# I Pit Staten Islanders **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [November 2, 2012, 1:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-staten-islanders/639660 "2012-11-02T13:35:28Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 15\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a9a28c/32.png) [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pseudotriton_ruber_ruber)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2012, 7:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-staten-islanders/639660/81 "2012-11-05T07:36:07Z")
> [@Spud](#): > > Sorry, you forgot to attribute that quote you just made. I’m not sure I’ve heard anyone say it before now. Maybe a different paraphrase is that FEMA is too big and too full of red tape to effectively respond to an emergency, but if I’m paying for it I expect a benefit from it. Meanwhile I’m sitting in a house with no power that may have been shifted off of its foundation and would love to have a few gallons of drinkable water. > > I can’t believe I’m defending an opinion I don’t necessarily support but I don’t see how you can say they are wrong in their opinion that FEMA isn’t working for them in this case. Maybe you are convincing me to sway my opinion? Really? You think Tea Party nuts (of whom quite a few live on Staten Island) are making rational critiques of FEMA administration, and have some sensible complaints about distributing federal aid efficiently? If so, and I’ve never heard this from any of them in my life, then I must apologize for mischaracterizing them as well. (Boy, that’s a whole lot of imaginary people I’m apologizing to in this thread.) All of the TP nuts I’ve heard enjoy railing against freeloaders, lazy welfare recipients, their tax dollars, run the country on a local level. goddamned cheaters, never worked a day in their lives," and so on, never actually completing a sentence mind you, just full of bilious resentment against “them.” (And guess what color “they” are?) ---
**Author:** ![PandaBear77](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/edb3f5/32.png) [@PandaBear77](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PandaBear77)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2012, 10:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-staten-islanders/639660/82 "2012-11-05T10:52:34Z")
You were seriously up until 2:30am? Doing this? ---
**Author:** ![DrFidelius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drfidelius/32/3447_2.png) [@DrFidelius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrFidelius)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2012, 11:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-staten-islanders/639660/83 "2012-11-05T11:14:13Z")
> [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](#): > > Really? You think Tea Party nuts (of whom quite a few live on Staten Island) are making rational critiques of FEMA administration, and have some sensible complaints about distributing federal aid efficiently? If so, and I’ve never heard this from any of them in my life, then I must apologize for mischaracterizing them as well. (Boy, that’s a whole lot of imaginary people I’m apologizing to in this thread.) All of the TP nuts I’ve heard enjoy railing against freeloaders, lazy welfare recipients, their tax dollars, run the country on a local level. goddamned cheaters, never worked a day in their lives," and so on, never actually completing a sentence mind you, just full of bilious resentment against “them.” (And guess what color “they” are?) Oh. So you’re the one still giving Tea Partiers an audience. Stop it, it only encourages them. ---
**Author:** ![Spud](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spud/32/347_2.png) [@Spud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spud)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2012, 2:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-staten-islanders/639660/84 "2012-11-05T14:29:41Z")
> [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](#): > > Really? You think Tea Party nuts (of whom quite a few live on Staten Island) are making rational critiques of FEMA administration, and have some sensible complaints about distributing federal aid efficiently? If so, and I’ve never heard this from any of them in my life, then I must apologize for mischaracterizing them as well. (Boy, that’s a whole lot of imaginary people I’m apologizing to in this thread.) All of the TP nuts I’ve heard enjoy railing against freeloaders, lazy welfare recipients, their tax dollars, run the country on a local level. goddamned cheaters, never worked a day in their lives," and so on, never actually completing a sentence mind you, just full of bilious resentment against “them.” (And guess what color “they” are?) If you want to pit the tea party I’m right there with you. I’m trying to focus on your rant. A group of people (per you) say FEMA isn’t the best option because it isn’t effective. An emergency happens and they don’t seem to get any aid and are complaining that FEMA doesn’t seem to be the best option. I just don’t follow your logic here. ---
**Author:** ![pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a9a28c/32.png) [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pseudotriton_ruber_ruber)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2012, 2:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-staten-islanders/639660/85 "2012-11-05T14:37:55Z")
> [@Spud](#): > > If you want to pit the tea party I’m right there with you. I’m trying to focus on your rant. > > A group of people (per you) say FEMA isn’t the best option because it isn’t effective. An emergency happens and they don’t seem to get any aid and are complaining that FEMA doesn’t seem to be the best option. I just don’t follow your logic here. They would get aid far less effectively if FEMA’s budget were to be cut, as they demand, or far less less reliably if its functions were turned over to the states, as they alternatively demand. The only way for them to get aid more effectively and reliably would be to increase FEMA’s budget, which they’re dead-set against, except when they need the aid themselves in which case they’re bitching and pissing and moaning. I’d like to see a poll of Staten Islanders about how FEMA’s resources were used in Hurricane Katrina. I’d guess that you had the largest incidence of “Those freeloaders in New Orleans should just be proud that President Bush gave them anything at all, the lazy idiots who choose to live in a hurricane zone anyway.” ---
**Author:** ![Spud](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spud/32/347_2.png) [@Spud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spud)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2012, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-staten-islanders/639660/86 "2012-11-05T14:51:11Z")
> [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](#): > > They would get aid far less effectively if FEMA’s budget were to be cut, as they demand, or far less less reliably if its functions were turned over to the states, as they alternatively demand. The only way for them to get aid more effectively and reliably would be to increase FEMA’s budget, which they’re dead-set against, except when they need the aid themselves in which case they’re bitching and pissing and moaning. And you know this as a fact how? Or, as we like to say “Cite?” ---
**Author:** ![pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a9a28c/32.png) [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pseudotriton_ruber_ruber)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2012, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-staten-islanders/639660/87 "2012-11-05T15:13:24Z")
Well, this is perhaps for a whole nother thread, but I think it’s safe to say that just slashing the budget for disaster relief means there are fewer resources available and few workers to distrubute them. The question of federal vs. state funding is more complicated, assuming the funding stays at the same level, but I think most observers agree that in a situation like Sandy (which is typical of most disasters) the problem is spread across numerous states, and if the disaster is extreme enough (as Sandy was) the individual states may not have the resources on hand. Or some states might have an excess on hand, yet be reluctant to give their surplus supplies to neighboring states until they’re sure that they themselves are going to be absolutely fine, which you never are in the early stages. If there are political issues, NY being run by Democrats and NJ by Republicans, for example, there may be a perception or even a reality of states refusing to cooperate on coordinating resources for political reasons. I don’t see where there’s much of an advantage doing multi-state disaster relief by the states rather than a central source, and I haven’t heard a single good argument for it, other than “Bush fucked up Katrina” which was a competence issue most of all. ---
**Author:** ![Spud](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spud/32/347_2.png) [@Spud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spud)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2012, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-staten-islanders/639660/88 "2012-11-05T16:24:32Z")
Yes, I’m pretty sure everyone understands that this is your opinion… not everyone shares it though. ---
**Author:** ![42fish](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/4/b487fb/32.png) [@42fish](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/42fish)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2012, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-staten-islanders/639660/89 "2012-11-05T17:14:17Z")
> [@DrFidelius](#): > > Oh. So you’re the one still giving Tea Partiers an audience. Stop it, it only encourages them. Hey, attention whores gotta stick together. ---
**Author:** ![pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a9a28c/32.png) [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pseudotriton_ruber_ruber)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2012, 5:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-staten-islanders/639660/90 "2012-11-05T17:29:05Z")
> [@Spud](#): > > Yes, I’m pretty sure everyone understands that this is your opinion… not everyone shares it though. Can you make a convincing case that local control over disaster relief would be more efficient and cheaper than FEMA? I’d like to understand what you’re arguing here. ---
**Author:** ![Spud](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spud/32/347_2.png) [@Spud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spud)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2012, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-staten-islanders/639660/91 "2012-11-05T18:07:16Z")
You started this thread… you prove to me that things are working just fine for the people in Staten Island. ---
**Author:** ![smiling\_bandit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9a140/32.png) [@smiling\_bandit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smiling_bandit)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2012, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-staten-islanders/639660/92 "2012-11-05T20:18:53Z")
> [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](#): > > Can you make a convincing case that local control over disaster relief would be more efficient and cheaper than FEMA? I’d like to understand what you’re arguing here. Actually, I can and quite possibly will. But not in this section of the forum. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2012, 11:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-staten-islanders/639660/93 "2012-11-05T23:10:44Z")
> [@Jackmannii](#): > > For all those attacking Staten Islanders suffering in the aftermath of this storm, out of political motivations based on false stereotypes, a hearty fuck you. [Moderating]Please remember that saying “fuck you” to another poster is against the rules. No warning issued. [/Moderating] ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2012, 11:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-staten-islanders/639660/94 "2012-11-05T23:12:15Z")
> [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](#): > > **Lavender Blue** , I don’t actually think you’re supposed to say “fuck you” to anyone in the Pit any more. (I disagree with that rule, btw, but I try to abide by it, tempting as it gets sometimes.) I don’t want to junior-mod here, but I think that if you (and **Jackmannii** , of course) want to offer a tepid apology before some Mod notices it, and suggest instead something more along the lines that I insert some sharp object up my anal canal or something of the kind, you might save yourselves a warning or Mod note, and of course save the mod from having to issue it. I’m happy to entertain the idea of inserting all sorts of things up there, I’ve been jamming them up there all afternoon, in fact, and would be pleased to accomodate you as well. [Moderating] Junior modding is also against the rules. Don’t do this either. No warning issued, albeit, somewhat reluctantly. [/Moderating] ---
**Author:** ![gamerunknown](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/6bbea6/32.png) [@gamerunknown](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gamerunknown)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2012, 7:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-staten-islanders/639660/95 "2012-11-06T19:39:06Z")
Okay, the timing is bad and the target is misplaced (actual people which we cannot confirm hold the views prr assigns to them). However, it’s fairly clear that most conservatives are opportunists when it comes to issues such as these, always seeking to externalise costs. For instance, when Romney was a State Governor, he was of the opinion that the [Federal Government should cover costs](http://blogs.berkeley.edu/2012/10/29/romney-vs-disaster-assistance/). Then [for a while](http://www.examiner.com/article/romney-refuses-to-answer-fema-questions-nyt-op-ed-slams-elimination-remarks) [he was against it](http://www.salon.com/2012/10/30/romney_right_on_the_button_to_dismantle_fema_says_gop_strategist/), with some audacious and consistent conservatives [supporting him](http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2011/08/27/ron-paul-we-dont-need-fema/). You see, it’s entirely consistent. People afflicted by hurricanes in some other part of the country should take the personal responsibility of dealing with it (and always get someone else to pay for it). When it afflicts me, the great individualist, I would have surely had to foresight and abstinence necessary to cover it with private insurance, had it not been for the onerous taxes and regulations from various levels of governments. So I thus demand the just reward of _precisely_ the amount of tax money I spent on it. Otherwise that’d be from each according to ability, to each according to need, like those [Occupy Sandy](http://www.dailykos.com/story/2012/11/03/1154773/-Occupy-Sandy-Helps-Donald-Trump-The-Tea-Party-Spew-Outrage-Lies-at-Obama-FEMA) people believe. I did find [this site](http://www.teapartysi.com/) for Tea Party Staten Island, but it seems to be run by one individual and he doesn’t mention FEMA at all. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-staten-islanders/639660.md?page=4)