# I pit Rick Scott, the FL GOP, and their blatant attempt to suppress voting rights **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [May 20, 2011, 1:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-rick-scott-the-fl-gop-and-their-blatant-attempt-to-suppress-voting-rights/582526 "2011-05-20T01:32:10Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2011, 5:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-rick-scott-the-fl-gop-and-their-blatant-attempt-to-suppress-voting-rights/582526/61 "2011-05-24T17:33:19Z")
> [@Zeriel](#): > > I think you can argue that “my rights” can be fairly defined as “the current things I am allowed to do under law”. Obviously it’s not a razor-fine legal definition, but given that definition does it make sense? > > Case in point, let’s adjust your analogy. State A and State B don’t allow concealed-carry of firearms. No one has the right to carry concealed firearms. State B allows it, then, and its residents gain the right to carry concealed firearms. State A residents do not have that right. State B revokes their concealed-carry law. State B can be said to have taken away the right to concealed carry, IMHO. > > I want to say this sounds like the difference between how we’d discuss legal rights vs. moral rights. I agree with you. I think I’d object to someone saying, though, that State B has attempted to suppress concealed carry rights, even though I’d agree that they have taken away a right to carry concealed. The reason is that the two phrases convey a dramatically different message. The first suggests that there is some baseline standard for concealed carry which should be present, and which State B has abrogated. The second phrasing simply acknowledges that State B has eliminated a legal right to carry concealed, without a concommittant sense that this ability is part of the pantheon of human natural rights. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2011, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-rick-scott-the-fl-gop-and-their-blatant-attempt-to-suppress-voting-rights/582526/62 "2011-05-24T17:36:28Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > I see. So, you would much prefer that we focus our conversation on abstract political theory, rather than the sordid reality of Republican skulduggery? And when you say that you won’t debate whether or not it is “unfair and unwise”, may we take that to mean that you accept that it is, or simply that you find such a debate tiresome? I meant that such a debate would be tiresome, but since you have this incredible fascination with my views – I assume you’re writing the Unauthorized Biography of Bricker – I will reveal the tantilizing detail that I don’t believe it’s unfair but do believe it’s unwise. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2011, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-rick-scott-the-fl-gop-and-their-blatant-attempt-to-suppress-voting-rights/582526/63 "2011-05-24T20:19:05Z")
Tantalizing, I suppose, in that it implies much but clarifies nothing. Must all conversations with you take the form of the Dance of the Seven Veils? ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2011, 9:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-rick-scott-the-fl-gop-and-their-blatant-attempt-to-suppress-voting-rights/582526/64 "2011-05-24T21:32:16Z")
> [@mhendo](#): > > One thing i’ve always been amazed about in the United States is how poorly-organized and managed how controversial the whole voting procedure seems to be in many cases. You’re talking about a country that gets indignant about requiring someone to show ID to vote. Anything other than that is minor IMO. I once went to the polls to find out that I had already voted!! :eek: I had to demand that they look at my ID and then all I got was a provisional ballot. This is a tempest in a teapot when it comes to real voting issues. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2011, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-rick-scott-the-fl-gop-and-their-blatant-attempt-to-suppress-voting-rights/582526/65 "2011-05-24T23:26:15Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Still, by even a generous allowance for ‘right,’ I can’t wrap my head around the concept that State A and State B, which both offer voting only on Election Day, are not violating the voting rights of their residents, but when State B changes its law to allow early voting at the polls, State A is still not violating any rights, and when State B changes its scheme again to be identical to State A’s, somehow, State B’s residents’ rights are violated. You’re not a big fan of the concept of “ratcheting,” apparently, but it’s difficult to take seriously the implication that you can’t wrap your head around the idea. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2011, 3:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-rick-scott-the-fl-gop-and-their-blatant-attempt-to-suppress-voting-rights/582526/66 "2011-05-25T15:27:25Z")
Meanwhile, [Scott’s approval rating has dropped to 29%, and the state legislature’s rating is down to 27%.](http://www.news-press.com/article/20110525/NEWS0107/110525005/0/GRANDEUR/Poll-Scott-approval-rate-hits-new-low?odyssey=nav%7Chead) ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2011, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-rick-scott-the-fl-gop-and-their-blatant-attempt-to-suppress-voting-rights/582526/67 "2011-05-25T15:28:57Z")
> [@kaylasdad99](#): > > You’re not a big fan of the concept of “ratcheting,” apparently, but it’s difficult to take seriously the implication that you can’t wrap your head around the idea. Very well. I CAN wrap my head around the idea, but having done so, I reject it as a useful model. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2011, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-rick-scott-the-fl-gop-and-their-blatant-attempt-to-suppress-voting-rights/582526/68 "2011-05-25T15:30:27Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Meanwhile, [Scott’s approval rating has dropped to 29%, and the state legislature’s rating is down to 27%.](http://www.news-press.com/article/20110525/NEWS0107/110525005/0/GRANDEUR/Poll-Scott-approval-rate-hits-new-low?odyssey=nav%7Chead) Post hoc, ergo propter hoc? ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2011, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-rick-scott-the-fl-gop-and-their-blatant-attempt-to-suppress-voting-rights/582526/69 "2011-05-25T15:43:17Z")
It’s traditional for one party to make a connection _before_ the other party rubbishes it. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2011, 3:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-rick-scott-the-fl-gop-and-their-blatant-attempt-to-suppress-voting-rights/582526/70 "2011-05-25T15:56:09Z")
Well, now,he has a point! It isn’t necessarily the case that this dramatic drop has anything at all to do with this issue in particular. There is an enormous amount of slimey shit slithering from the Florida GOP, you can’t actually prove that this _particular_ issue is the one that’s causing a massive group-puke on the part of Floridians. Once again, **Bricker** points out that even though the current crop of Republicans are the dumbest, slimiest, most ignorance-friendly bunch of knuckle-walking goons evah, Democrats are not right about every single thing. Good catch, **Bricker**! ---
**Author:** ![Sinaptics](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/278dde/32.png) [@Sinaptics](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sinaptics)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2011, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-rick-scott-the-fl-gop-and-their-blatant-attempt-to-suppress-voting-rights/582526/71 "2011-05-25T17:52:41Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > Well, now,he has a point! It isn’t necessarily the case that this dramatic drop has anything at all to do with this issue in particular. There is an enormous amount of slimey shit slithering from the Florida GOP, you can’t actually prove that this _particular_ issue is the one that’s causing a massive group-puke on the part of Floridians. > > Once again, **Bricker** points out that even though the current crop of Republicans are the dumbest, slimiest, most ignorance-friendly bunch of knuckle-walking goons evah, Democrats are not right about every single thing. > > Good catch, **Bricker**! Way to take the liberal point of view. It could also very well be that Floridians thought the abortion, vote restricting, and other legislation didn’t go far enough. If they’d just make it illegal for women who’ve had abortions to vote, they’d be seeing approval ratings in the 120’s. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2011, 6:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-rick-scott-the-fl-gop-and-their-blatant-attempt-to-suppress-voting-rights/582526/72 "2011-05-25T18:16:26Z")
> [@Sinaptics](#): > > Way to take the liberal point of view. It could also very well be that Floridians thought the abortion, vote restricting, and other legislation didn’t go far enough. If they’d just make it illegal for women who’ve had abortions to vote, they’d be seeing approval ratings in the 120’s. Up yours, buddy. We’re not _all_ knuckle-dragging mouthbreathers. Some of us are just regular mouthbreathers. ---
**Author:** ![LouisB](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/dfb087/32.png) [@LouisB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LouisB)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2011, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-rick-scott-the-fl-gop-and-their-blatant-attempt-to-suppress-voting-rights/582526/73 "2011-05-25T18:26:42Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Post hoc, ergo propter hoc? For the benefit of a member of the great unwashed, what the hell does this mean? ---
**Author:** ![Zeriel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/58956e/32.png) [@Zeriel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeriel)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2011, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-rick-scott-the-fl-gop-and-their-blatant-attempt-to-suppress-voting-rights/582526/74 "2011-05-25T18:30:13Z")
> [@LouisB](#): > > For the benefit of a member of the great unwashed, what the hell does this mean? Roughly, “Just because Event B happened after Event A doesn’t mean that A caused B.” The implication of that specific latin in logic/debate is “You’ve established the order of two events, but until you establish a basis for believing A caused B, you can’t say it’s relevant.” ---
**Author:** ![Sinaptics](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/278dde/32.png) [@Sinaptics](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sinaptics)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2011, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-rick-scott-the-fl-gop-and-their-blatant-attempt-to-suppress-voting-rights/582526/75 "2011-05-25T18:31:13Z")
> [@LouisB](#): > > For the benefit of a member of the great unwashed, what the hell does this mean? [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Post\_hoc\_ergo\_propter\_hoc](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Post_hoc_ergo_propter_hoc) It’s a logical fallacy. The actual translation is “after this, therefore because of this.” ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2011, 6:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-rick-scott-the-fl-gop-and-their-blatant-attempt-to-suppress-voting-rights/582526/76 "2011-05-25T18:36:54Z")
> [@LouisB](#): > > For the benefit of a member of the great unwashed, what the hell does this mean? “Bricker’s being a git again.” ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2011, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-rick-scott-the-fl-gop-and-their-blatant-attempt-to-suppress-voting-rights/582526/77 "2011-05-25T19:07:02Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > It’s traditional for one party to make a connection _before_ the other party rubbishes it. I had a question mark there. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2011, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-rick-scott-the-fl-gop-and-their-blatant-attempt-to-suppress-voting-rights/582526/78 "2011-05-25T19:09:45Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > “Bricker’s being a git again.” But since you said this, let me ask you what the relevance of your approval ratings post was. Just decided to drop in to a random thread and share the news, didja? Probably pure chance it was this thread and not one about the literary legacy of Increase Mather, huh? ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2011, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-rick-scott-the-fl-gop-and-their-blatant-attempt-to-suppress-voting-rights/582526/79 "2011-05-25T19:21:02Z")
There’s a thread about the literary legacy of Increase Mather? Oh, BOY! Linky, please? ---
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2011, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-rick-scott-the-fl-gop-and-their-blatant-attempt-to-suppress-voting-rights/582526/80 "2011-05-25T20:10:38Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > “Bricker’s being a git again.” I believe the phrase you’re looking for is “Same shithead, different thread”. -Joe [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-rick-scott-the-fl-gop-and-their-blatant-attempt-to-suppress-voting-rights/582526.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-rick-scott-the-fl-gop-and-their-blatant-attempt-to-suppress-voting-rights/582526.md?page=5)