# I pit the assholes who are calling the Trump sons disgusting for hunting in Africa **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [March 14, 2012, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-assholes-who-are-calling-the-trump-sons-disgusting-for-hunting-in-africa/615768 "2012-03-14T18:58:23Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 11\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2012, 7:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-assholes-who-are-calling-the-trump-sons-disgusting-for-hunting-in-africa/615768/61 "2012-03-16T07:03:37Z")
> [@Chefguy](#): > > I lived in Africa for three years and went on numerous photo safaris during that time. Game parks take in huge revenue from this activity and nothing has to die in the process so that some asshole can have a head on his wall. This is a little like banning gambling in Las Vegas. Sure, Vegas shows pull in a lot of revenue. But so do the slots. Big game hunting bucks encourage the protection of habitat from both organized agriculturalists and disorganized poachers. Peter A. Lindsey discusses trophy hunting in “Trophy Hunting in Sub Saharan Africa”: Trophy hunting occurs in 23 sub Saharan African countries, and generates at least USD 201 million/year from ~18,500 international hunting clients. Approximately 1.4 million km2 is used for trophy hunting, which is an area 22% larger than, and in addition to the area encompassed by national parks (i.e. protected areas where hunting is not permitted). Those are not tiny sums. And taking this activity away would lead to habitat loss. In addition, “Trophy hunting is viable in several countries that receive few conventional tourists (e.g. CAR, Chad, and Ethiopia), and in remote parts of countries that are popular among tourists (e.g. northwest South Africa, and southern Tanzania).” It also has high revenue per tourist yield, which implies fewer facilities and fossil fuel use in sensitive areas. ---
**Author:** ![Morgenstern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Morgenstern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgenstern)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2012, 1:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-assholes-who-are-calling-the-trump-sons-disgusting-for-hunting-in-africa/615768/62 "2012-03-16T13:16:31Z")
> [@Measure\_for\_Measure](#): > > Peter A. Lindsey discusses trophy hunting in “Trophy Hunting in Sub Saharan Africa”: > [INDENT]Trophy hunting occurs in 23 sub Saharan African countries, and generates at least USD 201 million/year from ~18,500 international hunting clients. . . I always wondered how the Afrcican leaders there financed their fleet of Mercedes and their palaces. ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2012, 5:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-assholes-who-are-calling-the-trump-sons-disgusting-for-hunting-in-africa/615768/63 "2012-03-16T17:05:51Z")
> [@Measure\_for\_Measure](#): > > This is a little like banning gambling in Las Vegas. Sure, Vegas shows pull in a lot of revenue. But so do the slots. Big game hunting bucks encourage the protection of habitat from both organized agriculturalists and disorganized poachers. > > Peter A. Lindsey discusses trophy hunting in “Trophy Hunting in Sub Saharan Africa”: > Trophy hunting occurs in 23 sub Saharan African countries, and generates at least USD 201 million/year from ~18,500 international hunting clients. Approximately 1.4 million km2 is used for trophy hunting, which is an area 22% larger than, and in addition to the area encompassed by national parks (i.e. protected areas where hunting is not permitted). Those are not tiny sums. And taking this activity away would lead to habitat loss. In addition, “Trophy hunting is viable in several countries that receive few conventional tourists (e.g. CAR, Chad, and Ethiopia), and in remote parts of countries that are popular among tourists (e.g. northwest South Africa, and southern Tanzania).” It also has high revenue per tourist yield, which implies fewer facilities and fossil fuel use in sensitive areas. Do you really think that this money ends up helping anybody, other than in the most marginal sense? Most African country governments are corrupt, and if most of that money doesn’t end up in the bank accounts of senior government officials, I’d be dumbstruck. ---
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2012, 5:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-assholes-who-are-calling-the-trump-sons-disgusting-for-hunting-in-africa/615768/64 "2012-03-17T05:34:40Z")
> [@Chefguy](#): > > Do you really think that this money ends up helping anybody, other than in the most marginal sense? Most African country governments are corrupt, and if most of that money doesn’t end up in the bank accounts of senior government officials, I’d be dumbstruck. Yeah I do, because I’ve read of projects where they cut deals with villagers on adjoining lands. No cite and my memory might be faulty, but that’s the background. If it’s a top-down governmental arrangement, then it’s hard to organize proper curbs on poachers. Less so with the local efforts. I’m not claiming that all operations are on the up and up, but that applies to photo safaris as well. ---
**Author:** ![Beastly\_Rotter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/45deac/32.png) [@Beastly\_Rotter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beastly_Rotter)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2012, 6:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-assholes-who-are-calling-the-trump-sons-disgusting-for-hunting-in-africa/615768/65 "2012-03-17T06:38:01Z")
> [@gamerunknown](#): > > As a vegetarian of a few years (disregarding a few occasions where I’m cajoled into eating meat while staying at a friend’s home, but I never purchase it)… You mean the kind that’s not a vegetarian at all? ---
**Author:** ![Zebra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/c0e974/32.png) [@Zebra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zebra)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2012, 6:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-assholes-who-are-calling-the-trump-sons-disgusting-for-hunting-in-africa/615768/66 "2012-03-17T06:53:08Z")
> [@Scumpup](#): > > Don’t knock picking off cockaroaches with a bb gun til you’ve tried it. The little bastards move fast and you don’t have time for more than a shot or two after you turn the lights on. Maybe you should just clean your kitchen? ---
**Author:** ![Scumpup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce73a5/32.png) [@Scumpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scumpup)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2012, 10:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-assholes-who-are-calling-the-trump-sons-disgusting-for-hunting-in-africa/615768/67 "2012-03-17T10:02:16Z")
> [@Zebra](#): > > Maybe you should just clean your kitchen? My kitchen doesn’t have roaches. I go on safari to poor people’s kitchens. ---
**Author:** ![saoirse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/5daacb/32.png) [@saoirse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/saoirse)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2012, 12:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-assholes-who-are-calling-the-trump-sons-disgusting-for-hunting-in-africa/615768/68 "2012-03-17T12:50:15Z")
> [@Maastricht](#): > > Another interesting aside; the Dutch population is overwehelmingly against hunting. About 95% percent is against it, polls show again and again. So do you think our crown prince, the one who is to be king in five years or so, gets the PR message and stops hunting? Does he open the Royal Hunting Grounds for the public to hike in? No. He invites a couple of captains of industry and off they go shooting deer. > This is a Prince who isn’t terrible popular as it is (his wife is the real star) and he could really use some boost. But no. His grandfather, [a famous lout and scoundrel,](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prince_Bernhard_of_Lippe-Biesterfeld)(and patron of the World Wildlife Fund, was a hunter. So his grandson hunts too. And pisses off 95% of his subjects. > > You almost have got to admire the man for being so true to himself. Or his class. Or so thickheaded, I don’t know. Okay, but if he’s going to be the _king_, why the fuck would he care? It makes no difference what you think of hunting, only what God thinks of it. Perhaps this will give you an opportunity to re-think your retarded political structure. ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2012, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-assholes-who-are-calling-the-trump-sons-disgusting-for-hunting-in-africa/615768/69 "2012-03-17T14:51:22Z")
> [@Measure\_for\_Measure](#): > > Yeah I do, because I’ve read of projects where they cut deals with villagers on adjoining lands. No cite and my memory might be faulty, but that’s the background. If it’s a top-down governmental arrangement, then it’s hard to organize proper curbs on poachers. Less so with the local efforts. I’m not claiming that all operations are on the up and up, but that applies to photo safaris as well. Well, no. Photo safaris don’t require expensive permits from customers. Payments go directly to the companies who run the camps, who in turn hire the guides, buy the food, tents, vehicles, furniture, etc., which in turn supports local economies. These companies likely have to pay the government to operate, but the money is coming from the bottom up instead of being filtered through a government entity first. I have no doubt that some good is being done with hunting permit money, just as I have no doubt that most of it ends up in an off-shore account. Unless a couple hundred years of historical trends have somehow been magically reversed. ---
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2012, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-assholes-who-are-calling-the-trump-sons-disgusting-for-hunting-in-africa/615768/70 "2012-03-18T22:41:14Z")
Let me quote the report from Peter Lindsey: 3.6 Relatively low leakage of revenues Ecotourism packages are often booked through overseas agents, with the effect that a significant proportion of revenues are lost from host countries. By contrast, most hunting operators working inAfrica are based in Africa (92.6%) and many are based in the countries in which most hunting is conducted (88%). In Botswana, 75% of trophy hunting revenues remain within country, compared to 27% of tourism revenues. However, in Central andWestAfrica, most operators are based in Europe and so significant proportions of revenues are leaked overseas. That’s an offsetting effect. Some of that 75% goes to overseas accounts presumably. I don’t have any data breaking down hunting expenditures by destination. And of course there is corruption, though that afflicts ecotourism as well: Corruption affects the trophy hunting industry in Africa at multiple levels, from government scouts who overlook the overshooting of quotas, to government ministers favouring certain operators when granting concessions. ---
**Author:** ![gamerunknown](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/6bbea6/32.png) [@gamerunknown](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gamerunknown)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2012, 2:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-assholes-who-are-calling-the-trump-sons-disgusting-for-hunting-in-africa/615768/71 "2012-03-20T02:14:22Z")
> [@](#): > > You mean the kind that’s not a vegetarian at all? I’ve eaten meat perhaps three times in the past year to avoid confrontation. My refusing to eat it wouldn’t put the animal back in a pen, nor would I convince anyone that it was a reasonable position to take. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-assholes-who-are-calling-the-trump-sons-disgusting-for-hunting-in-africa/615768.md?page=3)