# I Pit the ID-demanding GOP vote-suppressors (Part 1) **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [June 12, 2012, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943 "2012-06-12T19:15:52Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 32
**Author:** ![The\_Tao\_s\_Revenge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/73ab20/32.png) [@The\_Tao\_s\_Revenge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tao_s_Revenge)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2012, 4:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/621 "2012-06-27T04:27:02Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Uh huh. > > I’m pathetic. But the laws are in place. > > I’ll take that. You can have your idiotically based version of the moral high ground. Keep it, and tell all your friends how pathetic I am. I’ll nod happily, on my way to a polling place that asks for photo ID. > > Which position would you rather have? fiat accompli fallacy. Dodge the question of how many innocent people your voter ID hurt to catch a few miscreants. You don’t care how many people you hurt just so you can get your way. Is that the teaching of Jesus? Selfishness certainly is a Conservative trait. Dodge the question again, show what a coward your daddy raised. Why is it Republicans are such delusional assholes. Didn’t that retard you voted for claim there was a threat of WMD in Iraqi? Why is it you Republicans can only get your way by lying and evading the truth? (you know that thing that Jesus fellow, you claim to follow in craven hypocrisy, wouldn’t want you to do) ---
**Author:** ![The\_Tooth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c67d28/32.png) [@The\_Tooth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tooth)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2012, 4:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/622 "2012-06-27T04:35:37Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Uh huh. > > I’m pathetic. But the laws are in place. > > I’ll take that. You can have your idiotically based version of the moral high ground. Keep it, and tell all your friends how pathetic I am. We already know. ---
**Author:** ![Shayna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shayna/32/17976_2.png) [@Shayna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shayna)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2012, 5:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/623 "2012-06-27T05:46:49Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > I can’t read minds, but I can offer a guess: he meant that he believed that in prior years there had been a non-trivial amount of pro-Democratic voter fraud, and the Voter ID laws now in place will prevent similar problems this year. You are SO fucking full of shit it’s vile. The man was running off a list of GOALS that they had been working on “for years,” and checking them off the list as “Done.” [QUOTE=Mike Turzai] We are focused on making sure that we meet our **obligations** that **we’ve talked about for years** : [ul] [li]Pro-Second Amendment? The Castle Doctrine is Done.[/li][li]The first Pro-life legislation—abortion facility regulations—in 22, years, Done.[/li][li]Voter ID, **which is gonna allow Governor Romney to win the state of Pennsylvania—Done.** [/ul][/li][/QUOTE] It’s beneath contempt for you to play stupid and act as if this scam hasn’t finally been exposed to the light of day. We aren’t stupid, but you’re a goddamn imbecile to keep up this fucking charade. Asshole. ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2012, 11:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/624 "2012-06-27T11:24:22Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > No. How about this idea: Obama won in 2008 by only 590,000 legitimate votes and got 10,000 illegal votes. This year, based on his declining popularity, he will lose Pennsylvania by 5,000 votes. But of course if he got those same 10,000 illegal votes, then he would win. So the comment is: because this year will be so close, eliminating the illegal aliens who routinely vote Democratic should do the trick. There weren’t 10 last time, and you’re suggesting 10,000. Sell your fantasy scare stories to the gullible. Next time, before you offer to send flowers to the perky breasted skydiving quad, ask for a photo ID. Pathetic. Douchenozzle. ---
**Author:** ![gamerunknown](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/6bbea6/32.png) [@gamerunknown](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gamerunknown)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2012, 11:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/625 "2012-06-27T11:51:40Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > But of course if he got those same 10,000 illegal votes, then he would win. Say what you will about this hypothetical fraudsters, they’re remarkably consistent. Unlike those 590k~ apathetic voters. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2012, 12:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/626 "2012-06-27T12:43:54Z")
> [@Shayna](#): > > You are SO fucking full of shit it’s vile. The man was running off a list of GOALS that they had been working on “for years,” and checking them off the list as “Done.” > > It’s beneath contempt for you to play stupid and act as if this scam hasn’t finally been exposed to the light of day. We aren’t stupid, but you’re a goddamn imbecile to keep up this fucking charade. Sure. Voter ID has been a goal for years, because there have been illegal voters for years. I assume you agree it hasn’t been a goal to elect Romney for years; that was a parenthetical comment on his part. You sure you’re not stupid? ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2012, 12:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/627 "2012-06-27T12:46:35Z")
> [@The\_Tao\_s\_Revenge](#): > > fiat accompli fallacy. Holy shit. You actually properly identified a fallacy. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2012, 12:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/628 "2012-06-27T12:49:46Z")
> [@Lobohan](#): > > The one where I’m a good human being, as opposed to you, an outright evil fake-Christian who Christ himself would have denounced. > > I’ll note that you’re too much of a coward to answer the central point of my post. Your solution causes more damage than the problem. But that’s okay, because only poor people and Democrats are being hit. It’s my position that the solution creates a system whereby we can be confident that the votes cast are from legitimate voters. It’s my further opinion, just reached now, that this scares the shit out of you because you know how much the Democrats value illegal aliens’ and (where not permitted) convicted felons’ votes. In short, a Voter ID system scares you because you know that losing illegal votes hurts the Democrats. ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2012, 1:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/629 "2012-06-27T13:14:25Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > In short, a Voter ID system scares you because you know that losing illegal votes hurts the Democrats. How can we fear something that doesn’t exist? We’re not, by and large, conservatives after all. I wouldn’t care in the least if you took away all the fraudulent voters. Since they don’t exist, the net impact would be 0. Repeating this over and over, and puttng a fear of it in other’s mouths, demonstrates what an irredeemable piece of shit you are. Get this through your deceitful skull - there are just as many fraudulent voters as there are skydiving perky breasted dead quadriplegics. ---
**Author:** ![CannyDan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cannydan/32/548_2.png) [@CannyDan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CannyDan)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2012, 1:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/630 "2012-06-27T13:18:52Z")
> [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](#): > > How can we fear something that doesn’t exist? We’re not, by and large, conservatives after all. > > I wouldn’t care in the least if you took away all the fraudulent voters. Since they don’t exist, the net impact would be 0. Repeating this over and over, and puttng a fear of it in other’s mouths, demonstrates what an irredeemable piece of shit you are. > > Get this through your deceitful skull - there are just as many fraudulent voters as there are skydiving perky breasted dead quadriplegics. Don’t bother. The next comeback will focus on the fact that he quoted **Lobohan** and specified “you”, thus his comment wasn’t (necessarily) directed toward all of us (“we”). Or some other diversion. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2012, 1:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/631 "2012-06-27T13:22:52Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > It’s my position that the solution creates a system whereby we can be confident that the votes cast are from legitimate voters. Again, friend Dipshit, _voter confidence_ at the cost of 1000+ legitimate voters being disenfranchised for each of the fraudulent voters is something that an idiot would advocate. Especially when said confidence only applies to those that adhere to a conspiracy theory that is promulgated by right-wing news sources. I don’t think you’re an idiot, so all we’re left with is you being so ugly and evil that you are okay with keeping the poor from voting. Do you think Jesus would be okay with that you fat fucking hypocrite? Or do you think that your table would get flipped over? > [@](#): > > It’s my further opinion, just reached now, that this scares the shit out of you because you know how much the Democrats value illegal aliens’ and (where not permitted) convicted felons’ votes. In short, a Voter ID system scares you because you know that losing illegal votes hurts the Democrats. Hold up a moment, you sickening wretch, there are no illegal votes. They are a lie that FOX News tells beady-eyed yokels to scare them. You’re no beady-eyed yokel, friend Bricker, you’re smarter than the hooples. You know your argument is full of shit, but you make it anyway. You do this because you are okay with winning by cheating. Because you think that oppressing a few hundred thousand poor people is funny, because they shouldn’t even get to vote in the first place. You have a veneer, Bricker. A paper-thin surface that looks to be civility and intellect, but underneath, you’re a boiling mass of maggots. ---
**Author:** ![JKellyMap](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jkellymap/32/15880_2.png) [@JKellyMap](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JKellyMap)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2012, 1:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/632 "2012-06-27T13:35:22Z")
Gar Alperovitz’s book “The Decision to Use the Atomic Bomb and the Architecture of an American Myth” includes an excellent account of how the “official/popularly accepted figure” for “how many US soldiers’ lives were spared by not having to invide mainland Japan” gradually increased, without anyone really taking much notice, from something like 5,000 to something like 1 million. It’s fascinating – all it took was for one official (Truman, say, or his then-Sec. of State James Byrnes) to casually mention a figure that was just a little more than the last figure someone mentioned…etc…etc…and now you have a whole generation of Americans who take it as cold hard fact that the atom bombs “saved” many, many US (and Japanese) lives.\* Something similar seems to be going on with the “voter fraud” horseshit figures. Except that this time, only half of the American populace, at most (I hope), is falling for it. \*(This is besides the equally contestable notion that we would have had to invade Japan at all, whatever the causalty figure, had we not dropped the bombs. But that’s tangential to my point here.) ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2012, 1:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/633 "2012-06-27T13:36:46Z")
> [@Lobohan](#): > > Again, friend Dipshit, _voter confidence_ at the cost of 1000+ legitimate voters being disenfranchised for each of the fraudulent voters is something that an idiot would advocate. Especially when said confidence only applies to those that adhere to a conspiracy theory that is promulgated by right-wing news sources. No one is being disenfranchised. Not one person. > [@](#): > > You have a veneer, Bricker. A paper-thin surface that looks to be civility and intellect, but underneath, you’re a boiling mass of maggots. But they’re all really smart maggots. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2012, 1:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/634 "2012-06-27T13:42:06Z")
> [@JKellyMap](#): > > Gar Alperovitz’s book “The Decision to Use the Atomic Bomb and the Architecture of an American Myth” includes an excellent account of how the “official/popularly accepted figure” for “how many US soldiers’ lives were spared by not having to invide mainland Japan” gradually increased, without anyone really taking much notice, from something like 5,000 to something like 1 million. It’s fascinating – all it took was for one official (Truman, say, or his then-Sec. of State James Byrnes) to casually mention a figure that was just a little more than the last figure someone mentioned…etc…etc…and now you have a whole generation of Americans who take it as cold hard fact that the atom bombs “saved” many, many US (and Japanese) lives.\* > > Something similar seems to be going on with the “voter fraud” horseshit figures. Except that this time, only half of the American populace, at most (I hope), is falling for it. > > \*(This is besides the equally contestable notion that we would have had to invade Japan at all, whatever the causalty figure, had we not dropped the bombs. But that’s tangential to my point here.) Another proud liberal position. We wouldn’t have had to invade Japan. They were hjust about to be really really sorry for everything they did. They had some consciousness raising right before Hiroshima, and understood that their Phallic Imperialism was Wrong. They were going to participate in Healing Encounters with the comfort women, I bet, but our mean ol’ nasty bomb ruined it all. Ah, liberals. You guys should kiss the feet of every conservative that makes it possible for you to live you poor, deluded, simple lives. Every conservative that goes to work every day so that you guys are free to sit in coffee shops, read Mother Jones, and apply for NEA grants is a conservative you should be offering to fellate in gratitude. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2012, 1:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/635 "2012-06-27T13:43:43Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > No one is being disenfranchised. Not one person. Then, by all means, let us reinstate the poll tax. Bricker says it is okay. > [@](#): > > But they’re all really smart maggots. Smart, but evil. As I say, I don’t think you’re a fool. I think you’re a bad person and that your parents failed utterly to instill in you anything resembling mammalian notions of fairness and decency. I will note that you still to address the point, your fix for a problem that only exists in the minds of misinformed people makes the problem ten thousand times worse. Thank goodness that the problem is centered among those you don’t think should get a vote. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2012, 1:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/636 "2012-06-27T13:55:59Z")
[There’s gonna be a mighty battle-of-the-lawyers over the “voter-fraud” thing, anyway.](http://apnews.excite.com/article/20120627/D9VL56IG0.html) > [@](#): > > **Obama prepping thousands of lawyers for election** > > Jun 26, 8:26 PM (ET) > > By MIKE BAKER > > OLYMPIA, Wash. (AP) - President Barack Obama’s campaign has recruited a legion of lawyers to be on standby for this year’s election as legal disputes surrounding the voting process escalate. > > Thousands of attorneys and support staffers have agreed to aid in the effort, providing a mass of legal support that appears to be unrivaled by Republicans or precedent. Obama’s campaign says it is particularly concerned about the implementation of new voter ID laws across the country, the possibility of anti-fraud activists challenging legitimate voters and the handling of voter registrations in the most competitive states. > > Republicans are building their own legal teams for the election. They say they’re focused on preventing fraud - making sure people don’t vote unless they’re eligible - rather than turning away qualified voters. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2012, 2:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/637 "2012-06-27T14:02:27Z")
> [@Lobohan](#): > > Then, by all means, let us reinstate the poll tax. Bricker says it is okay. It’s not a poll tax. You do not have the right, or the power, to define words however you wish. The question of a poll tax is one of law. The Supreme Court has the ultimate power to interpret the law, and they say: > [@](#): > > If such considerations had provided the only justification for a photo identification requirement, we may also assume that SEA 483 would suffer the same fate as the poll tax at issue in Harper. > > ``` > But if a nondiscriminatory law is supported by valid neutral justifications, those justifications should not be disregarded simply because partisan interests may have provided one motivation for the votes of individual legislators. The state interests identified as justifications for SEA 483 are both neutral and sufficiently strong to require us to reject petitioners’ facial attack on the statute. The application of the statute to the vast majority of Indiana voters is amply justified by the valid interest in protecting “the integrity and reliability of the electoral process.” > > ``` I know you may need help with the big words, so I’ll translate: _Lobohan you fucking tool, it’s not a poll tax. Sincerely, Justice Stevens._ ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2012, 2:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/638 "2012-06-27T14:04:04Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > [There’s gonna be a mighty battle-of-the-lawyers over the “voter-fraud” thing, anyway.](http://apnews.excite.com/article/20120627/D9VL56IG0.html) It’s not my area of law, but you guys are convincing me I should volunteer my services to the correct side of this battle. I wonder who I talk to to do that? ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2012, 2:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/639 "2012-06-27T14:03:49Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Another proud liberal position. We wouldn’t have had to invade Japan. They were hjust about to be really really sorry for everything they did. They had some consciousness raising right before Hiroshima, and understood that their Phallic Imperialism was Wrong. They were going to participate in Healing Encounters with the comfort women, I bet, but our mean ol’ nasty bomb ruined it all. > > Ah, liberals. You guys should kiss the feet of every conservative that makes it possible for you to live you poor, deluded, simple lives. Every conservative that goes to work every day so that you guys are free to sit in coffee shops, read Mother Jones, and apply for NEA grants is a conservative you should be offering to fellate in gratitude. First, the post you are responding to took no position vis a vis the morality or acceptability of bombing or invading Japan. Really, how can anyone still describe Bricker as intelligent? The guy’s a moron. Is it because he is not, apparently, drooling? Secondly, one party was for isolationism during that era. It wasn’t the one associated with liberaliam, that’s for sure. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2012, 2:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/640 "2012-06-27T14:10:27Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > It’s not a poll tax. You do not have the right, or the power, to define words however you wish. The question of a poll tax is one of law. The Supreme Court has the ultimate power to interpret the law, and they say: > > I know you may need help with the big words, so I’ll translate: > > _Lobohan you fucking tool, it’s not a poll tax. Sincerely, Justice Stevens._ I didn’t say it \*was \*a poll tax. I suggested it was a defacto poll tax. Also, there are no _valid neutral justifications_. You’re deflecting Bricker. Let’s talk some more about how you are such a coward that you don’t address that your solution is thousands of times worse than the problem. Or how about that you know better, but are willing to offer lip service to a conspiracy theory so that your side can win by cheating. Or that you have the nerve to call yourself a Christian, yet Christ would zap your fig tree. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943.md?page=31) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943.md?page=33)