LOT. > [@](#): > > Such misrepresentation of a religion is disgusting and the people who do it beneath contempt. Your _mom_ is beneath contempt. ---
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2009, 9:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-people-who-misrepresent-christianity-as-polytheistic/521594/88 "2009-12-17T09:44:54Z")
> [@The\_Second\_Stone](#): > > The thing I don’t get is when did it become acceptable to go around picking fights with other people’s religious concepts and mocking them in public out of any context? I did some digging: Here’s a 1999 SDMB Xtian thread: [What if God was one of us?](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=173) 2001: [How much do believers believe in what?](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/archive/index.php/t-91246.html) 2004: [Believers](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/archive/index.php/t-277221.html) But here’s a 2005 SDMB Xtian thread: > **[Dying for our sins...for three days?](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=346767)** > > I may be wrong, but I understand it to be that supposedly Christ died for our sins. He then rose from his grave three days later. I’m confused as to what part of this was sacrifice. I mean, yes, he was tortured horribly, and I presume as he took... and [Why do people still believe in God?](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/archive/index.php/t-350196.html) ## Here’s an even-keeled 2007 SDMB thread: [Christian salvation theology; why so complicated?](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/archive/index.php/t-410031.html) I’ll opine that **Der Trihs** has been hostile to religion since his arrival (and probably before!). But perhaps the anti-religious pile-ons are of a more recent vintage. It could be as late as 2007-08. This might be an interesting topic for another thread. **Brian**? **Czarcasm**? Creationists have been roasted here since I’ve joined. But when did a more mainline religious POV become subject to vituperative attack here by multiple posters in a single thread? ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2009, 9:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-people-who-misrepresent-christianity-as-polytheistic/521594/89 "2009-12-17T09:56:39Z")
> [@Measure\_for\_Measure](#): > > But when did a more mainline religious POV become subject to vituperative attack here by multiple posters in a single thread? Since someone started a thread insisting that an argument over definitions is bigoted, an attack, and dishonest. The OP was insulting and silly, and therefore drew insults and disrespect as return fire. ---
**Author:** ![I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/i_love_me_vol.i/32/521_2.png) [@I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/I_Love_Me_Vol.I)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2009, 11:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-people-who-misrepresent-christianity-as-polytheistic/521594/90 "2009-12-17T11:06:22Z")
> [@The\_Second\_Stone](#): > > In this thread various posters opine that they think Christianity is polytheistic. [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=11897001#post11897001](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=11897001#post11897001) > > They do this with the anonymity of the internet and in my opinion it is nothing but trolling to stir up religious quarrels. Religious quarrels are, as has been pointed out, dangerous and deadly. They should not be instigated simply to amuse oneself, divide one’s enemies or for other reasons. > > Christianity is a monotheistic religion. Nobody within the religion contends that there is more than one diety, and the only outsiders who contend otherwise are ignorant, which may be forgiven, or trying to stir up religious quarrels for their own purposes. > > Such misrepresentation of a religion is disgusting and the people who do it beneath contempt. But seriously… what does it matter whether your religion is a nutty cult that believes in _one_ invisible story-book fantasy, or a nutty cult that believes in a multitude of them? Don’t take it too personally-- none of it makes much sense to thoughtful humans. I wouldn’t worry about it too much. Either way you’re still basing your life on a ancient fairy-tale and the last laugh is, unfortunately, on you. The details of your misinformed delusions don’t really matter too much, do they? There is still time to repent. I hope you find the more meaningful life. Seriously. ---
**Author:** ![I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/i_love_me_vol.i/32/521_2.png) [@I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/I_Love_Me_Vol.I)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2009, 11:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-people-who-misrepresent-christianity-as-polytheistic/521594/91 "2009-12-17T11:18:36Z")
And, honestly, Second Stone, I truly mean only the best when I wrote those things in my previous post. It is out of the power of Universal Love that I beseech you. I fervently wish only to spread the Good News: You don’t have to be a slave to superstition. There is a Rich and Abundant life out there for you if only you ask forgiveness and for Logic and Rationality to save you. I know it is not easy, but you have the Power and the Will to find the strength within yourself that you may be Released-- that you will at last be set free. I send you my fervent hopes that you will see the Light and find the one and only Truth. ---
**Author:** ![I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/i_love_me_vol.i/32/521_2.png) [@I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/I_Love_Me_Vol.I)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2009, 11:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-people-who-misrepresent-christianity-as-polytheistic/521594/92 "2009-12-17T11:32:40Z")
> [@SteveG1](#): > > And what happens then? The State becomes the new god. The State tells you what to believe and what not to believe, what to think and what not to think, and steps on you if you don’t obey. > > Sorry, but I don’t trust The State. Dude…I’ll take the State over Religion any day. As fucked up as it may be, it at least exists in the realm of the real. ---
**Author:** ![jjimm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba8739/32.png) [@jjimm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jjimm)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2009, 11:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-people-who-misrepresent-christianity-as-polytheistic/521594/93 "2009-12-17T11:39:28Z")
Can I pit deists who claim that Hinduism is a monotheistic religion? Please? ---
**Author:** ![Rune](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e68b1a/32.png) [@Rune](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rune)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2009, 11:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-people-who-misrepresent-christianity-as-polytheistic/521594/94 "2009-12-17T11:52:43Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > To a lot of Jews and Muslims, the Trinity is polytheistic no matter how much Christians try to say that it isn’t. It’s certainly fair to say that they’re wrong or don’t understand, but they’re not trolling, it’s what they really believe. To a lot of Christians Islam is polytheistic moon sect worshipping the dual deities of Muhammed/Allah and Judaism is an imperfection only made whole by embracing Jesus. People can believe and say what they want as long as they don’t go into whine mode when they get back the same. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2009, 12:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-people-who-misrepresent-christianity-as-polytheistic/521594/95 "2009-12-17T12:03:50Z")
> [@The\_Second\_Stone](#): > > As for the Incoherent thread, yes, the concept is not clear. But that doesn’t require its open mocking. No, open mockery isn’t required for a concept that’s unclear. But that’s not the case in this case; by your own admission in _ **this** _ thread, the concept is illogical and doesn’t make sense. There’s nothing “unclear” about that; you’re quite openly providing the exact terms with which I’d describe your belief. There’s nothing _ **at all** _ unclear about beliefs that are illogical and don’t make sense; they get mocked all the time. > [@](#): > > most Christians want to take Christ’s commandments and teachings to be good to each other seriously. I understand and sympathize that a lot of people have been hurt by people acting under the color of Christian authority and that they want some justice. But hurting people deliberately who did not do that injustice isn’t going to get justice or comfort, it will only hurt someone else. But I’m not trying to hurt anyone, sure as I’ve never been hurt by people acting under color of Christian authority. In fact, I _ **already** _ rather like the Christian teachings that involve being good, and naturally recommend that you turn the other cheek while forgiving us seven-times-seventy times instead of returning perceived insults with intentional ones. My problem isn’t Christian morality _ **or** _ Christians who hurt people. My problem is an illogical concept that makes no sense. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2009, 12:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-people-who-misrepresent-christianity-as-polytheistic/521594/96 "2009-12-17T12:26:15Z")
> [@Measure\_for\_Measure](#): > > **Brian**? **Czarcasm**? Creationists have been roasted here since I’ve joined. But when did a more mainline religious POV become subject to vituperative attack here by multiple posters in a single thread? What attack? I’m just pointing out what _I_ believe is a problem with the claim that Christianity is a monotheistic religion-the ignoring of its roots, and the wand-waving about angels, devils and sons of a god not being considered minor gods as they would certainly be called if this were just another ancient religion that no one follows any more. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2009, 2:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-people-who-misrepresent-christianity-as-polytheistic/521594/97 "2009-12-17T14:54:20Z")
> [@Rune](#): > > To a lot of Christians Islam is polytheistic moon sect worshipping the dual deities of Muhammed/Allah and Judaism is an imperfection only made whole by embracing Jesus. People can believe and say what they want as long as they don’t go into whine mode when they get back the same. The moon god thing was made up by Jack Chick and has no basis in any real Islamic history or theology. It’s not comparable to the observation that Christianity recognizes more than one deity, because that observation is based on fact, and the moon god thing is not. ---
**Author:** ![crowmanyclouds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crowmanyclouds/32/19884_2.png) [@crowmanyclouds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crowmanyclouds)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2009, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-people-who-misrepresent-christianity-as-polytheistic/521594/98 "2009-12-17T15:03:44Z")
> [@Tamerlane](#): > > … Maimonides … > [@The\_Second\_Stone](#): > > … a complete and exhaustive philosophical disproof … was done by Parker and Stone in a South Park … > [@Tamerlane](#): > > … Maimonides … > [@The\_Second\_Stone](#): > > … Parker and Stone in a South Park … > [@Tamerlane](#): > > … Maimonides … > [@The\_Second\_Stone](#): > > … South Park … [open mockery] Well I’m convinced. [/open mockery] CMC fnord! ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2009, 3:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-people-who-misrepresent-christianity-as-polytheistic/521594/99 "2009-12-17T15:21:22Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > The moon god thing was made up by Jack Chick and has no basis in any real Islamic history or theology. It’s not comparable to the observation that Christianity recognizes more than one deity, because that observation is based on fact, and the moon god thing is not. Well, not exactly - by which I mean, not made up out of whole cloth, but just a gross misreading of pre-islamic Arabian history - still, I don’t think Chick was the one that made it up, I think he was repeating Robert Morey’s conflation of Hubal with Allah. ---
**Author:** ![Trepa\_Mayfield](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/edb3f5/32.png) [@Trepa\_Mayfield](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trepa_Mayfield)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2009, 3:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-people-who-misrepresent-christianity-as-polytheistic/521594/100 "2009-12-17T15:22:10Z")
There really hasn’t been much mocking in this thread. Allow me to rectify that. **The Second Stone** , you might want to skip over this before you get the vapors. So Tiger Woods, Jesus, and an old man are out playing golf. They’re at the fifth hole–a tricky 5-par. Tiger steps up to the tee. He swings. It’s a beautiful shot! It goes quite far, clearing the trees and the water trap, and landing on the fairway right next to the green. Then Jesus steps up to the tee. He swings. It’s a wonderful shot! The spin is perfect, the angle is sublime, and the power is incredible. It easily clears all obstacles and lands directly on the green, only two feet from the cup. Then the old man steps up to the tee. He swings. It’s a horrible shot! He sliced it way off, low power, and it heads straight for the water hazard. At which point it’s eaten by a fish. The fish jumps up, and is grabbed by an eagle. The eagle flies off, but crashes into a tree, which causes the fish to spit out the ball on the rough. Then a branch breaks off the tree, crashing into the ball and making it jump over the sand trap and right into the cup. Jesus turns to the old man and says, “Way to show off, _Dad_”. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-people-who-misrepresent-christianity-as-polytheistic/521594.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-people-who-misrepresent-christianity-as-polytheistic/521594.md?page=6)