# I pit Robbie Roberston of The Band **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [March 22, 2020, 1:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-robbie-roberston-of-the-band/850000 "2020-03-22T01:47:46Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 15\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2020, 11:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-robbie-roberston-of-the-band/850000/21 "2020-03-24T23:27:15Z")
This is really more Cafe Society than Pit material, harsh language notwithstanding. ---
**Author:** ![Jack\_Burden](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/958977/32.png) [@Jack\_Burden](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jack_Burden)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2020, 12:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-robbie-roberston-of-the-band/850000/22 "2020-03-25T00:46:27Z")
> [@Baal\_Houtham](#): > > As others have mentioned, you’re misinterpreting the title. And can I get a cite that Robertson has spent decades pretending that the other guys were just his backing band? > > I’d put Robertson’s guitar playing well above mediocre/average. When I watch Last Waltz the guitar is a consistent joy for me — along with a lot of other things. (Garth’s fills, Rick and Levon’s singing, Levon’s drumming.) Here’s a link to [It Makes No Difference](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=rP7r12Rg490); I think Robbie shines, altho Rick is amazing and Garth’s sax is the perfect finish Agreed. When Clapton is playing on The Last Waltz, just he’s going into his solo, his guitar strap breaks and he calls out “Rob”. Robertson seamlessly switches from rhythm to lead and blazes through the solo, then just as easily switches back when Clapton is ready. Whatever his issues with his band mates (and that appears a two way street), the man is far from mediocre on guitar. It is acknowledged that his vocals aren’t up to the level of the rest and frequently his mic would be turned off. But also give him credit for being the driving force behind that great movie getting made. ---
**Author:** ![EinsteinsHund](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/einsteinshund/32/8400_2.png) [@EinsteinsHund](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EinsteinsHund)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2020, 3:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-robbie-roberston-of-the-band/850000/23 "2020-03-25T03:20:34Z")
Whatever bad blood was spilled after their break up, there can’t be any doubt that the five guys of the Crackers/Hawks/Band were one of the best and most of all most original combinations of musicians a rhythm and blues or rock’n’roll band ever had. Of course that includes the lead guitar player and major songwriter. According to Bob Dylan, Robbie Robertson was a mathematical guitar genius, and like in all apparently outrageous statements by Dylan from the time, there’s a lot of truth in it. ---
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2020, 3:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-robbie-roberston-of-the-band/850000/24 "2020-03-25T03:31:08Z")
> [@Jack\_Burden](#): > > Agreed. When Clapton is playing on The Last Waltz, just he’s going into his solo, his guitar strap breaks and he calls out “Rob”. Robertson seamlessly switches from rhythm to lead and blazes through the solo, then just as easily switches back when Clapton is ready. Whatever his issues with his band mates (and that appears a two way street), the man is far from mediocre on guitar. Can be seen [here](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=78gR3Dlj7l0). Clapton definitely outplays him IMHO - he’s considerably more fluid. But then you’d kind of expect him to, it’s sorta what he was known for ;). In context Robertson absolutely holds up just fine. He wasn’t a guitar hero per se, but he was certainly a big step up from mediocre. ---
**Author:** ![EinsteinsHund](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/einsteinshund/32/8400_2.png) [@EinsteinsHund](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EinsteinsHund)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2020, 3:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-robbie-roberston-of-the-band/850000/25 "2020-03-25T03:55:19Z")
> [@Tamerlane](#): > > Can be seen [here](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=78gR3Dlj7l0). Clapton definitely outplays him IMHO - he’s considerably more fluid. But then you’d kind of expect him to, it’s sorta what he was known for ;). In context Robertson absolutely holds up just fine. He wasn’t a guitar hero per se, but he was certainly a big step up from mediocre. Eric Clapton has faster fingers and plays more fluently, but Robbie accentuates each note more and is one of the very few guitar players who has his own distinct tone, even more so than Clapton who’s technically better. The only one I know who comes close to his tone and playing is John Platania, and it’s no great miracle that Van Morrison, who was an early cohort of the Band, often worked successfully with Platania. ---
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2020, 6:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-robbie-roberston-of-the-band/850000/26 "2020-03-25T06:52:55Z")
> [@EinsteinsHund](#): > > The only one I know who comes close to his tone and playing is John Platania, and it’s no great miracle that Van Morrison, who was an early cohort of the Band, often worked successfully with Platania. Interesting comparison because I really love the earlier Morrison albums in particular, but out of all of that stable of musicians I never could muster up much love for Platania. Especially on the live _It’s Too Late to Stop Now_, where he really kinda underwhelmed me. Horse for courses, naturally. ETA: Oh and I disagree about Clapton not having a distinct tone. One might argue he has had more than one, but 1970/80’s’s Clapton in particular always sounds instantly like 1970’s/80’s Clapton to me. However he had that black strat dialed in, it was instantly recognizable. ---
**Author:** ![jsc1953](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/5daacb/32.png) [@jsc1953](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jsc1953)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2020, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-robbie-roberston-of-the-band/850000/27 "2020-03-25T18:31:08Z")
> [@Tamerlane](#): > > Can be seen [here](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=78gR3Dlj7l0). Clapton definitely outplays him IMHO - he’s considerably more fluid. But then you’d kind of expect him to, it’s sorta what he was known for ;). In context Robertson absolutely holds up just fine. He wasn’t a guitar hero per se, but he was certainly a big step up from mediocre. My favorite moment of the documentary was Clapton telling the story of how he went to Woodstock, working up the courage to ask if he could join the Band…“maybe you could use another rhythm guitar?” High praise. I knew little about The Band going in, other than a passing acquaintance with their greatest hits. I thoroughly enjoyed it, and it inspired me to watch The Last Waltz. But it’s very much Robertson’s story, with no attempt at multiple viewpoints (mostly, because the others have all passed)…although it’s noteworthy that Garth Wilson is still here and didn’t participate. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2020, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-robbie-roberston-of-the-band/850000/28 "2020-03-25T18:48:25Z")
> [@Hatchie](#): > > _ **I pit Robbie Robertson of The Band** _ > > You don’t capitalize “the”. The title of the documentary got it right. > > It’s the Band, the Beatles, the Who, the Miles Davis Quintet, the The, and the Group That Hasn’t Been Named Yet. > > (This is bound to spark an argument between Correct People and illiterates, and it will be more interesting than the one about Robbie Robertson, good or bad?) > [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](#): > > Yes, it, will, and you are in The Illiterates. > > Just because you lay down the gauntlet, as it were, doesn’t mean you are correct. > > The name of the band is The Beatles. > [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](#): > > The Wrath of Khan, The Spy Who Came in From the Cold and The Caine Mutiny are filed under W, S and C, but the definite articles are all capitalized nevertheless. > > The Beatles, The Who and the Eagles are filed under B, W and E, but two take a capitalized definite article. > > Next question. Just to head it off before it comes up: the name of the band is Stray Cats, no The and no the. ---
**Author:** ![EinsteinsHund](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/einsteinshund/32/8400_2.png) [@EinsteinsHund](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EinsteinsHund)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2020, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-robbie-roberston-of-the-band/850000/29 "2020-03-25T19:21:29Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > Just to head it off before it comes up: the name of the band is Stray Cats, no The and no the. And not to forget, [The Name of This Band Is Talking Heads](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Name_of_This_Band_Is_Talking_Heads). ---
**Author:** ![EinsteinsHund](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/einsteinshund/32/8400_2.png) [@EinsteinsHund](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EinsteinsHund)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2020, 7:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-robbie-roberston-of-the-band/850000/30 "2020-03-25T19:28:39Z")
> [@Tamerlane](#): > > Interesting comparison because I really love the earlier Morrison albums in particular, but out of all of that stable of musicians I never could muster up much love for Platania. Especially on the live _It’s Too Late to Stop Now_, where he really kinda underwhelmed me. > > Horse for courses, naturally. > > ETA: Oh and I disagree about Clapton not having a distinct tone. One might argue he has had more than one, but 1970/80’s’s Clapton in particular always sounds instantly like 1970’s/80’s Clapton to me. However he had that black strat dialed in, it was instantly recognizable. I didn’t mean that Clapton doesn’t have his own tone, but that Robbie’s is even more distinct than Clapton’s. When I hear Clapton, I also hear his influences, especially the three Kings of the Blues (BB, Albert and Freddie), but Robbie’s sound is so unique that I don’t know where it comes from. I don’t know any guitarist who had a similar sound before him, like in Clapton’s case. ---
**Author:** ![solost](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/solost/32/11776_2.png) [@solost](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/solost)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2020, 1:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-robbie-roberston-of-the-band/850000/31 "2020-03-26T13:39:42Z")
I realize the OP was about Robbie Robertson’s relationship to the Band, so this is just a slight hijack, especially considering a good portion of this thread is arguing whether or not you capitalize the “the” in band names 😃 Anyway, I just wanted to say I’ve enjoyed a lot of his solo career after the Band. I’ve listened to ‘Storyville’ many times over the years, usually late at night with a couple beverages. I know, his style is kind of melodramatic and overwrought…some may even call it “cheesy”, but it’s enjoyable listening for me. And ‘Music for the Native Americans’, I haven’t listened to it in awhile so it may not hold up as well, but at the time it came out I enjoyed not only the music itself but the production values. It was really fun listening with good speakers or a good pair of headphones. Hmm, think I may play some today while working in my home office… ---
**Author:** ![drad\_dog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/aeb1de/32.png) [@drad\_dog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drad_dog)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2020, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-robbie-roberston-of-the-band/850000/32 "2020-03-26T18:17:46Z")
Robbie was in a band with 3 junkies. They were all great and worthy musicians, but no one knows what it’s like to wrangle that situation to maintain a working band out of it. I assume that he couldn’t, and I can’t blame him. ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2020, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-robbie-roberston-of-the-band/850000/33 "2020-03-26T20:39:56Z")
> [@jsc1953](#): > > But it’s very much Robertson’s story, with no attempt at multiple viewpoints (mostly, because the others have all passed)…although it’s noteworthy that Garth Wilson is still here and didn’t participate. Garth Hudson. It’s not impossible to find interviews with Garth but he certainly doesn’t do many. It would be truly noteworthy if he did participate. It’s not the type of thing I would see him doing. He was always content to let the others speak. > [@solost](#): > > Anyway, I just wanted to say I’ve enjoyed a lot of his solo career after the Band. I’ve listened to ‘Storyville’ many times over the years, usually late at night with a couple beverages. I know, his style is kind of melodramatic and overwrought…some may even call it “cheesy”, but it’s enjoyable listening for me. And ‘Music for the Native Americans’, I haven’t listened to it in awhile so it may not hold up as well, but at the time it came out I enjoyed not only the music itself but the production values. It was really fun listening with good speakers or a good pair of headphones. Hmm, think I may play some today while working in my home office… His self titled first solo album is still maybe my favorite album of the 80s. I enjoy it as much now as I did then. > [@drad\_dog](#): > > Robbie was in a band with 3 junkies. They were all great and worthy musicians, but no one knows what it’s like to wrangle that situation to maintain a working band out of it. I assume that he couldn’t, and I can’t blame him. You can see it in the Last Waltz. He’s trying to be serious and give answers that will help shape the movie. The others are fucked up (drunk rather than high I suspect though maybe both). And that’s the footage Scorcese could use. And Garth is quietly being a genius in the background. ---
**Author:** ![Flare4roach](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/7cd45c/32.png) [@Flare4roach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Flare4roach)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2020, 12:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-robbie-roberston-of-the-band/850000/34 "2020-03-30T00:10:55Z")
First off, I LOVE The Band. Always have. Kinda obsessed with them too. My daughter is 28 and she is even a bigger fan than I am. Truth is, I’ve been on Levon’s side for years. It sure appeared that Robertson stole their thunder and took credit for everything. My daughter is still like that. However, about 2 weeks ago I just finished Robertson’s book “Testimony” and I got to tell you, I have a hell of lot more sympathy for Robertson than before. He does nothing but lavish praise on all past members and goes into wonderful detail on what each member brought to the table. According to his book, he idolized Levon and considered him his musical partner…until heroin and alcohol began to seep into the scene. There were cracks before like Levon leaving in the middle of the Dylan tour and not staying in touch when they moved to Woodstock but it was drugs that really caused friction. Richard and Rick both were physical wrecks that slowly coasted to a stop when it came to writing songs. Robertson states that they all went through so much money that they approached him to buy back their songwriting publishing. He says he tried to advise them against it but they insisted. If true…that puts a new spin on what I thought was their story. Don’t get me wrong, I think Robbie didn’t do himself any favors on The Last Waltz by having his roommate Scorsese focus on him. Why did RR have a mic set up and showcase him singing? Looks like his ego took over at this point…but if you look beyond that…RR may not be as much a dick as I had originally thought. ---
**Author:** ![Fiddle\_Peghead](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fiddle_peghead/32/3506_2.png) [@Fiddle\_Peghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiddle_Peghead)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2020, 8:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-robbie-roberston-of-the-band/850000/35 "2020-04-15T20:30:03Z")
> [@Jack\_Burden](#): > > Agreed. When Clapton is playing on The Last Waltz, just he’s going into his solo, his guitar strap breaks and he calls out “Rob”. Robertson seamlessly switches from rhythm to lead and blazes through the solo, then just as easily switches back when Clapton is ready. Whatever his issues with his band mates (and that appears a two way street), the man is far from mediocre on guitar. It is acknowledged that his vocals aren’t up to the level of the rest and frequently his mic would be turned off. But also give him credit for being the driving force behind that great movie getting made. Two things, first this is my general assessment of Robbie’s playing also. When he needed to “blaze”, he could do it up there with the best of them. In the studio, for the most part the songs didn’t call for that type of playing. Witness Ophelia, from Northern Lights - Southern Cross. His playing fits. But then go to The Last Waltz, and listen to the change in the song. In a live performance, the song comes alive and Robbie elevates his playing to what at least for me is some of the finest in rock. Second, just a plug for Robbie’s singing, which on occasion fits perfectly. Witness [Bessie Smith](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1fYwx6qYHyo) from the Basement Tapes. Along with Rick, he is just great here, and it’s one of my favorite Band songs. ETA: A word on Clapton v Robertson: Robbie blows him off the stage in that song. Clapton to me seems perfunctory and predictable, while Robbie is just the opposite, dynamic and explosive. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-robbie-roberston-of-the-band/850000.md?page=1)