# I pit the alarming surge in global homophobia **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 20, 2017, 6:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-alarming-surge-in-global-homophobia/799349 "2017-10-20T06:02:56Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2017, 1:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-alarming-surge-in-global-homophobia/799349/21 "2017-10-22T13:39:01Z")
> [@LongTimeLurker](#): > > So posters on SDMB now know that LGBTQ’s are persecuted and killed in other countries. Do you have a Facebook page or even better, a gofundme page so people can donate money to your cause? > > So what is your cause? You want LGBTQ’s to be treated like everyone else. I agree that killing people because they are LGBTQ should be against the law. I think it is against the law in the US, but I might be wrong. > > Killing LGBTQ’s in other countries poses a problem. Some countries still stone women to death for being unescorted in public, or for being married to someone that just wants them dead. > > So your rant is that you are living in a country that allows you to be openly LGBTQ and you know that other LGBTQ people in the world aren’t allowed the same opportunity. > > So what are you going to do about it? Keep posting videos and links to web pages that document your concerns? I hope you aren’t too offended if I ignore your tirades. While I may agree that LGBTQ problems and prejudices exist, it really isn’t anywhere near the top of The World Problems I Would Like To Solve. > > Good Luck on your quest for LGBTQ equality. Lurking seems to suit you better than posting. Consider doing what you do best. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2017, 4:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-alarming-surge-in-global-homophobia/799349/22 "2017-10-22T16:59:48Z")
> [@LongTimeLurker](#): > > I hope you aren’t too offended if I ignore your tirades. I think everyone reading this thread would have been happier if you’d actually done this. ---
**Author:** ![Guest-starring\_Id](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guest-starring_id/32/21736_2.png) [@Guest-starring\_Id](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guest-starring_Id)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2017, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-alarming-surge-in-global-homophobia/799349/23 "2017-10-22T17:56:01Z")
> [@LongTimeLurker](#): > > So what are you going to do about it? Keep posting videos and links to web pages that document your concerns? Evidently that’s what many are doing - it’s called spreading awareness, especially through social media. On the flipside of that token, however, are cyberthreats, where “Survivors have expressed fears that the social media accounts of men perceived to be gay or bisexual are being hacked and used to identify and contact others who have not yet been arrested.” (Renato Sebadini, executive director of The International Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual, Trans and Intersex Association…from first link in **Wendell Wagner** ’s post) > [@LongTimeLurker](#): > > I hope you aren’t too offended if I ignore your tirades. And a bang-up job you’ve done so far with that. > [@LongTimeLurker](#): > > … isn’t anywhere near the top of The World Problems I Would Like To Solve. Can you solve douchey capitalizing?😉 > [@Wendell\_Wagner](#): > > Is there any statistical evidence on the acceptance of homosexuality in the world as a whole? I do not want anecdotes. I do not want changes within a single country. I want statistics on the acceptance of homosexuality in the world as a whole. Some statistics seem to imply that it’s more accepted now than before. The number of countries where homosexuality is a crime dropped from 92 in 2006 to 17 in 2017. The number where same-sex marriage is legal rose over that period. Is there any evidence that homosexuality is less accepted over that time period in the world as a whole?: > > [Fewer countries ban same-sex relations, but homophobic violence common | World News - Hindustan Times](http://www.hindustantimes.com/world-news/fewer-countries-ban-same-sex-relations-but-homophobic-violence-common/story-PomdbnIEwzA1tvQEJjgRrK.html) > > [Same-sex marriage - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Same-sex_marriage) > > [Where acceptance of homosexuality has and has not changed around the world - The Washington Post](https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/monkey-cage/wp/2015/04/28/where-acceptance-of-homosexuality-has-and-has-not-changed-around-the-world/?utm_term=.e673c4bf5f16) > > I am reacting to the title of this thread. If you just give anecdotes or information about a single country, that doesn’t answer my question. If your view is that any homophobia anywhere is wrong, I have no problem with that. However, that is irrelevant to my question. Thank-you for your posts. While the the second link was completely unnecessary, the other two provided info that actually opened my eyes - I just hope that the World Values Survey is a credible source for those graphs, which caught my attention especially how with some countries, the black dot was not the furthest-to-the-right dot, such as Trinidad, Columbia, and surprisingly Mexico. Hopefully that regression is only temporary. ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2017, 5:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-alarming-surge-in-global-homophobia/799349/24 "2017-11-03T17:39:45Z")
Now there is [a call for conversion therapy for gay lions](http://nairobinews.nation.co.ke/news/ezekiel-mutua-wants-gay-lions-spotted-in-maasai-mara-isolated/). ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2017, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-alarming-surge-in-global-homophobia/799349/25 "2017-11-03T18:07:29Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > Now there is [a call for conversion therapy for gay lions](http://nairobinews.nation.co.ke/news/ezekiel-mutua-wants-gay-lions-spotted-in-maasai-mara-isolated/). From the link: > [@](#): > > [Kenya Film Classification Board chief executive Ezekiel Mutua] further claimed that the gay lions could have learned homosexual behavior after watching a gay couple having sex in the game reserve. Note, btw, that same-sex sexual activity appears to have been tolerated in at least some ethnic groups in Kenya before the colonial British efforts at Christianization and imposition of stringent anti-sodomy laws. As I noted earlier in the thread, when we tut-tut over developing nations persecuting homosexuals, let’s pause for a moment to consider who gave them the idea in the first place. ---
**Author:** ![Suburban\_Plankton](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/suburban_plankton/32/219_2.png) [@Suburban\_Plankton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Suburban_Plankton)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2017, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-alarming-surge-in-global-homophobia/799349/26 "2017-11-03T18:34:52Z")
Has there been a surge in global homophobia? Or has there only been a surge in the \*\*\*recognition \*\*\*of global homophobia? I would posit that there is no more homophobia today than there has been in the past - in fact, I’d bet there is actually less now than even 10 years ago…what has changed is that people are now talking about it, and acting as if it’s an actual problem, rather than just ‘the way things are’. It doesn’t make the situation better for anyone who’s suffering today, but I think it does actually bode well for the future. In order to solve a problem, you must first acknowledge that the problem exists. ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2017, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-alarming-surge-in-global-homophobia/799349/27 "2017-11-03T18:51:24Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > And western colonial rule for some of the rest. We tend to forget how earnestly colonial legislators 100-150 years ago believed that eradicating traditional acceptance of same-sex sexual activity in their colonies was a necessary part of “civilizing” them. I’m not sure that’s the case. The politically correct line is that acceptance of same-sex activity is the cultural norm through most human cultures, and that the Judeo-Christian ethic is almost uniquely bigoted and intolerant in that respect; but I suspect there’s plenty of home-grown bigotry against gays in many traditional cultures. Certainly someone being so _exclusively_ gay that they didn’t want to produce children would not have been seen in a positive light. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2017, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-alarming-surge-in-global-homophobia/799349/28 "2017-11-03T18:58:53Z")
And even if that’s the case it’s not as if the same people do not also condemn homophobia wherever and whenever it is (at least in the 20th century). There’s plenty of "tut tut"ing of conversion therapy wackoes here in America. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2017, 7:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-alarming-surge-in-global-homophobia/799349/29 "2017-11-03T19:11:21Z")
> [@Lumpy](#): > > I’m not sure that’s the case. The politically correct line is that acceptance of same-sex activity is the cultural norm through most human cultures, and that the Judeo-Christian ethic is almost uniquely bigoted and intolerant in that respect; but I suspect there’s plenty of home-grown bigotry against gays in many traditional cultures. Sure, I never claimed that any pre-colonial culture was **entirely** accepting of same-sex sexual activity, and indeed there’s been a huge variation throughout human history in different cultures’ attitudes towards it. I’m not trying to argue that the developing world would be an egalitarian gay-rights paradise today if only western colonizers hadn’t meddled with it. I’m just pointing out that wherever there **were** tolerant attitudes towards same-sex sexual activity in pre-colonial cultures, colonial administrators tended to jump on them like a duck on a junebug, insisting that the forces of Christendom and Empire needed to unite to stamp out such uncivilized abomination. So now that most of us in western cultures have changed our minds about that, it seems a bit _chutzpadik_ to go around wagging our fingers at those dreadful homophobic Third World societies as though we had nothing to do with their formation. ---
**Author:** ![Folacin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/folacin/32/3195_2.png) [@Folacin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Folacin)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2017, 8:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-alarming-surge-in-global-homophobia/799349/30 "2017-11-03T20:21:48Z")
> [@Lumpy](#): > > Certainly someone being so _exclusively_ gay that they didn’t want to produce children would not have been seen in a positive light. If it is a male - I don’t know if that would be a problem - less competition for moving my genes into the next generation, but still someone working within the society. More of an issue for a woman (there is always unfortunately rape), but then in a hunter-gatherer society there is a probably an ideal group size, and uncontrolled popping of kids could lead to problems, so ‘aunties’ who help raise children without adding any could be a net good also. ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2017, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-alarming-surge-in-global-homophobia/799349/31 "2017-11-03T21:33:01Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > I’m not trying to argue that the developing world would be an egalitarian gay-rights paradise today if only western colonizers hadn’t meddled with it. Thank you. ---
**Author:** ![Ann\_Hedonia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ann_hedonia/32/319_2.png) [@Ann\_Hedonia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ann_Hedonia)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2017, 10:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-alarming-surge-in-global-homophobia/799349/32 "2017-11-03T22:43:46Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > Now there is [a call for conversion therapy for gay lions](http://nairobinews.nation.co.ke/news/ezekiel-mutua-wants-gay-lions-spotted-in-maasai-mara-isolated/). That Nairobi News is one interesting newspaper. Two of the featured sidebar stories Mourners Left in Shock After Hearse Bursts into Flames Jubilee MP Flees, Mourners Abandon Coffin by Roadside after Bee Attack. Note to self: Nairobi will not be a good choice for my destination funeral. ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2017, 9:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-alarming-surge-in-global-homophobia/799349/33 "2017-11-05T09:04:45Z")
All I know is I saw two guys wearing matching clothing, and I asked if they were gay. They quickly arrested me! ---
**Author:** ![Clothahump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/51bf81/32.png) [@Clothahump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clothahump)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2017, 11:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-alarming-surge-in-global-homophobia/799349/34 "2017-11-05T23:47:06Z")
> [@Guest-starring\_Id](#): > > And then I think of Trump somehow miraculously vamoos-ing from the scene (preferably by means of accidentally slipping on a pool of his peeing miscueing), and then after we go “whew!” that that Orange Piece of Shit is gone, we’re looking at Pence, who is truly bonkers fucked-up homophobic. Cite? ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2017, 1:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-alarming-surge-in-global-homophobia/799349/35 "2017-11-06T01:27:38Z")
> [@Clothahump](#): > > Cite? Speaking for myself, I don’t know how to calibrate a quantifier like “truly bonkers fucked-up”. But it’s undeniable that Pence’s record is strongly anti-LGBQT-rights, especially for a modern politician. He went on record in 2000 as [opposing any kind of same-sex partnership recognition legally equivalent to opposite-sex marriage and advocating federal funding for “ex-gay conversion therapies”](https://www.buzzfeed.com/andrewkaczynski/here-is-mike-pences-questionable-2000-proposal-on-hivaids-fu?utm_term=.kjo7krKPA#.wbrGX7zYd), for instance. And AFAIK he has never recanted or rejected those homophobic positions. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2017, 10:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-alarming-surge-in-global-homophobia/799349/36 "2017-11-06T10:03:22Z")
Maybe Mr. Pence should never be alone in the company of a man unless his wife is present? Is she allowed to be in the company of other women without him present? I mean, if The Gay is so terribly terrifying, one should protect oneself from it at all times. ---
**Author:** ![Claptree](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/58f4c7/32.png) [@Claptree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Claptree)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2017, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-alarming-surge-in-global-homophobia/799349/37 "2017-11-06T16:49:03Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > You can thank [active efforts by American evangelicals](https://www.thenation.com/article/its-not-just-uganda-behind-christian-rights-onslaught-africa/) for some of it. Interesting thing I noticed in that article. It says the American Center for Law and Justice (founded by Pat Robertson) help train lawyers to draft Zimbabwe’s new laws. Further down, I learned that the executive director of the ACLJ is Jordan Sekulow. Recognize the last name? You should. His father is Chief Counsel and founder of the ACLJ, and part of Trump’s legal team, Jay Sekulow. It comes back orange. ---
**Author:** ![Squallous](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/22d042/32.png) [@Squallous](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squallous)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2017, 10:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-alarming-surge-in-global-homophobia/799349/38 "2017-11-07T22:24:22Z")
> [@Tom\_Tildrum](#): > > Particularly since the OP seems to be focusing on (with the exception of Tanzania) calling out Muslim nations and regions – a somewhat Trumpian move in itself. The OP identifies widespread, pervasive torturous acts against homosexuals. Not just refusing to bake them a cake. In what non-Muslim nations or regions does this happen that in your estimation the OP failed to call out? ---
**Author:** ![Guest-starring\_Id](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guest-starring_id/32/21736_2.png) [@Guest-starring\_Id](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guest-starring_Id)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2017, 1:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-alarming-surge-in-global-homophobia/799349/39 "2017-11-08T01:11:35Z")
> [@Clothahump](#): > > Cite? Damn I had the article _somewhere_ (about преЦАРдент Trump slipping on his urine and dying) but it seems to have eluded me at this very moment. Oh, wait - the Pence anti-gay shit? Are you fucking kidding me? [https://www.politico.com/story/2017/10/17/trump-pence-hang-homosexuals-anti-gay-243879](https://www.politico.com/story/2017/10/17/trump-pence-hang-homosexuals-anti-gay-243879) > [@](#): > > Reporter Jane Mayer wrote that the president joked during a meeting about gay rights that a visitor shouldn’t bother asking Pence’s opinion because, Trump reportedly said, **“He wants to hang them all!”** Mayer also reported that Trump mocked Pence behind his back for his religious beliefs and asked people who met with him if Pence made them pray. **Clothahump** - if you, _for even a second_, consider taking the WH’s word over Jane Meyer’s on that, I will personally throw a reverse roundhouse, connecting squarely on your left temple, _through your computer_. > **[Here's What Mike Pence Said on LGBT Issues Over the Years](https://time.com/4406337/mike-pence-gay-rights-lgbt-religious-freedom/)** > > He linked gays to 'societal collapse,' opposed gay marriage. > [@](#): > > The Employment Non-Discrimination Act would have banned discrimination against people based on sexual orientation. Pence voted against that law in 2007 and later said the law “wages war on freedom and religion in the workplace.” And the following sums it all up: [http://www.wisconsingazette.com/news/a-look-at-vice-president-mike-pence-s-anti-gay/article\_4fde4dd0-3ed2-11e7-b516-cb822a35559d.html](http://www.wisconsingazette.com/news/a-look-at-vice-president-mike-pence-s-anti-gay/article_4fde4dd0-3ed2-11e7-b516-cb822a35559d.html) ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2017, 3:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-alarming-surge-in-global-homophobia/799349/40 "2017-11-08T03:01:42Z")
> [@Squallous](#): > > The OP identifies widespread, pervasive torturous acts against homosexuals. Not just refusing to bake them a cake. > > In what non-Muslim nations or regions does this happen that in your estimation the OP failed to call out? I can’t tell if you’re counting only torturous acts committed by law enforcement officials. If not, Jamaica (two-thirds Christian and effectively 0% Muslim), for instance, has high rates of serious homophobic violence (in addition to officially criminalizing male same-sex sexual activity). [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-alarming-surge-in-global-homophobia/799349.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-alarming-surge-in-global-homophobia/799349.md?page=3)