# I Pit the ID-demanding GOP vote-suppressors (Part 1) **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [June 12, 2012, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943 "2012-06-12T19:15:52Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 396
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2014, 8:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/7901 "2014-11-26T20:36:29Z")
Rather witty, actually. For a Republican. Not Dennis Miller level, no, but still… ---
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2014, 9:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/7902 "2014-11-26T21:50:22Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Pro tip: sure it does. The “discussion” here concerns the legitimacy of Voter ID laws. The fact that those laws were correctly passed and upheld is a clear indication of their legitimacy. If they are overturned by the courts, doesn’t that contradict your assumption? Is a nullified law “legitimate?” ---
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2014, 9:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/7903 "2014-11-26T21:54:42Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > Got any examples of “holding violations” known to have been ignored? Feel free to present some if you think you can tolerate the judgements of the “referee”. I can’t cite the exact games, but, kinda, yeah. There have been cases where a ref made a really, really bad call, and, in an attempt to make up for it, has overlooked a similar violation from the victimized team. It’s certainly not an official policy, but it has been done. It’s stupid and/or dishonest for **Bricker** to bring up as a comparison. But, in major league football, it has happened. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2014, 10:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/7904 "2014-11-26T22:57:10Z")
> [@Lobohan](#): > > No, it’s not. I, and most here, are saying that the laws are bad policy, a transparent power grab, and morally reprehensible. > [@Bricker](#): > > Trying to legislate your morality on the rest of us? > > Keep your laws off my body’s photo ID. > [@Lobohan](#): > > No, I’m trying to advocate that bad policy not be enacted. Since it does more harm than it cures. But also legislate your morality, as you clearly said that you felt the laws were morally reprehensible. But let’s “pretend” that it’s all about bad policy concerns. What should be done? What are you “advocating,” specifically? ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2014, 11:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/7905 "2014-11-26T23:17:19Z")
Can’t the law be immoral AND a bad idea? What’s with the attempt at exclusivity? ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2014, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/7906 "2014-11-26T23:22:14Z")
> [@Trinopus](#): > > If they are overturned by the courts, doesn’t that contradict your assumption? Yes, if overturned as a final judgement. A lower court’s ruling that is then reversed is not contradictory of my assumption. > [@](#): > > Is a nullified law “legitimate?” Nope. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2014, 11:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/7907 "2014-11-26T23:23:36Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > Can’t the law be immoral AND a bad idea? What’s with the attempt at exclusivity? Sure. That’s why the word"also" appears in my post 7904. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2014, 11:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/7908 "2014-11-26T23:58:13Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > But also legislate your morality, as you clearly said that you felt the laws were morally reprehensible. The disconnect we have here, is that I have a sense of morality, and you are an immoral prick. But that said, I also think slavery is morally reprehensible. I also think that raping children is morally reprehensible. I also think that killing prisoners is morally reprehensible. I think a lot of things are morally reprehensible. That is separate from those things being illegal. > [@](#): > > But let’s “pretend” that it’s all about bad policy concerns. Like you pretend that your opposition to abortion is based on secular concerns? In this case at least, I am moved by the policy in question, voter IDs being implemented in a manner that distorts elections more than it safeguards them. It fights the nearly non-existent in-person voter fraud, and makes it harder for orders of magnitude more people from voting. A solution that is worse than the problem isn’t a good solution. Especially when that solution was cynically enacted to give lasting partisan advantage to a political party. It’s morally wrong, because cheating is bad, and it is bad policy, because it doesn’t do anything but provide electoral advantage at the cost of creating a disincentive for people to vote. > [@](#): > > What should be done? What are you “advocating,” specifically? The GOP should as a unit, die of super-Herpes. But barring that, the bad policy laws should be removed. Because bad policy should be removed. The shitty thing, is that the dishonest people who cynically enacted these laws are more likely to stay in place because of them. And degenerates like you, and ignorant dupes like Clothy will keep on checking the box that is marked, “R”. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2014, 12:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/7909 "2014-11-27T00:21:16Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Sure. That’s why the word"also" appears in my post 7904. 7904 also includes: > [@](#): > > But let’s “pretend” that it’s all about bad policy concerns. Why the quotes around “pretend” and why would we pretend (or “pretend”) that it was ALL about bad policy? ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2014, 6:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/7910 "2014-11-27T06:33:27Z")
> [@Lobohan](#): > > The GOP should as a unit, die of super-Herpes. But barring that, the bad policy laws should be removed. Because bad policy should be removed. But what if you think a particular law puts forth bad policy and someone else disagrees. Let’s say you think a law is immoral and creates bad policy but 51% of the people disagree with you, then what should be done? That’s what is being asked of you. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2014, 7:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/7911 "2014-11-27T07:57:01Z")
This will all be academic after the President for Life Amendment passes… ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2014, 3:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/7912 "2014-11-27T15:10:01Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > But what if you think a particular law puts forth bad policy and someone else disagrees. Let’s say you think a law is immoral and creates bad policy but 51% of the people disagree with you, then what should be done? > > That’s what is being asked of you. If I may, I suggest he continue to talk about how the law is bad policy and publicize examples of its failings and if he feels like it, make political contributions to PACs that support candidates opposed to the law and to PACs that oppose candidates who support the law. Perhaps he could also volunteer his time and/or contribute some money to organizations who help the poor register and/or get identification. Basically continue to exercise the rights all Americans enjoy as long as those rights exist. You and Bricker and Clothahump are of course free to exercise your rights to do the converse. ---
**Author:** ![Clothahump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/51bf81/32.png) [@Clothahump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clothahump)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2014, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/7913 "2014-11-27T19:20:00Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > For what it’s worth, I’m not inclined to call Clothahump horrible, etc. but certainly foolish and short-sighted for assuming that since it was easy for him, it must be easy for everybody. It’s a child’s view of the world. It is easy for everybody. We all know when the elections are going to be held, it’s not like they are secret. The Texas voter ID law was passed in 2011. The elections were held in 2014. If someone can’t be bothered to get themselves down to a DPS office in\*\* three friggin’ years time\*\*, the issue is most assuredly NOT with the law. And Texas bends over backwards to [make it easy.](http://votetexas.gov/register-to-vote/need-id/) This whole thing about voter IDs being evil is nonsensical horseshit and has been from day one. ---
**Author:** ![Clothahump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/51bf81/32.png) [@Clothahump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clothahump)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2014, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/7914 "2014-11-27T19:21:03Z")
> [@MaxTheVool](#): > > “Every time I vote I just pay the poll tax…” > “Every time I vote the nice old white man gives me the literacy test and I do my best and he always says I pass…” Get a bigger shovel, Max, you’re not piling the horseshit high enough or fast enough. ---
**Author:** ![Clothahump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/51bf81/32.png) [@Clothahump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clothahump)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2014, 7:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/7915 "2014-11-27T19:23:36Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > Don’t flatter yourself. You are not smart enough to be evil. We’re just pointing and laughing at the useful idiot who does what Hannity tells him. I don’t flatter myself in the slightest. I am smarter than the majority of people on this board, that is a given. I’m certainly smarter than you - considering that I don’t listen to Hannity, you must have been thinking of someone else and posted this to me by mistake. ---
**Author:** ![Clothahump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/51bf81/32.png) [@Clothahump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clothahump)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2014, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/7916 "2014-11-27T19:26:51Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > Maybe it hasn’t caused you any difficulty because you never had to decide which bill you’re not going to pay in order to take a day off to wrestle with the bureaucracy to get the ID in the first place. How fucking stupid do you have to be to realize that the mere act of getting an ID is a hardship for some people? See my earlier post about how easy it is to do in Texas. It’s not a hardship. That’s a bullshit statement. Oh, and since you are obviously such an expert on my life…please show proof that I’ve never had to decide which bill I’m not going to pay at any given time for any reason whatsoever. Until you can do that, I suggest you STFU. ---
**Author:** ![Clothahump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/51bf81/32.png) [@Clothahump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clothahump)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2014, 7:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/7917 "2014-11-27T19:28:23Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > If I may, I suggest he continue to talk about how the law is bad policy and publicize examples of its failings and if he feels like it, make political contributions to PACs that support candidates opposed to the law and to PACs that oppose candidates who support the law. Perhaps he could also volunteer his time and/or contribute some money to organizations who help the poor register and/or get identification. Basically continue to exercise the rights all Americans enjoy as long as those rights exist. > > You and Bricker and Clothahump are of course free to exercise your rights to do the converse. Please show proof that I do the converse. Until you can, please STFU with your assumptions about my life. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2014, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/7918 "2014-11-27T19:36:37Z")
> [@Clothahump](#): > > Please show proof that I do the converse. Until you can, please STFU with your assumptions about my life. Your frothy outrage is affecting your ability to read simple English. I made no assumptions about what you are actually doing, just an observation on what you CAN do. At this point, though, I’m prepared to assume that aside from posting on this board, what you are actually doing is nothing. Same as me, really. Incidentally, I’ll happily make lots of assumptions about your life, so STFU with the STFUs. Or don’t, whatever. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2014, 2:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/7919 "2014-11-28T02:23:29Z")
> [@Clothahump](#): > > See my earlier post about how easy it is to do in Texas. It’s not a hardship. That’s a bullshit statement. > > Oh, and since you are obviously such an expert on my life…please show proof that I’ve never had to decide which bill I’m not going to pay at any given time for any reason whatsoever. Until you can do that, I suggest you STFU. I know you’ve never had to decide which bill not to pay in order to get a voter ID. But you have no qualms about putting other people in that situation. I have given your suggestion all the consideration that it deserves. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2014, 4:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/7920 "2014-11-28T16:28:02Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > Why the quotes around “pretend” and why would we pretend (or “pretend”) that it was ALL about bad policy? Because it would be a pretense. Your question tries to suggest that you have no idea why it would a pretense. Because you “forgot,” or pretended not to have seen: > [@Lobohan](#): > > No, it’s not. I, and most here, are saying that the laws are bad policy, a transparent power grab, \*\*and morally reprehensible. \*\* [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943.md?page=395) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943.md?page=397)