# I pit the First Baptist Church of Crystal Springs, MS for not allowing a black couple to marry there **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [July 28, 2012, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-first-baptist-church-of-crystal-springs-ms-for-not-allowing-a-black-couple-to-marry-there/629688 "2012-07-28T16:24:56Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![FriarTed](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/friarted/32/1052_2.png) [@FriarTed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FriarTed)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2012, 11:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-first-baptist-church-of-crystal-springs-ms-for-not-allowing-a-black-couple-to-marry-there/629688/41 "2012-07-29T23:02:41Z")
> [@FriarTed](#): > > I hate being the one to do this… > I guess they just thought… > > it would be a nice day > for a > White Wedding! > > I lied. I loved doing that! Btw- ditto to everything said above. ---
**Author:** ![Otara](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/a88e4f/32.png) [@Otara](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otara)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2012, 11:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-first-baptist-church-of-crystal-springs-ms-for-not-allowing-a-black-couple-to-marry-there/629688/42 "2012-07-29T23:34:52Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > Especially when he claims he had to cancel the wedding because otherwise the congregation would vote him out of his position. How’s that going to work if it’s only a minority complaining? > > I definitely feel we’ve only got half the story here. 50 person congregation, 20 already hate his guts from the great prayer debacle of '84, doing this changes it to 27. Its not inherently impossible. although it does suggest utter spinelessness at best. Otara ---
**Author:** ![Condescending\_Robot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a183cd/32.png) [@Condescending\_Robot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Condescending_Robot)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2012, 11:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-first-baptist-church-of-crystal-springs-ms-for-not-allowing-a-black-couple-to-marry-there/629688/43 "2012-07-29T23:39:24Z")
More liberals trying to censor a genuine expression of Christian values! I’ll be buying an extra white marriage on Monday in their honor! ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2012, 12:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-first-baptist-church-of-crystal-springs-ms-for-not-allowing-a-black-couple-to-marry-there/629688/44 "2012-07-30T00:02:42Z")
> [@jtgain](#): > > I don’t get this at all. This isn’t about interracial marriage. These were two black people getting married. Do some racists believe that blacks shouldn’t be married? Or just not in “their” church? > > Either way, the pastor should be fired for not standing up to the assholes in his congregation. He is no leader at all. Maybe they thought that the next bride standing at the altar would be infected by teh black, and so it would become an interracial marriage. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2012, 12:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-first-baptist-church-of-crystal-springs-ms-for-not-allowing-a-black-couple-to-marry-there/629688/45 "2012-07-30T00:21:48Z")
> [@Simplicio](#): > > I think its just an attempt to make black people feel unwelcome at the Church in general. A couple that gets married in a church might want to formally join. And their guests might decide the like the place and start coming to services. And if they like the services they might join to. Or spite. Note that they waited until the day before the ceremony to tell the black couple they weren’t welcome; that’s what someone trying to cause the maximum amount of disruption and aggravation would do. ---
**Author:** ![Time\_Stranger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/5fc32e/32.png) [@Time\_Stranger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Time_Stranger)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2012, 2:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-first-baptist-church-of-crystal-springs-ms-for-not-allowing-a-black-couple-to-marry-there/629688/46 "2012-07-30T02:35:12Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > IIRC, the article cited said that the happy couple were not members of the Baptist Church in question, but attended the church freely. So, what rules are in place about “membership”? And if there is an exploitable loophole there, wouldn’t it be the “members” in good standing who can vote to change their bi-laws? If it is anything like the strict Southern Baptist church my family was a part of when I was a child (80s and 90s), you can attend the services all you want, but you’re not a member until you get baptized in front of the congregation with a ceremony (regardless if you’ve been baptized before somewhere else). You’re also expected to start tithing and attending certain functions, and this all has to get approved. But I have no idea if that’s how they do it at this church, just a guess. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2012, 4:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-first-baptist-church-of-crystal-springs-ms-for-not-allowing-a-black-couple-to-marry-there/629688/47 "2012-07-30T04:33:59Z")
Well, you know what they say, an Episcopalian is a Methodist with money, and a Methodist is a Baptist with shoes. ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2012, 11:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-first-baptist-church-of-crystal-springs-ms-for-not-allowing-a-black-couple-to-marry-there/629688/48 "2012-07-30T11:10:19Z")
> [@Time\_Stranger](#): > > If it is anything like the strict Southern Baptist church my family was a part of when I was a child (80s and 90s), you can attend the services all you want, but you’re not a member until you get baptized in front of the congregation with a ceremony (regardless if you’ve been baptized before somewhere else). You’re also expected to start tithing and attending certain functions, and this all has to get approved. But I have no idea if that’s how they do it at this church, just a guess. No idea what rules are in place for Baptists or this church in particular, but don’t some churches have a rule that at least one person in the engaged couple has to be a member before they can be married in the church? Which of course wouldn’t explain why the pastor agreed to perform the ceremony in the church until he was allegedly blackblocked by the Klan faction of his congregation. Anyone seen/heard a response from the church members? So far in the news I’ve only seen the story told by the couple themselves. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2012, 12:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-first-baptist-church-of-crystal-springs-ms-for-not-allowing-a-black-couple-to-marry-there/629688/49 "2012-07-30T12:30:20Z")
> [@VinylTurnip](#): > > Anyone seen/heard a response from the church members? So far in the news I’ve only seen the story told by the couple themselves. Just a bit in [this article](http://edition.cnn.com/2012/07/30/us/mississippi-black-couple-wedding/): > [@](#): > > On Sunday, some church members reacted to news of the wedding with surprise, many hadn’t known what happened to the Wilsons until they heard about it on the news, and offered apologies. > > “I would say I’m sorry this happened and would you forgive the people who caused it? Because we’re gonna try to,” Bob Mack told WLBT. > > Talking about the group that opposed the wedding he said: “We hope we can straighten them out, you know, get them to understand what Christianity is all about because they have some misconceptions about it.” “We screwed you over, now forgive us” is what it sounds like to me. ---
**Author:** ![stpauler](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9d8465/32.png) [@stpauler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/stpauler)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2012, 12:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-first-baptist-church-of-crystal-springs-ms-for-not-allowing-a-black-couple-to-marry-there/629688/50 "2012-07-30T12:34:42Z")
What I still don’t get is why the couple wanted the same pastor to still marry them. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2012, 1:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-first-baptist-church-of-crystal-springs-ms-for-not-allowing-a-black-couple-to-marry-there/629688/51 "2012-07-30T13:14:21Z")
> [@stpauler](#): > > What I still don’t get is why the couple wanted the same pastor to still marry them. Maybe they just wanted to get it done? ---
**Author:** ![DrumBum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e79b87/32.png) [@DrumBum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrumBum)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2012, 1:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-first-baptist-church-of-crystal-springs-ms-for-not-allowing-a-black-couple-to-marry-there/629688/52 "2012-07-30T13:27:55Z")
I wonder if they could get married at the Westboro Baptist Church ? I hear Pastor Phelps and the congregation are pretty open minded. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Revtim](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/revtim/32/1042_2.png) [@Revtim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revtim)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2012, 1:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-first-baptist-church-of-crystal-springs-ms-for-not-allowing-a-black-couple-to-marry-there/629688/53 "2012-07-30T13:29:58Z")
> [@DrumBum](#): > > I wonder if they could get married at the Westboro Baptist Church ? I hear Pastor Phelps and the congregation are pretty open minded. 😃 Strangely enough, Fred Phelps was once best known as a champion of civil rights for blacks. > **[Fred Phelps | Civil rights cases](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fred_Phelps#Civil_rights_cases)** > > Phelps earned a law degree from Washburn University in 1964, and founded the Phelps Chartered law firm. In 1969, upon a finding of professional misconduct, authorities suspended him from practicing as a lawyer for two years. > Phelps' second notable cases were related to civil rights, and his involvement in civil rights cases in and around Kansas gained him praise from local African-American leaders. > "I systematically brought down the Jim Crow laws of this town", he claimed. Phelps' daughter Shir... ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2012, 1:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-first-baptist-church-of-crystal-springs-ms-for-not-allowing-a-black-couple-to-marry-there/629688/54 "2012-07-30T13:35:17Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > Maybe they just wanted to get it done? I don’t think Larry The Cable Guy is ordained. Lord, I apologize. ---
**Author:** ![gamerunknown](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/6bbea6/32.png) [@gamerunknown](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gamerunknown)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2012, 1:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-first-baptist-church-of-crystal-springs-ms-for-not-allowing-a-black-couple-to-marry-there/629688/55 "2012-07-30T13:37:49Z")
> [@DrumBum](#): > > I hear Pastor Phelps and the congregation are pretty open minded. While their list of foibles Bekenstein abounds and googolplexes, racism doesn’t seem to be a factor… > [@Condescending Robot](#): > > I’ll be buying an extra white marriage on Monday in their honor! On the other hand, I don’t think they’d cater to the type of marriage Condescending Robot desires. ---
**Author:** ![Great\_Antibob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Great\_Antibob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Great_Antibob)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2012, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-first-baptist-church-of-crystal-springs-ms-for-not-allowing-a-black-couple-to-marry-there/629688/56 "2012-07-30T15:24:18Z")
> [@gamerunknown](#): > > On the other hand, I don’t think they’d cater to the type of marriage Condescending Robot desires. Maybe it makes me a bigot, but I draw the line at robosexuality. Next thing you know, they’ll be putting shoes on women. ---
**Author:** ![Big\_Norse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/big_norse/32/9954_2.png) [@Big\_Norse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Big_Norse)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2012, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-first-baptist-church-of-crystal-springs-ms-for-not-allowing-a-black-couple-to-marry-there/629688/57 "2012-07-30T15:28:30Z")
Without official word from the church it’s about race, it might not be about race. My family went to a Congregational church in New Hampshire that had a rule that only church members in good standing could be married there (it was a picturesque old (1775ish) white New England church with a steeple). The couple said they went to the church but weren’t members. Why they weren’t told of the church’s policy until just before the wedding is a mystery, though. ---
**Author:** ![Great\_Antibob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Great\_Antibob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Great_Antibob)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2012, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-first-baptist-church-of-crystal-springs-ms-for-not-allowing-a-black-couple-to-marry-there/629688/58 "2012-07-30T15:36:40Z")
For fuck’s sake, read the damned article before offering the bigots a break! > [@](#): > > The church’s pastor, Dr. Stan Weatherford, says he was taken by surprise by what he calls a small minority against the black marriage at the church. > > “This had never been done before here, so it was setting a new precedent, and there are those who reacted to that because of that,” said Weatherford. > > Weatherford went on and performed the wedding at a nearby church. If the pastor’s word isn’t “official”, then what the fuck is? ---
**Author:** ![gazpacho](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/6f9a4e/32.png) [@gazpacho](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gazpacho)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2012, 3:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-first-baptist-church-of-crystal-springs-ms-for-not-allowing-a-black-couple-to-marry-there/629688/59 "2012-07-30T15:46:03Z")
> [@Big\_Norse](#): > > Without official word from the church it’s about race, it might not be about race. My family went to a Congregational church in New Hampshire that had a rule that only church members in good standing could be married there (it was a picturesque old (1775ish) white New England church with a steeple). The couple said they went to the church but weren’t members. > > Why they weren’t told of the church’s policy until just before the wedding is a mystery, though. Probably because the church does not have a formal policy. The pastor probably initially thought that marrying people who attended the church was non controversial and just went ahead with things. Later a racist busybody on the governing board of the church decided to complain causing the pastor to fold like a cheap suit. ---
**Author:** ![Big\_Norse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/big_norse/32/9954_2.png) [@Big\_Norse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Big_Norse)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2012, 4:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-first-baptist-church-of-crystal-springs-ms-for-not-allowing-a-black-couple-to-marry-there/629688/60 "2012-07-30T16:09:11Z")
> [@Great\_Antibob](#): > > For fuck’s sake, read the damned article before offering the bigots a break! > > If the pastor’s word isn’t “official”, then what the fuck is? Yes, odds are good that there are racists in the congregation (but why allow the couple to attend the church at all?) but saying they were “against the black marriage” doesn’t absolutely mean they were against it because they are black, the sentence might (but probably wouldn’t) be continued: “they were against the black marriage… because the couple weren’t members of the church.” [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-first-baptist-church-of-crystal-springs-ms-for-not-allowing-a-black-couple-to-marry-there/629688.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-first-baptist-church-of-crystal-springs-ms-for-not-allowing-a-black-couple-to-marry-there/629688.md?page=4)