# I Pit the ID-demanding GOP vote-suppressors (Part 1) **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [June 12, 2012, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943 "2012-06-12T19:15:52Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 449
**Author:** ![Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/try2b_comprehensive/32/65_2.png) [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Try2B_Comprehensive)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2016, 1:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/8961 "2016-03-28T01:28:57Z")
You liberals don’t get it. Bricker pointed out that he never missed an election in his life. The answer to why the poor and minorities aren’t voting can be found in cataloging the shortfalls in their moral characters compared to Bricker’s. I mean, we already know liberals are takers. I’d go so far as to say that is literally by definition. I’m sure one could think of other common character flaws of liberals, put it all together and then grasp how their troubles with voting are really their fault. ---
**Author:** ![Buck\_Godot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/buck_godot/32/6573_2.png) [@Buck\_Godot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buck_Godot)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2016, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/8962 "2016-03-28T14:47:09Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > I suppose the two counties have roughly equal populations and budgets? > > I’m sure you wouldn’t post this otherwise. Right? Interestingly that when I proposed a similar scenario involving closing rural polling places for budgetary reasons similarly involving an approximately 4 hour ordeal for certain voters you gave the following response. > [@Bricker](#): > > To remind you of the process I said I used, this time with emphasis: > > Applying that same process to what you describe, I’d find a 200 mile journey for every election to be so difficult as to be unduly burdensome, and I’d oppose it. > > Of course, I am also confident that courts hearing the inevitable challenges would agree. > > If they did not, I’d accept that my view of “too difficult” was outside the norm. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2016, 10:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/8963 "2016-03-30T10:57:35Z")
[Election fraud in Arizona confirmed by Attorney General](http://usuncut.com/politics/arizona-election-fraud-primary/) > [@](#): > > Arizona’s Secretary of State has confirmed that election fraud took place in the Arizona primary on March 22. > > During yesterday’s testimony at the Arizona state capitol in Phoenix, Secretary of State Michele Reagan was asked what her office was doing to investigate the claims that registration for thousands of voters had been changed from Democrat or Republican to independent. As US Uncut previously reported, thousands of voters were given provisional ballots, which aren’t actually counted, due to their party registration mysteriously showing up in the system as “independent” or “no party declared.” > > Reagan answered “yes” when asked if she knew for certain voter registration had been changed prior to the primary election, then followed up by saying: > > “This was something that I know happens, and I know it happened to people in this room. It’s not hearsay. It happened to someone in my own office. One of my employees was registered as a particular party, went to go vote, and I don’t want to divulge his personal details, but it happened to him.” If only the real problem of election fraud was taken as seriously as the fake problem of voter fraud. ---
**Author:** ![dba\_Fred](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c37758/32.png) [@dba\_Fred](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dba_Fred)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2016, 3:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/8964 "2016-03-30T15:25:01Z")
> [@BigAppleBucky](#): > > [Well, look at this:](http://reverbpress.com/politics/meet-the-tea-party-republican-behind-arizonas-colossal-voting-clusterfk/) > > Ratios varied widely. Very, very widely within Maricopa County. > > Gee, and it’s a county-wide function so funding wouldn’t vary within the county, would it? I can’t look at [this:](http://reverbpress.com/politics/meet-the-tea-party-republican-behind-arizonas-colossal-voting-clusterfk/) (the video) because when I try, I get “This video has been removed by user.” What’d it say and why do you suppose the user removed it? That [link:](http://reverbpress.com/politics/meet-the-tea-party-republican-behind-arizonas-colossal-voting-clusterfk/) notes: _As Karen [Osborne] (elections director) indicated a lot of these people who voted a provisional ballot were people who were not eligible for that election. Maybe we need to make it clearer somehow that when they go to MVD or Service Arizona they realize what they’re doing when putting their party or not putting their party. Because if you don’t put anything it automatically puts ‘party not designated’ which is the same as Independent._ and states: _So many voters who had changed their information via the AZ MVD had changed their party affiliation status without realizing it and were automatically registered as Independents. Many others were completely unaware Arizona had changed its elections laws that wouldn’t allow Independents to vote in the primary election, which was another huge oversight. Purcell also blamed them for the holdups at polls, because they too waited in line and took up election officials time._ ``` I can see that the occurring with people who were registering to vote for the first time, or for the first time in Arizona/Maricopa County. I can’t say that it would account for all of the people who voted ended up provisionally; I suspect some people didn’t register for a party and some Independents just wanted to vote and weren’t aware they had to be registered with a particular party to vote in that party’s preference election. (personal anecdote: I’d been bugging the manager of the coffee shop I go to to register to vote. One nite she proudly announces she’d registered when she had get her drivers license renewed. I asked which party, she told me she didn’t know, she’s just checked the box on the form to be registered. So she’s an example of somebody not affiliated with a party who wasn’t eligible to vote in this election.) ``` And that quote about _… one polling place for every 108K residents, many of them Latinos._ **Residents**? Not **eligible voters** but _residents_? And nothing about being **registered voters** _with_ a party registration. ---
**Author:** ![dba\_Fred](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c37758/32.png) [@dba\_Fred](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dba_Fred)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2016, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/8965 "2016-03-30T15:40:51Z")
Here’s a map showing the locations of the 60 polling locations in Maricopa County. The pop-up when you put the cursor over an area shows Voting Age Population _ **NOT** _ Registered Voters. The article states: _Both rich and poor areas in Maricopa County were left underserved by the lack of polling sites for Tuesday’s presidential preference election, but polling places were particularly sparse inpoorer areas of west Phoenix, Glendale and the southwest Valley, according to an analysis byThe Arizona Republic._ Do those areas have a lower percentage of registered voters? If the population is under-aged/non-eligible/non-registered voters, it would make sense to have fewer polling locations The article also states: _O’Neil said he doesn’t believe officials intentionally suppressed the vote. In a primary, preventing voters from casting ballots doesn’t help Republicans over Democrats like it would in a general election._ ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2016, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/8966 "2016-03-30T15:48:45Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > [Election fraud in Arizona confirmed by Attorney General](http://usuncut.com/politics/arizona-election-fraud-primary/)If only the real problem of election fraud was taken as seriously as the fake problem of voter fraud. She did not confirm fraud. She confirmed changes. Do you understand what else, besides a change, is required for “fraud” to have occurred? ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2016, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/8967 "2016-03-30T15:53:32Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Do you understand what else, besides a change, is required for “fraud” to have occurred? It has to be reported on Fox News? ---
**Author:** ![dba\_Fred](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c37758/32.png) [@dba\_Fred](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dba_Fred)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2016, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/8968 "2016-03-30T15:59:54Z")
I’m working on getting good, **citable** links to the ballots cast. Thus far: Republicans Voter Turnout (620,163 ballots cast/1,128,603 registered voters) 54% of registered Republicans [http://apps.azsos.gov/election/2016/PPE/Results/PPE2016Results.htm](http://apps.azsos.gov/election/2016/PPE/Results/PPE2016Results.htm) Democrats Voter Turnout (462,829 ballots cast/948,983 registered voters) 49% of registered Democrats [http://apps.azsos.gov/election/2016/PPE/Results/PPE2016Results.htm](http://apps.azsos.gov/election/2016/PPE/Results/PPE2016Results.htm) By category: Vote by Mail (533,760 roughly), Early Vote (? roughly), Vote at Polling Location (103,345 roughly [tho roughly 23,769 were provisional]). 620163 Republican votes + 462829 Democrat votes = 1082992 votes cast 1128603 registered Republicans + 948983 registered Democrats = 2077586 eligible voters ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2016, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/8969 "2016-03-30T16:02:51Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > It has to be reported on Fox News? No. Being on Fox has no relevance to this question. ---
**Author:** ![dba\_Fred](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c37758/32.png) [@dba\_Fred](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dba_Fred)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2016, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/8970 "2016-03-30T16:07:55Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > [Election fraud in Arizona confirmed by Attorney General](http://usuncut.com/politics/arizona-election-fraud-primary/)If only the real problem of election fraud was taken as seriously as the fake problem of voter fraud. She’s a Republican; you’ve never believed one of them before, have you? ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2016, 4:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/8971 "2016-03-30T16:36:28Z")
Oh look, dba Fred is back, but like a bitch, is trying to pretend he wasn’t embarrassingly wrong. ---
**Author:** ![MaxTheVool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9fc29f/32.png) [@MaxTheVool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MaxTheVool)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2016, 4:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/8972 "2016-03-30T16:56:19Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > It has to be reported on Fox News? I have to agree with Bricker on this one. What was confirmed was that something was screwed up. That could be due to fraud (although it’s a little hard to see precisely who benefits by committing large scale extremely obvious and non-secret fraud during a PRIMARY election), or it could be due to incompetence or error or what have you. “Fraud” definitely implies nefarious intent to deceive, which I don’t think we have any evidence for at this point. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2016, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/8973 "2016-03-30T17:47:57Z")
Do we have any reliable info on who the “Establishment” Republicans in Arizona favor? Dump the Trump and Cruzin’ for a bruising? Like I asked before, do they have any way to know how the early ballots add up, any reason to prevent in-person voters from upsetting that? Because, absent that, its hard for me to see what nefarious purpose they might have, here. Absent extraordinary evidence, I’m inclined to put this one down to just plain dumb. May well have an upside, too. If there is pressure to see that polling places are more equably arranged in a transparent fashion, could be a very good thing. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2016, 12:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/8974 "2016-04-01T12:54:12Z")
Even Bruce Tinsley is willing to admit it, although it \*is _April Fool’s Day. [Today’s “Mallard Fillmore” strip](http://mallardfillmore.com/) has the intrepid conservative duck saying "In other news, fewer people are voting for Democrats in states with new, stricter Voter ID laws!_ Imagine that… \*_Brennan Center for Justice_" Yes, I know, he’s implying that many Democratic voters are ineligible, although he’s certainly as aware as \*\*Bricker \*\*that that is simply not true. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2016, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/8975 "2016-04-01T17:00:32Z")
This is an interesting development: > [@](#): > > A GOP congressman is railing against Congress for not backing a bill to fight voter suppression > Republican Rep. Jim Sensenbrenner of Wisconsin published an op-ed Thursday in the New York Times criticizing his fellow lawmakers for failing to restore the Voting Rights Act after the Supreme Court gutted it in 2013. > > “Ensuring that every eligible voter can cast a ballot without fear, deterrence and prejudice is a basic American right,” Sensenbrenner wrote. “I would rather lose my job than suppress votes to keep it.” > Sensenbrenner pointed to the bipartisan bill he introduced more than a year ago to restore some of the protections that had been knocked down as a result of the Supreme Court decision, Shelby County v. Holder. The Supreme Court then invalidated the formula determining which states and localities were subject to a process known as pre-clearance, in which changes to voting regulations had to be approved by federal officials. > **[A GOP congressman is railing against Congress for not backing a bill to fight...](https://www.businessinsider.com/a-gop-rep-railed-against-congress-for-not-fighting-voter-suppression-2016-3)** > > "I would rather lose my job than suppress votes to keep it," Jim Sensenbrenner of Wisconsin wrote in a New York Times op-ed Thursday. The original op-ed: > [@](#): > > Suppress Votes? I’d Rather Lose My Job > By JIM SENSENBRENNER MARCH 31, 2016 [http://www.nytimes.com/2016/03/31/opinion/suppress-votes-id-rather-lose-my-job.html?\_r=1](http://www.nytimes.com/2016/03/31/opinion/suppress-votes-id-rather-lose-my-job.html?_r=1) ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2016, 5:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/8976 "2016-04-01T17:33:52Z")
Heartily approve, applaud and endorse. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2016, 11:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/8977 "2016-04-01T23:09:10Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > Even Bruce Tinsley is willing to admit it, although it \*is _April Fool’s Day. [Today’s “Mallard Fillmore” strip](http://mallardfillmore.com/) has the intrepid conservative duck saying "In other news, fewer people are voting for Democrats in states with new, stricter Voter ID laws!_ Imagine that… \*_Brennan Center for Justice_" > > Yes, I know, he’s implying that many Democratic voters are ineligible, although he’s certainly as aware as \*\*Bricker \*\*that that is simply not true. Tinsley aware of anything? Extremely unlikely. This is the clown who is unable to come up with Trump jokes. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2016, 2:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/8978 "2016-04-02T14:22:22Z")
[Ari Berman’s analysis](http://www.thenation.com/article/wisconsins-voter-id-law-could-block-300000-registered-voters-from-the-polls/) of Wisconsin alone may have overstated numbers, but they’re a lot more than zero. > [@](#): > > The lead plaintiff who challenged the voter-ID law, 89-year-old Ruthelle Frank, has been voting since 1948 and has served on the Village Board in her hometown of Brokaw since 1996, but cannot get a photo ID for voting because her maiden name is misspelled on her birth certificate, which would cost $200 to correct. “No one should have to pay a fee to be able to vote,” Frank said. > > Others blocked from the polls include a man born in a concentration camp in Germany who lost his birth certificate in a fire; a woman who lost use of her hands but could not use her daughter as power of attorney at the DMV; and a 90-year-old veteran of Iwo Jima who could not vote with his veterans ID. > … > > There is a clear racial disparity in terms of who is most impacted by the law. In 2012, African-American voters in Wisconsin were 1.7 times as likely as white voters to lack a driver’s license or state photo ID, and Latino voters were 2.6 times as likely as white voters to lack such ID. More than 60 percent of people who’ve requested a photo ID for voting from the DMV have been black or Hispanic, according to legal filings. > > The law also targets students. Student IDs from most public and private universities and colleges are not accepted because they don’t contain signatures or a two-year expiration date (compared to a ten-year expiration for driver’s licenses). “The standard student ID at only three of the University of Wisconsin’s 13 four-year schools and at seven of the state’s 23 private colleges can be used as a voter photo ID,” according to Common Cause Wisconsin. Numerous other examples of people getting herded into the bureaucratic maze, with no way out. ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2016, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/8979 "2016-04-02T15:51:35Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > No. Being on Fox has no relevance to this question. Like **Smapti** you have a non-human like doggedness on certain issues that might lead us to suspect you’re a replicant. So … _Pro-tip for **Bricker** _: If your human-emotion emulation module is smart enough to deduce you’re responding to a joke, acknowledge it with a smiley-face icon. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2016, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/8980 "2016-04-02T16:06:48Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > Like **Smapti** you have a non-human like doggedness on certain issues that might lead us to suspect you’re a replicant. Nah, just someone with a reflexive but inadequate defense mechanism. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943.md?page=448) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943.md?page=450)