# I Pit the ID-demanding GOP vote-suppressors (Part 1) **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [June 12, 2012, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943 "2012-06-12T19:15:52Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 433
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2016, 9:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/8641 "2016-03-08T09:02:34Z")
…Kierkegaard went full retard and blamed it all on Jesus Wall-eyed Sartre lit a sideways fart and blew his ass to pieces… ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2016, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/8642 "2016-03-08T14:40:20Z")
Odd, isn’t it, how his position that “It’s a law and it has some popular support so suck it” reverses when the subject is abortion. ---
**Author:** ![MaxTheVool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9fc29f/32.png) [@MaxTheVool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MaxTheVool)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2016, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/8643 "2016-03-08T16:23:25Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Instead, I am saying that there is no common ground by which we both can agree that the law may be judged as ethical or not ethical. Our discussions on that point amount to my assertions gainsaying yours and yours denying mine. What I don’t understand about your position is how you ever came to the conclusion that it was ethical to begin with. I’ve repeatedly stated in this thread that I’m not an expert in sociology or urban planning or urban demographics or precisely what specialty one would have to be an expert in in order to really evaluate how much of an impact a voter ID law would have on the population of a state. If the law says a that a driver’s license is required, then the actual impact it has depends on how many people already have driver’s licenses, how much money it costs to get a DL, how much other paperwork is needed in order to get a DL, how convenient it is to get to somewhere where a DL is issued, how clearly all of the above are communicated to the electorate; and of course to really assess the political impact one also has to know to what extent any or all of the above have a disparate impact across demographic groups that lean towards one political party or the other. So, as I said, not only do I not have answers to any of the above, I don’t even know how to get them. So it beats me what the impact will be. So, why am I pretending to know that these laws will have an antiDemocratic effect? Because I believe that the people who proposed the laws in the first place did so in order to have an antiDemocratic effect, and those people, while evil and cynical, are not fools. Therefore in the absence of really good data, and maybe the recent study is a step in the right direction and maybe it isn’t, I’m skeptical and cynical about the laws and their effects and the motives of the people who proposed them. Your position, on the other hand, seems to be either “well, having a driver’s license doesn’t sound onerous to me, so hey, I will assume it’s OK” or else “well, I have no idea how hard it is to actually fulfill these voter ID requirements. But the courts say that it’s not an undue burden, so I will base my ethical position on the court’s findings” or something like that. How can you be confident that you really know how onerous or burdensome it really is for tens of thousands of voters to actually meet these requirements? ---
**Author:** ![xenophon41](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xenophon41/32/253_2.png) [@xenophon41](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/xenophon41)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2016, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/8644 "2016-03-08T17:13:55Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > Odd, isn’t it, how his position that “It’s a law and it has some popular support so suck it” reverses when the subject is abortion. Doesn’t really summarize **Bricker** ’s position really; it’s sort of a place-card argument, I think. Right there at the front of his portfolio, he pulls it out whenever the situation reasonably allows one of its dual uses: “My position’s made it’s way [fully/mostly/somewhat] through the appellate process and looks like I’m right,” or “your position has not been [fully/reasonably/appropriately] tested in the courts and the statutes could be changed legislatively at any time.” I mean, why not use a tool that versatile, really? It’s probably on the back of his business cards. (The obverse of which should have a nice looking crest below “Bricker, Esq.” that looks sort of like a griffin rampant, but is actually a calligraphic design which says “liberal hypocrisy!”) ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2016, 5:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/8645 "2016-03-08T17:28:00Z")
> [@MaxTheVool](#): > > What I don’t understand about your position is how you ever came to the conclusion that it was ethical to begin with. I’ve repeatedly stated in this thread that I’m not an expert in sociology or urban planning or urban demographics or precisely what specialty one would have to be an expert in in order to really evaluate how much of an impact a voter ID law would have on the population of a state. If the law says a that a driver’s license is required, then the actual impact it has depends on how many people already have driver’s licenses, how much money it costs to get a DL, how much other paperwork is needed in order to get a DL, how convenient it is to get to somewhere where a DL is issued, how clearly all of the above are communicated to the electorate; and of course to really assess the political impact one also has to know to what extent any or all of the above have a disparate impact across demographic groups that lean towards one political party or the other. I don’t particularly care if there is a disparate impact. I arrive at my conclusion by noting how utterly pervasive the presence of photo ID is in our society. I listen to the description of what is necessary to obtain that photo ID, and I judge whether it is particularly difficult. I grew up very poor, and am no stranger to the choices that poverty demands, so I have some confidence that my view is not badly askew. Of course, I also hold the view that there is value in making voting NOT as easy as possible. I believe in the maxim that what we obtain too cheap, we esteem too lightly. So I like the idea of a polling place and a single day of voting over total mail-in balloting, because my personal opinion is that we get better results when voters WANT to vote instead of being able to toss a casual vote in because they have a free five minutes. But those are personal views. I fully accept a state’s collective decision to abolish polling places and vote by mail, because I don’t believe my personal preferences trump the democratic process. ---
**Author:** ![Buck\_Godot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/buck_godot/32/6573_2.png) [@Buck\_Godot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buck_Godot)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2016, 5:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/8646 "2016-03-08T17:39:11Z")
So Bricker, suppose several states ruled by Democratic majorities, made the decision to close all rural voting location and move them into the inner city. The stated purpose is that by not having to transport ballots and voting machines to and from distant locations the state will save money. While it may be an inconvenience to rural voters (who purely by coincidence tend to vote Republican) to have to travel 200 miles and fight rush hour traffic to get into the city to vote, any who don’t bother just weren’t engaged and so excluding their vote is probably a good thing. What it your opinion of the above policy? Pit worthy? Legitimate? Democracy at its finest? ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2016, 6:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/8647 "2016-03-08T18:27:36Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > I grew up very poor, and am no stranger to the choices that poverty demands, so I have some confidence that my view is not badly askew. There is a difference between growing up without money, and growing up in generational poverty. Your father was able to emigrate here. I imagine he had a trade of some sort, right? Which means he wasn’t inflicted with the sort of ignorance that generational poverty causes. I think you’d agree I’m not terribly stupid. I know I’m a liberal devil, who wants to destroy baby Jesus. But when I grew up, on welfare and govt. cheese, I literally thought you had to pay for college up front. I did the calculation, and it would take some ungodly number of years to pay for it at minimum wage, and I could never conceive that I’d make much more than that. So I felt that it was just out of reach. Better to not even dwell on it. I was the same with home ownership. I thought that it was just something that “rich people” did. It would never happen for me. As it happens both things were eventually wrong. But it took some good people to help me along the way, some natural talent for my trade, and a supportive girlfriend/wife. Not everyone born in my position is as lucky as I am. The ignorance and hopelessness of someone living in generational poverty is vast. It’s a trap. And just because you could get your ID at a whim, hardly means that someone who has been limping along without one is going to be able to as a trivial act. Ignorance, transportation, shitty work schedules, kids, and more make getting an ID for some members of the populace fairly difficult. I’ve mentioned this before, but what if Dems made rules that all voting places had to be on the third floor of a walk up building? You think the little grey-hairs in their scooters and oxygen tanks that make up the GOP base would vote as much? Targeted changes to make it harder for an already voting demographic that favors one side is pretty shitty. And the fact that years down the line, you’re still embracing it, doesn’t speak well for you. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2016, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/8648 "2016-03-08T20:10:29Z")
> [@Buck\_Godot](#): > > So Bricker, suppose several states ruled by Democratic majorities, made the decision to close all rural voting location and move them into the inner city. The stated purpose is that by not having to transport ballots and voting machines to and from distant locations the state will save money. While it may be an inconvenience to rural voters (who purely by coincidence tend to vote Republican) to have to travel 200 miles and fight rush hour traffic to get into the city to vote, any who don’t bother just weren’t engaged and so excluding their vote is probably a good thing. > > What it your opinion of the above policy? Pit worthy? Legitimate? Democracy at its finest? To remind you of the process I said I used, this time with emphasis: > [@Bricker](#): > > I don’t particularly care if there is a disparate impact. > > I arrive at my conclusion by noting how utterly pervasive the presence of photo ID is in our society.\*\* I listen to the description of what is necessary to obtain that photo ID, and I judge whether it is particularly difficult.\*\* Applying that same process to what you describe, I’d find a 200 mile journey for every election to be so difficult as to be unduly burdensome, and I’d oppose it. Of course, I am also confident that courts hearing the inevitable challenges would agree. If they did not, I’d accept that my view of “too difficult” was outside the norm. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2016, 8:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/8649 "2016-03-08T20:31:29Z")
> [@Lobohan](#): > > There is a difference between growing up without money, and growing up in generational poverty. Your father was able to emigrate here. I imagine he had a trade of some sort, right? Which means he wasn’t inflicted with the sort of ignorance that generational poverty causes. Well, he came from “generational poverty.” His home was a corrugated tin walls and a dirt floor in a San Salvador barrio. His father was not married to his mother, and not part of his life. Indeed, I never knew my paternal grandparents. My paternal grandmother was mestizo, a mix of Lenca Indian and some unknown European blood. I don’t know a thing about her upbringing, but feel safe in saying that she was not a product of wealth, nor would you find wealth in her background. I agree he wasn’t ignorant, but it wasn’t because he avoided “generational poverty.” He once told me that, when he was trying to save money to come here, his mother asked him why he was doing it, and he told her he wanted to make something of himself. And she asked him, genuinely puzzled, “Why?” My dad has been gone for 30 years now and I still remember him telling me that. I remember where we were, the lighting, where we were sitting, everything. So no, you cannot sell me on the idea that generational poverty is some sort of quicksand that cannot be escaped. > [@](#): > > I think you’d agree I’m not terribly stupid. I know I’m a liberal devil, who wants to destroy baby Jesus. But when I grew up, on welfare and govt. cheese, I literally thought you had to pay for college up front. I did the calculation, and it would take some ungodly number of years to pay for it at minimum wage, and I could never conceive that I’d make much more than that. So I felt that it was just out of reach. Better to not even dwell on it. > > I was the same with home ownership. I thought that it was just something that “rich people” did. It would never happen for me. As it happens both things were eventually wrong. But it took some good people to help me along the way, some natural talent for my trade, and a supportive girlfriend/wife. You knew how to read? You had a public library where you were? > [@](#): > > And just because you could get your ID at a whim, hardly means that someone who has been limping along without one is going to be able to as a trivial act. Ignorance, transportation, shitty work schedules, kids, and more make getting an ID for some members of the populace fairly difficult. I do not agree. ---
**Author:** ![Lochdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/edb3f5/32.png) [@Lochdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lochdale)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2016, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/8650 "2016-03-08T20:41:18Z")
I was just back in Ireland. Had to have ID to vote yet we didn’t have pictures on our drivers licenses until a couple of years ago. ID for voting is a very reasonable thing, histrionics aside. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2016, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/8651 "2016-03-08T20:54:06Z")
> [@Lochdale](#): > > I was just back in Ireland. Had to have ID to vote yet we didn’t have pictures on our drivers licenses until a couple of years ago. > > ID for voting is a very reasonable thing, histrionics aside. Yes it actually is. But don’t you agree that if there are a large amount of people currently who don’t have IDs and they mostly vote for one party, you should make sure that there is universal possession of IDs before you start requiring them? ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2016, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/8652 "2016-03-08T20:59:52Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > I do not agree. And we all know why not, too. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2016, 9:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/8653 "2016-03-08T21:00:31Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Well, he came from “generational poverty.” His home was a corrugated tin walls and a dirt floor in a San Salvador barrio. His father was not married to his mother, and not part of his life. Indeed, I never knew my paternal grandparents. My paternal grandmother was mestizo, a mix of Lenca Indian and some unknown European blood. I don’t know a thing about her upbringing, but feel safe in saying that she was not a product of wealth, nor would you find wealth in her background. So your father accomplished what I did. That doesn’t mean you have any idea of what its like to grow up in generational poverty. > [@](#): > > I agree he wasn’t ignorant, but it wasn’t because he avoided “generational poverty.” He was lucky. And you should be thankful that he had the confluence of knowledge, intelligence, and lack of risk-aversion that got you the situation that made your successes possible. > [@](#): > > He once told me that, when he was trying to save money to come here, his mother asked him why he was doing it, and he told her he wanted to make something of himself. And she asked him, genuinely puzzled, “Why?” Good for him. > [@](#): > > My dad has been gone for 30 years now and I still remember him telling me that. I remember where we were, the lighting, where we were sitting, everything. > > So no, you cannot sell me on the idea that generational poverty is some sort of quicksand that cannot be escaped. No, not that it cannot be escaped, you fucking imbecile. It is hard to escape, and not everyone makes it. Your father was probably quite exceptional. Rights aren’t just for the exceptional and lucky. > [@](#): > > You knew how to read? You had a public library where you were? Yes. But part of ignorance is not knowing the right questions to ask. > [@](#): > > I do not agree. Of course not. You’re a dishonest person and relish the idea of your “enemies” suffering because they are less fortunate. Also, I notice you left out the section where I asked about the Dems doing the same sort of thing to exclude GOP voters. Why is that? ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2016, 9:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/8654 "2016-03-08T21:13:12Z")
> [@Lochdale](#): > > I was just back in Ireland. Had to have ID to vote yet we didn’t have pictures on our drivers licenses until a couple of years ago. > > ID for voting is a very reasonable thing, histrionics aside. Okay, now what if someone decides that using a single ID is “too easy” and if you vote is too easy you won’t hold at a satisfactory level of “esteem”, so now you need _two_ pieces of ID to vote. Some of the Irish population might have trouble with this, I assume the majority will not. Then later, someone decides that new level is _still_ too easy and you’re not esteeming your vote enough - everyone now needs _three_ pieces of ID. By Bricker’s “esteem” standard, there is literally no practical limit to how much “esteem” someone can demand you show until they are satisfied that you esteem your vote enough. Requiring more IDs is a solution to a nonexistent, or at least undefinable problem. Are you okay with having to satisfy someone else’s imaginary problem until they reach some imaginary benchmark? Are you okay that some of your fellow citizens cannot reach this level of satisfaction and will lose their votes? Now imagine instead of making sure votes are sufficiently esteemed, requirements are being added to prevent voter fraud, a problem which is virtually nonexistent and for all practical purposes imaginary. Are you still okay with that? I’m personally not okay with feeding the delusions of others because there’s no end to it, and in this particular case, it’s only a delusion for people who believe the lie that this _isn’t_ about biasing elections. For what it’s worth, I don’t think Bricker is delusional; I think he is one of the liars. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2016, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/8655 "2016-03-08T21:18:39Z")
> [@Lobohan](#): > > So your father accomplished what I did. That doesn’t mean you have any idea of what its like to grow up in generational poverty. Then perhaps there is a term of art that I don’t understand. I grew up poor. My father grew up poor, and his mother, a single parent, grew up poor, as did the preceding generations. In what specific way is that not “generational poverty?” > [@](#): > > He was lucky. And you should be thankful that he had the confluence of knowledge, intelligence, and lack of risk-aversion that got you the situation that made your successes possible. The cry of the liberal. “He was lucky.” No one has anything on merit; it’s all luck. > [@](#): > > No, not that it cannot be escaped, you fucking imbecile. It is hard to escape, and not everyone makes it. Your father was probably quite exceptional. Rights aren’t just for the exceptional and lucky. And no one’s rights are being taken away, because I don’t agree that there is a right to super-easy, no difficulty-at-all, voting. > [@](#): > > Also, I notice you left out the section where I asked about the Dems doing the same sort of thing to exclude GOP voters. Why is that? I answered a manifestly similar question just moments ago in this thread, in post 8648. You may apply that answer to your question And I see why the public library was of little benefit to you now. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2016, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/8656 "2016-03-08T21:33:43Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > The cry of the liberal. “He was lucky.” No one has anything on merit; it’s all luck. Why do you quote two sentences and only address the first? Laziness? Attention-deficit disorder? Were you breathing too hard after addressing the first sentence and had to sit down? Check with your doctor. ---
**Author:** ![Gedd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gedd/32/4938_2.png) [@Gedd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gedd)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2016, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/8657 "2016-03-08T21:37:31Z")
I don’t drive so I haven’t gotten a new ID since moving states. (The old one works for proving my age) Why should paying money (for a new state ID, which is required) be a step in voting? ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2016, 9:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/8658 "2016-03-08T21:39:27Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > Why do you quote two sentences and only address the first? Laziness? Attention-deficit disorder? Were you breathing too hard after addressing the first sentence and had to sit down? Check with your doctor. I addressed both. The substance of the first sentence is that my father was lucky. The substance of the second is that I was lucky. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2016, 9:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/8659 "2016-03-08T21:43:07Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Then perhaps there is a term of art that I don’t understand. I grew up poor. My father grew up poor, and his mother, a single parent, grew up poor, as did the preceding generations. In what specific way is that not “generational poverty?” Because, stupid, you were brought up by a person who didn’t have the ignorance and lack of options that someone in generational poverty has. Your father broke the cycle. > [@](#): > > The cry of the liberal. “He was lucky.” No one has anything on merit; it’s all luck. Can you read? I said: > [@](#): > > He was lucky. And you should be thankful that he had the confluence of knowledge, intelligence, and lack of risk-aversion that got you the situation that made your successes possible. and you said: > [@](#): > > The cry of the liberal. “He was lucky.” No one has anything on merit; it’s all luck. So, would you say that knowledge, intelligence, and lack of rick-aversion doesn’t count as merit? Jesus you’re goofy. > [@](#): > > And no one’s rights are being taken away, because I don’t agree that there is a right to super-easy, no difficulty-at-all, voting. Neither do I. I do think that you don’t appreciate how easy it actually is. > [@](#): > > I answered a manifestly similar question just moments ago in this thread, in post 8648. You may apply that answer to your question Three flights is hardly difficult, in fact, it’s far easier than getting an ID. > [@](#): > > And I see why the public library was of little benefit to you now. I spent a lot of time in the library. Mostly because I couldn’t afford books of my own. #sad ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2016, 9:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/8660 "2016-03-08T21:49:23Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > I addressed both. > > The substance of the first sentence is that my father was lucky. Your father wasn’t that lucky. He had a shitty sociopath for a kid. > [@](#): > > The substance of the second is that I was lucky. You are lucky. You’d been brought up in a dirt floor barrio in San Salvador if your father hadn’t done what 99% of the people around him didn’t. Doesn’t that strike you as lucky? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943.md?page=432) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943.md?page=434)