# I pit the end user **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [June 22, 2012, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-end-user/625978 "2012-06-22T19:17:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![dogbutler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dogbutler/32/428_2.png) [@dogbutler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dogbutler)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2012, 3:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-end-user/625978/41 "2012-06-23T03:57:47Z")
> [@Typo\_Negative](#): > > You would not **believe** the number of people who have lied to me about that. They tell me they reboot every day. They swear it. Then I connect to them and see that it has been 30, 60, 90 days since the last reboot. Then I ask ‘just what is it that you have been doing every day?’ > > Me: Please do ‘X’ > Customer: I have already done that. That didn’t work. > Me: Let’s do it once more. > Customer: This is a waste of time. > Me: Humor me. > Customer:…hey! It worked! I’ve done it 4 times in a row, and it works the 5th time when the tech tells me to do it. I feel for the techs. ---
**Author:** ![akennett](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ee59a6/32.png) [@akennett](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/akennett)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2012, 4:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-end-user/625978/42 "2012-06-23T04:15:08Z")
> [@Curiosity\_Kills\_Her](#): > > Unless I’ve worked with you enough to observe your word can be trusted in troubleshooting scenarios I assume you’re lying. That’s all well and good, but don’t be surprised that the assumptions cut both ways. When I submit a ticket detailing exactly what I’ve done, in detail, and then get the “Well, let’s try X” response (when X was definitely on the list), then I start assuming IT folks are illiterate morons. And since this happens damn near every time I’ve submitted a ticket, then I’ll just continue assuming all IT guys are illiterate morons. ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2012, 4:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-end-user/625978/43 "2012-06-23T04:48:35Z")
Back in the day, there was an anti-drug commercial that said “Users are Losers”. On bad days that became a work related joke. There is something I call “The Repair Man Syndrome”. Something doesn’t work. You get the technician/help desk person on the line, you take your car into the shop, the plumber shows up… and everything works fine. And you feel like an idiot. Bad customer service people think you are one and possibly show it. Nowadays I laugh and explain that it’s just another example of TRMS, oh well, call me if it stops working again. Some of you may provide great whopping amounts of information and get mad when it is ignored. Unfortunately it sometimes gets ignored because we start making assumptions as we’re reading and assume it’s like the other 10,000 times we’ve seen this issue. Other times I’ve seen people FUCKING LIE about what they’ve done to try to resolve things. I’ve had people swear up and down they did something that I know fixes the issue 100% of the time. Then get angry when I insist that they do it with me on the line. It fixes the issue. On the other hand, I’ve had people pretend to walk through what I’m asking them to do, claiming it’s not working. I know because I ask them to do something I know is going to take 15 seconds, and they claim it was done instantaneously. “Ok, now restart your computer” “done”. Oh fuck no, your computer didn’t do a full shut down and restart in 2 seconds! You just claimed you did because you think you’re going to get something out of me if I can’t fix it (like “compensation” :rolleyes: ) Or because you have some other idea of what will fix it and I’m not doing it. Or because you’re just a stupid contrarian jackass who gets off on recreational outrage at “idiots” (and yes, there are those people out there, rare as they may be). Right now I work supporting database users. We get people who tell us they’re getting an error. They don’t say what it is or what they’re doing. Or they tell us the exact error and provide screen shots, but we still have to ask them to give us the SQL they’re running to know what the hell is going on and why it might have failed. That happens more than 95% of the time. We very rarely get people who are frothing in anger because something that worked yesterday isn’t working today, they don’t provide any details, but they demand we fix it NOW NOW NOW. Sometimes I’ll run across people who have done an awesome job of doing exactly what they should do to resolve an issue… except for one crucial step that invalidated all of their hard work. God knows I’ve been that person myself often enough. It happens. Move on. > [@](#): > > Don’t walk up to my desk and say “I hate to bother you, but…” If you hate to bother me, then don’t. Sometimes I say this because I know the person is really busy, I don’t like disturbing them and I wish I could resolve it myself, but I have to ask something of them. Sometimes I say it because they’re assholes and while it is necessary for me to bother them because it’s their job to do what I’m asking, I know they’re going to make it unpleasant. Which are you, OP? > [@](#): > > When I’m working on your problem, please don’t tell me all your technical certifications, I could give a ratking’s ass. Please don’t tell me that you used to be a technician or an AS/400 admin somewhere else. Are you a technician right here and now? Then it doesn’t count. Or instead of being an anti-social asshole, you could consider that the person has at least one thing in common with you and is giving you an opening for **Actual Human Interaction**. Sorry that’s such a bother for you. OP, I have two pieces of philosphy for you; If everyone else is a problem; you’re the problem. Not the entire rest of the world. The day you think all of your customers are morons is the day you need to find a new profession. ---
**Author:** ![Curiosity\_Kills\_Her](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8c91f0/32.png) [@Curiosity\_Kills\_Her](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Curiosity_Kills_Her)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2012, 5:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-end-user/625978/44 "2012-06-23T05:03:31Z")
> [@akennett](#): > > That’s all well and good, but don’t be surprised that the assumptions cut both ways. When I submit a ticket detailing exactly what I’ve done, in detail, and then get the “Well, let’s try X” response (when X was definitely on the list), then I start assuming IT folks are illiterate morons. And since this happens damn near every time I’ve submitted a ticket, then I’ll just continue assuming all IT guys are illiterate morons. Maybe it’s just _your_ IT guys are illiterate morons 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Curiosity\_Kills\_Her](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8c91f0/32.png) [@Curiosity\_Kills\_Her](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Curiosity_Kills_Her)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2012, 5:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-end-user/625978/45 "2012-06-23T05:08:00Z")
> [@Chimera](#): > > There is something I call “The Repair Man Syndrome”. Something doesn’t work. You get the technician/help desk person on the line, you take your car into the shop, the plumber shows up… and everything works fine. And you feel like an idiot. Bad customer service people think you are one and possibly show it. Nowadays I laugh and explain that it’s just another example of TRMS, oh well, call me if it stops working again. I call this “I’m magic.” > [@Chimera](#): > > Other times I’ve seen people FUCKING LIE about what they’ve done to try to resolve things. I’ve had people swear up and down they did something that I know fixes the issue 100% of the time. Then get angry when I insist that they do it with me on the line. It fixes the issue. On the other hand, I’ve had people pretend to walk through what I’m asking them to do, claiming it’s not working. I know because I ask them to do something I know is going to take 15 seconds, and they claim it was done instantaneously. “Ok, now restart your computer” “done”. Oh fuck no, your computer didn’t do a full shut down and restart in 2 seconds! You just claimed you did because you think you’re going to get something out of me if I can’t fix it (like “compensation” :rolleyes: ) Or because you have some other idea of what will fix it and I’m not doing it. Or because you’re just a stupid contrarian jackass who gets off on recreational outrage at “idiots” (and yes, there are those people out there, rare as they may be). Precisely this, better than I said it. ---
**Author:** ![guizot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guizot/32/3636_2.png) [@guizot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/guizot)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2012, 5:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-end-user/625978/46 "2012-06-23T05:17:10Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > You have some valid complaints, but for these items, either you’re having a case of the Mondays or you’re sort of a prick. Noting that how most of your complaints make you look moody or prickish, I’m guessing this is more your problem than other peoples’. Well, the OP does paint a picture of an organization in which he is the only person who isn’t an idiot–the lone voice of reason, the martyr of all self-martyrs, uttering his last breath on an anonymous message board as he dies on a cross constructed by a cabal of people who apparently do everything they can to bother him. I suppose that could happen, somewhere. ---
**Author:** ![Rachellelogram](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rachellelogram/32/8689_2.png) [@Rachellelogram](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rachellelogram)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2012, 6:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-end-user/625978/47 "2012-06-23T06:07:28Z")
> [@Intergalactic\_Gladiator](#): > > No, go back to your desk, grab the heaviest thing that you can find, and then hit yourself in the head with it. Did [problem] go away? Mine did. This was my favorite! ---
**Author:** ![RandMcnally](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/b782af/32.png) [@RandMcnally](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RandMcnally)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2012, 7:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-end-user/625978/48 "2012-06-23T07:01:10Z")
> [@Intergalactic\_Gladiator](#): > > We get a lot of cases like that too. “The printer has been down 4 days and no one has done anything about it.” Did anyone think of telling us? I guess not. My old squadron was transitioning to a new program for something so I had to go to classes to learn about it. While there they gave us the help desk and said, “if you have any issues and can’t find the answer right away, call us. Please. If you try to figure it out on your own you’ll just get angrier and angrier so when you finally do call us you’re yelling about something that’d take five seconds to fix. So we would rather if you just skipped the getting angry phase.” ---
**Author:** ![Gukumatz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/74df32/32.png) [@Gukumatz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gukumatz)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2012, 7:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-end-user/625978/49 "2012-06-23T07:23:18Z")
> [@Chimera](#): > > There is something I call “The Repair Man Syndrome”. Something doesn’t work. You get the technician/help desk person on the line, you take your car into the shop, the plumber shows up… and everything works fine. And you feel like an idiot. Bad customer service people think you are one and possibly show it. Nowadays I laugh and explain that it’s just another example of TRMS, oh well, call me if it stops working again. Back when I worked IT/2nd tier support I stumbled on the phrase “idiopathic” and quickly grew to love it. (It’s Science for “problem comes out of nowhere and we don’t know why.”) We had a lot of eggheads who worked there and were familiar with the term and accepted it when it turned up. Also on the plus side, it was as close to spelling out the word “idiot” we ever got to go. (No, I can’t replace your laptop screen. You bent it backwards over a lit candle and _melted a fucking hole in it_.) ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2012, 12:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-end-user/625978/50 "2012-06-23T12:31:50Z")
> [@akennett](#): > > That’s all well and good, but don’t be surprised that the assumptions cut both ways. When I submit a ticket detailing exactly what I’ve done, in detail, and then get the “Well, let’s try X” response (when X was definitely on the list), then I start assuming IT folks are illiterate morons. And since this happens damn near every time I’ve submitted a ticket, then I’ll just continue assuming all IT guys are illiterate morons. It not that we can’t read, it is that we don’t really care what you have already done. In most cases, we know more about fixing computers than most users; that’s why we make the big bux. So I am not likely to risk wasting a lot of time assuming the user actually did what they say they did, or got the results they say they got. Problems always get resolved quicker if I assume the user hasn’t tried anythinig at all. I never put my success in the hands of the user. ---
**Author:** ![Rachellelogram](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rachellelogram/32/8689_2.png) [@Rachellelogram](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rachellelogram)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2012, 3:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-end-user/625978/51 "2012-06-23T15:21:30Z")
> [@Gukumatz](#): > > (No, I can’t replace your laptop screen. You bent it backwards over a lit candle and _melted a fucking hole in it_.) Heysoos Christy, I would have paid good money to have seen the look on your face when she brought that to you. It was a she, right? Lit candles are more of a chick thing. ---
**Author:** ![Spiny\_Norman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9de0a6/32.png) [@Spiny\_Norman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spiny_Norman)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2012, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-end-user/625978/52 "2012-06-23T18:21:49Z")
That being said - the OP sounds like someone for whom burn-out is imminent. Take up meditation or something, because once you start taking it personal, times get rough. Ponder the fact that sometimes, you’re the end user. > [@akennett](#): > > That’s all well and good, but don’t be surprised that the assumptions cut both ways. When I submit a ticket detailing exactly what I’ve done, in detail, and then get the “Well, let’s try X” response (when X was definitely on the list), then I start assuming IT folks are illiterate morons. And since this happens damn near every time I’ve submitted a ticket, then I’ll just continue assuming all IT guys are illiterate morons. Here’s the thing. As has been posted above, people _constantly_ lie about what they did to alleviate a problem. Or they communicate poorly about the sequence of actions or they use shaky terminology. It’s not a personal reflection on any one specific user, it’s just that using 10 minutes to run through the basics to establish a baseline can save a 2-hour wild goose chase for esoteric problems. It’s frustrating for the competent, honest client - but the tech can’t tell who’s whom, and he’s not going to bet hours of his time on having the luck of talking to the smart guy today. The system is geared for the lowest common denominator. > [@Curiosity\_Kills\_Her](#): > > I call this “I’m magic.” I usually insist it’s my Benevolent Presence. > [@rachelellogram](#): > > Heysoos Christy, I would have paid good money to have seen the look on your face when she brought that to you. I would have loved to see the trouble ticket. Probably “It stopped working” or some variation thereof… ---
**Author:** ![Cheshire\_Human](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/5f8ce5/32.png) [@Cheshire\_Human](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheshire_Human)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2012, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-end-user/625978/53 "2012-06-23T19:05:29Z")
> [@Curiosity\_Kills\_Her](#): > > Exactly the point I was going to make. People LIE. All the time. They think it couldn’t _possibly_ be fixed by doing something simple on their end so they lie. If anyone wants to be pissed off because we ask them to do something again don’t be pissed at us - be pissed at your idiot brethren who LIE 😉 Unless I’ve worked with you enough to observe your word can be trusted in troubleshooting scenarios I assume you’re lying. That’s exactly who _I’m_ pissed at. It’s _those_ idiots who force tech support to hire clueless monkeys to read off checklists of things I either already did, or know are irrelevant, because that’s what solves the idiot’s problem most of the time. I have to dance for the monkey for half an hour before he will pass me on to a real tech person who can answer in 30 seconds a simple question like “what IP address do I have to punch in here?[sup]1[/sup]” Of course the monkey doesn’t know what an IP address _is,_ so _he_ can’t answer the question, but until I finish all the steps on his idiot’s checklist, so he can pass me on to a real tech, I can’t get the answer I need that I _know_ will fix the thing in under a minute. 1. totally made up example pulled out of my ass. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2012, 1:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-end-user/625978/54 "2012-06-24T01:14:31Z")
> [@Curiosity\_Kills\_Her](#): > > Unless I’ve worked with you enough to observe your word can be trusted in troubleshooting scenarios I assume you’re lying. Sure. I work that way, too. Folks lie to their Physician, Lawyer, Tax Guy and parents. Why shouldn’t they lie to me, too? 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2012, 1:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-end-user/625978/55 "2012-06-24T01:44:17Z")
> [@Cheshire\_Human](#): > > That’s hire clueless monkeys to read off checklists of things I either already did, or know are irrelevant, because that’s what solves the idiot’s problem most of the time. So the bad attitude is mutual then, eh? Most techs are not “clueless”. On the contrary, we have lots of clues about how these things work, how often people lie to us, and what really solves the issue. That’s why we have this dumpster full of salt parked behind our cubes when it comes to claims you’ve done everything and it isn’t fixing the problem. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Archergal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c89c15/32.png) [@Archergal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Archergal)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2012, 1:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-end-user/625978/56 "2012-06-24T01:50:05Z")
> [@](#): > > Originally Posted by Chimera View Post > > There is something I call “The Repair Man Syndrome”. Something doesn’t work. You get the technician/help desk person on the line, you take your car into the shop, the plumber shows up… and everything works fine. And you feel like an idiot. Bad customer service people think you are one and possibly show it. Nowadays I laugh and explain that it’s just another example of TRMS, oh well, call me if it stops working again. > [@Curiosity\_Kills\_Her](#): > > I call this “I’m magic.” Word. When I was repairing equipment for IBM in the 80’s & 90’s, I really started to think that there’s something to the hypothesis that some people can affect events at a quantum level WITH THEIR MINDS. I had so many instances where I’d sit with someone while we waited for an intermittent problem to pop up, and nothing would happen. Then 10 minutes after I left, I’d get a call back, saying, “It just failed!” Crazy stuff. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2012, 3:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-end-user/625978/57 "2012-06-24T03:46:44Z")
> [@Archergal](#): > > Then 10 minutes after I left, I’d get a call back, saying, “It just failed!” > > Crazy stuff. That’s when they went to “Big Black Women dot Com” or whatever. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Curiosity\_Kills\_Her](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8c91f0/32.png) [@Curiosity\_Kills\_Her](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Curiosity_Kills_Her)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2012, 5:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-end-user/625978/58 "2012-06-24T05:12:08Z")
> [@Cheshire\_Human](#): > > That’s exactly who _I’m_ pissed at. It’s _those_ idiots who force tech support to hire clueless monkeys to read off checklists of things I either already did, or know are irrelevant, because that’s what solves the idiot’s problem most of the time. I have to dance for the monkey for half an hour before he will pass me on to a real tech person who can answer in 30 seconds a simple question like “what IP address do I have to punch in here?[sup]1[/sup]” Of course the monkey doesn’t know what an IP address _is,_ so _he_ can’t answer the question, but until I finish all the steps on his idiot’s checklist, so he can pass me on to a real tech, I can’t get the answer I need that I _know_ will fix the thing in under a minute. > > 1. totally made up example pulled out of my ass. I’ve never worked in a tiered support situation and I’ve never worked from a script and if I had to I’d be miserable and frustrated - much like you are when you get one on the line. If you called and asked what your IP address was I’d tell it to you and then suggest you write down the subnet/gateway/DNS numbers too. This internal helpdesk trouble/ticket stuff you guys refer to is also outside my realm. If I ever have to move to a more formal environment I’m doomed 😃 ---
**Author:** ![2gigch1](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/2gigch1/32/3313_2.png) [@2gigch1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/2gigch1)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2012, 5:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-end-user/625978/59 "2012-06-24T05:14:52Z")
Recently I’ve had a run of computer issues (I being one of those end users) where I will have a problem, try everything I can think of, finally fire off an email and\* the moment I hit send I realize the answer and fix it myself.\* Must have happened five times in the last month. IT keeps getting emails from me: 1:06pm “I’ve got an issue…”; 1:08pm “Nevermind.” It’s gotten to the point I’m not even embarrassed anymore, it’s just SOP. ---
**Author:** ![digs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/digs/32/14889_2.png) [@digs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/digs)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2012, 5:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-end-user/625978/60 "2012-06-24T05:29:19Z")
As an End User, I’d like to say… yeah, we’re idiots. I’m serious here. I’ve been the IT guy, and I’ve been the Too Busy To Help The IT Guy Fix My Computer guy. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-end-user/625978.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-end-user/625978.md?page=4)