# I Pit the ID-demanding GOP vote-suppressors (Part 1) **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [June 12, 2012, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943 "2012-06-12T19:15:52Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 117
**Author:** ![Uzi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/91b2a8/32.png) [@Uzi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Uzi)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2012, 1:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/2321 "2012-08-18T01:18:10Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > I’m more curious what foreign Dopers make of all this. That you are all insane. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2012, 1:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/2322 "2012-08-18T01:20:27Z")
And? ---
**Author:** ![Makeitstop](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/bb73d2/32.png) [@Makeitstop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Makeitstop)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2012, 1:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/2323 "2012-08-18T01:22:59Z")
> [@Uzi](#): > > That you are all insane. You don’t have to live outside of the US to come to _that_ conclusion. But I’m willing to be that it makes this whole thing much more hilarious to watch. ---
**Author:** ![BigAppleBucky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigapplebucky/32/178_2.png) [@BigAppleBucky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigAppleBucky)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2012, 1:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/2324 "2012-08-18T01:46:40Z")
> [@CannyDan](#): > > I apologize for no longer bothering to post any new facts myself, the reward just isn’t worth my effort. But I appreciate the rest of you, whose tolerance for head banging is obviously much greater than mine. Over the last few years it seems Republicans have become impervious to facts. Until they started displaying their massive irrationality, I paid some, but not overly much attention to elections and politicking. That changed with the disastrous Dubya administrations. Jon Stewart, brilliant, as usual: [http://www.hulu.com/watch/392150](http://www.hulu.com/watch/392150) ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2012, 3:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/2325 "2012-08-18T03:16:58Z")
> [@Uzi](#): > > That you are all insane. Says the dude posting from Hong Kong. Whatever China is these days, sane it is not. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Tooth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c67d28/32.png) [@The\_Tooth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tooth)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2012, 4:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/2326 "2012-08-18T04:52:25Z")
> [@Makeitstop](#): > > You don’t have to live outside of the US to come to _that_ conclusion. But I’m willing to be that it makes this whole thing much more hilarious to watch. If you were Lichtenstein or Ecuador or something, it’d be entertaining. But you’re the United States, and you currently wield an awful lot of influence and power and your right-wingers may end up dragging the rest of us down with them. That makes it sad and frightening. ---
**Author:** ![Uzi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/91b2a8/32.png) [@Uzi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Uzi)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2012, 7:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/2327 "2012-08-18T07:54:26Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > Says the dude posting from Hong Kong. Whatever China is these days, sane it is not. Yeah, right. I made an appointment to get my work visa. Documents had already been sent. Brought my passport and forms and an hour later at a cost of ~$22US (for the visa, not the ID. ID is free, replacements about $40US) I was done. So, in the context of this discussion, China is far more sane than the US. ---
**Author:** ![Skip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ebca7d/32.png) [@Skip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skip)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2012, 7:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/2328 "2012-08-18T07:56:13Z")
Those Communist agitators (:rolleyes:) at the Brennan Center have updated their information page on the [various efforts to affect voting laws](http://www.brennancenter.org/content/resource/2012_summary_of_voting_law_changes/). I think the Dems should agree to a Voter ID law, but make it a federal Voter ID law with federal standards and federal funding and watch the Republicans blow a gasket when they start going apeshit over “STATES RIGHTS!”, which are suddenly more sacrosanct than “Voter Confidence” or “Accuracy” or whatever bullshit reason they had for pumping Voter ID at a state level. ---
**Author:** ![gamerunknown](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/6bbea6/32.png) [@gamerunknown](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gamerunknown)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2012, 10:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/2329 "2012-08-18T10:55:47Z")
[Here](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=15393210&postcount=192)’s my post from the elections forum. Anyone aware if any of the other four provisions are being complied with non-partisanly anywhere in the US? ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2012, 11:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/2330 "2012-08-18T11:54:51Z")
> [@Skip](#): > > I think the Dems should agree to a Voter ID law, but make it a federal Voter ID law with federal standards and federal funding and watch the Republicans blow a gasket when they start going apeshit over “STATES RIGHTS!”, which are suddenly more sacrosanct than “Voter Confidence” or “Accuracy” or whatever bullshit reason they had for pumping Voter ID at a state level. It would be 1964 all over again. “States’ rights” was the bullshit excuse for Jim Crow the \*last \*time, too. But why do we have to go through that again? It’s the fucking 21st century already. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2012, 2:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/2331 "2012-08-18T14:18:59Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > The state of Pennsylvania [awarded the contract to educate Pennsylvanians about the need for voter ID to a company stacked with right-wing hypocrites](http://www.democraticunderground.com/1002984227). > > The Ohio state government had a plan to limit voting in Democrat counties and backed off only after massive protests and litigation. > > One might be curious what comment the right-wing hypocrites in this thread make on these two cases. But it would be like comparing bags of feces to determine which smells less fetid. > > I’m more curious what foreign Dopers make of all this. Team Romney is following in the tradition of GW Bush et al to subvert democracy on a scale reminiscent of “banana Republics.” Half of America is unaware of it. What a pathetic joke the “Land of the Free, Home of the Brave” has turned into. I didn’t see anything here that required a comment. As much as you may wish it were otherwise, there is no rule I am aware that forbids awarding contracts to companies owned by Republicans. And since the plan in Ohio was not implemented, I have no idea what the defense of it, if any, might have been. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2012, 2:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/2332 "2012-08-18T14:25:55Z")
> [@Skip](#): > > Those Communist agitators (:rolleyes:) at the Brennan Center have updated their information page on the [various efforts to affect voting laws](http://www.brennancenter.org/content/resource/2012_summary_of_voting_law_changes/). > > I think the Dems should agree to a Voter ID law, but make it a federal Voter ID law with federal standards and federal funding and watch the Republicans blow a gasket when they start going apeshit over “STATES RIGHTS!”, which are suddenly more sacrosanct than “Voter Confidence” or “Accuracy” or whatever bullshit reason they had for pumping Voter ID at a state level. What part of the Constitution gives the federal government this power? It’s not a matter of “more sacrosanct.” In fact, this whole hypothetical displays such a basic lack of understanding that I am … Well, not even that surprised, honestly. Voter confidence is very important, but you seem to think that if something is “very important” that means the federal government can legislate it. No. Preventing the rape of children is even more important. But the federal government can’t pass a law generally forbidding the rape of children. Not because of the issue’s importance, but because that’s not a power of the federal government. Were you awake in eighth grade? What kind of grades did you get in civics? ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2012, 3:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/2333 "2012-08-18T15:02:53Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > As a matter of fact, asshole, although born in the U.S.A. I no longer live there. Pitiful excuses for humanity like you are a big reason why. Excellent. Enjoy your new worker’s paradise, wherever it may be. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2012, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/2334 "2012-08-18T16:34:13Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Excellent. Enjoy your new worker’s paradise, wherever it may be. Yeah, the lying cunts are in charge here, and that’s how Bricker likes it! Bricker, you know that [this isn’t a documentary, right?](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AK7gI5lMB7M) ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2012, 5:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/2335 "2012-08-18T17:08:03Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Excellent. Enjoy your new worker’s paradise, wherever it may be. So anyone pointing out very blatant voter suppression (still havn’t dared comment on the Ohio stunt, have you?) is a Communist. :rolleyes: You’ve really become a self-parody, you jerk. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2012, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/2336 "2012-08-18T20:41:41Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > So anyone pointing out very blatant voter suppression (still havn’t dared comment on the Ohio stunt, have you?) is a Communist. :rolleyes: > > You’ve really become a self-parody, you jerk. I said: > [@Bricker](#): > > And since the plan in Ohio was not implemented, I have no idea what the defense of it, if any, might have been. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2012, 9:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/2337 "2012-08-18T21:09:12Z")
Selective ignorance honed to a razor sharp edge. ---
**Author:** ![Skip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ebca7d/32.png) [@Skip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skip)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2012, 11:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/2338 "2012-08-18T23:30:04Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > What part of the Constitution gives the federal government this power? > > Voter confidence is very important, but you seem to think that if something is “very important” that means the federal government can legislate it. > > No. Preventing the rape of children is even more important. But the federal government can’t pass a law generally forbidding the rape of children. Not because of the issue’s importance, but because that’s not a power of the federal government. > > Were you awake in eighth grade? What kind of grades did you get in civics? Never did civics because I don’t live in the US. But the system of government is irrelevant. If “voter confidence” is to be the sole scale on whether to decide a law is implemented, and in your case it seems to be because you seem to hold voter confidence opinion polls in higher regard over whether Voter ID law is required than the evidence (or rather lack of evidence) of it’s actual occurrence, then I would expect government to make sure that “voter confidence” is placed at the highest and most effective levels of government. Having a patchwork of 50 different state Voter ID laws with differing criteria does nothing for “voter confidence”. Just like drugs are regulated by the FDA, not the CalDA or the MassDA or the TexDA each with their own rulings on whether 50mg of the latest cancer drug is fatally toxic or not. You want Voter ID laws? Fine, but Voter ID has to be standardised nationwide and a budget and administration created whose sole purpose ensures that all eligible voters have unimpeded access to the electoral process. Why wouldn’t “voter confidence” reach an all time high when the Federal Electoral and Voting Administration ensures that every eligible voter is registered and has the identification in place to cast their ballot come November 2016? ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2012, 11:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/2339 "2012-08-18T23:59:42Z")
Well, now, let’s not be hasty, no need to throw the baby into the bathwater… ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2012, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/2340 "2012-08-19T00:44:03Z")
> [@Skip](#): > > Never did civics because I don’t live in the US. But the system of government is irrelevant. > > If “voter confidence” is to be the sole scale on whether to decide a law is implemented, and in your case it seems to be because you seem to hold voter confidence opinion polls in higher regard over whether Voter ID law is required than the evidence (or rather lack of evidence) of it’s actual occurrence, then I would expect government to make sure that “voter confidence” is placed at the highest and most effective levels of government. > > Having a patchwork of 50 different state Voter ID laws with differing criteria does nothing for “voter confidence”. Just like drugs are regulated by the FDA, not the CalDA or the MassDA or the TexDA each with their own rulings on whether 50mg of the latest cancer drug is fatally toxic or not. > > You want Voter ID laws? Fine, but Voter ID has to be standardised nationwide and a budget and administration created whose sole purpose ensures that all eligible voters have unimpeded access to the electoral process. Why wouldn’t “voter confidence” reach an all time high when the Federal Electoral and Voting Administration ensures that every eligible voter is registered and has the identification in place to cast their ballot come November 2016? Drugs are regulated by the FDA because drugs are sold in interstate commerce, and the regulation of interstate commerce is a power that the Federal Government is explicitly granted by the US Constitution (Art I, Sec 8, Clause 3). NOT because it creates more or less confidence, in other words, but because the federal government has the power. See, in the United States, the federal government has limited, enumerated powers. Where it has powers, it is supreme. But unless the Constitution grants it power, it has none. States, in contrast, have plenary power: they can legislate on any subject at all. The system of government is NOT irrelevant. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943.md?page=116) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943.md?page=118)