# I Pit the ID-demanding GOP vote-suppressors (Part 1) **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [June 12, 2012, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943 "2012-06-12T19:15:52Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 550
**Author:** ![Eonwe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eonwe/32/240_2.png) [@Eonwe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eonwe)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2018, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/10981 "2018-10-17T15:40:45Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > I saw that story yesterday. I don’t understand how the Director of a Senior Center has the authority to tell anyone to get off of a bus. They don’t, but that’s why all this stuff that’s maybe ‘legal’ is still obviously awful and subverts Democracy. People tend to respect and obey authority. Someone asserts authority, and folks will fall in line. Want a group of old people who already have given up degrees of autonomy to various senior home employees, doctors, their younger family members etc, to get off a bus? Just be an “in charge” person who asks them to get off the bus because someone higher up says they’re not supposed to be on it. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Tooth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c67d28/32.png) [@The\_Tooth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tooth)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2018, 3:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/10982 "2018-10-17T15:42:22Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > I don’t see a contradiction here. Just because he hasn’t posted it, doesn’t mean he hasn’t had a “response”. I suppose running away is a response, yes. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2018, 4:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/10983 "2018-10-17T16:38:52Z")
> [@The\_Tooth](#): > > I suppose running away is a response, yes. I was thinking that the “response” was more of a masturbating to the printed out copies of your posts describing dead and dying children. Not something that we really need to see posted. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2018, 9:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/10984 "2018-10-17T21:03:50Z")
> [@The\_Tooth](#): > > No, he doesn’t do that. I had to remind him of my question regarding which children, precisely, should be allowed to die in order to maintain a level of ideological purity he finds acceptable when it comes to health insurance. I even gave him a choice of two. Instead of answering, he ran away. Twice. That certainly SOUNDS like a fair question. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Tooth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c67d28/32.png) [@The\_Tooth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tooth)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2018, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/10985 "2018-10-28T20:07:16Z")
It is. You should just admit you want other people to die for the sake of your ideological piece of mind. If you don’t care which of my family members dies so long as you aren’t ideologically sad, just say so. I won’t think less of you. I don’t think I can. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2018, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/10986 "2018-10-28T20:27:26Z")
> [@The\_Tooth](#): > > It is. You should just admit you want other people to die for the sake of your ideological piece of mind. If you don’t care which of my family members dies so long as you aren’t ideologically sad, just say so. I won’t think less of you. > > I don’t think I can. But that’s not it. He doesn’t want people to die for the sake of his ideological piece of mind. He just doesn’t give a shit that people will die for the sake of his ideological piece of mind. That’s not a defense, as IMHO, apathy is worse than evil. ---
**Author:** ![Lance\_Turbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lance_turbo/32/6156_2.png) [@Lance\_Turbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lance_Turbo)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2018, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/10987 "2018-10-28T23:16:29Z")
[PEACE of mind](https://www.thefreedictionary.com/peace+of+mind) ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2018, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/10988 "2018-10-29T00:07:26Z")
No, he’s right. An ideologue uses only a piece of mind, not the whole thing. ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2018, 1:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/10989 "2018-11-07T01:17:49Z")
[GOP cheaters pull out all the stops to suppress black vote in Georgia.](https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/broken-machines-rejected-ballots-and-long-lines-voting-problems-emerge-as-americans-go-to-the-polls/2018/11/06/ffd11e52-dfa8-11e8-b3f0-62607289efee_story.html) **Brickhead** must be so very very proud of his Republican cheaters today. In his stupid opinion this is Democracy at its Finest. ---
**Author:** ![Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/budget_player_cadet/32/205_2.png) [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Budget_Player_Cadet)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2018, 6:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/10990 "2018-11-07T06:42:12Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > [GOP cheaters pull out all the stops to suppress black vote in Georgia.](https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/broken-machines-rejected-ballots-and-long-lines-voting-problems-emerge-as-americans-go-to-the-polls/2018/11/06/ffd11e52-dfa8-11e8-b3f0-62607289efee_story.html) > > **Brickhead** must be so very very proud of his Republican cheaters today. In his stupid opinion this is Democracy at its Finest. As said: cryptofascist. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2018, 7:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/10991 "2018-11-08T19:48:27Z")
> [@The\_Tooth](#): > > It is. You should just admit you want other people to die for the sake of your ideological piece of mind. If you don’t care which of my family members dies so long as you aren’t ideologically sad, just say so. I won’t think less of you. > > I don’t think I can. The question isn’t fair because it uses the fallacy of _argumentum ad passiones_, an appeal to emotion, to advance your purpose. Any safety standard, for example, carries with it a calculation of acceptable risk. We balance costs against safety in car design and food inspection. But if a rhetor eager for the adoption of stricter food inspection standards demanded to know the names of the people that were acceptable candidates for botulism or salmonella, we should rightly disregard the tactic: food inspection is important, but it must be balanced against costs that might make food unaffordable. Did you not know this? ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2018, 8:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/10992 "2018-11-08T20:30:19Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > The question isn’t fair because it uses the fallacy of _argumentum ad passiones_, an appeal to emotion, to advance your purpose. Any safety standard, for example, carries with it a calculation of acceptable risk. We balance costs against safety in car design and food inspection. But if a rhetor eager for the adoption of stricter food inspection standards demanded to know the names of the people that were acceptable candidates for botulism or salmonella, we should rightly disregard the tactic: food inspection is important, but it must be balanced against costs that might make food unaffordable. > > Did you not know this? Ah, practicality. So, does the fact that we do pay taxes in order to have a safe food supply bother you, then, it does increase the cost, and therefore, make it unaffordable to some. And what about the situation where inspection would actually lower the cost of food, as it does with UHC in every single country on the plane that has it? If not inspecting food increases spoilage, makes it less safe and more costly, then you are right, emotional arguments should not be necessary to convince rational people of the rightness of food inspection. Unfortunately, many are not rational, and would refuse food inspection even though it actually could make even their own life better, (“why should I have to pay for other people to have safe food?”) so an appeal to emotion is what is necessary there. Then there are those who are stubborn, and will hold to a position even after it has been shown to be irrational, and even after it has been shown to be cruel and inhumane. We call them republicans. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2018, 8:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/10993 "2018-11-08T20:45:18Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > Ah, practicality. So, does the fact that we do pay taxes in order to have a safe food supply bother you, then, it does increase the cost, and therefore, make it unaffordable to some. > > And what about the situation where inspection would actually lower the cost of food, as it does with UHC in every single country on the plane that has it? If not inspecting food increases spoilage, makes it less safe and more costly, then you are right, emotional arguments should not be necessary to convince rational people of the rightness of food inspection. Unfortunately, many are not rational, and would refuse food inspection even though it actually could make even their own life better, (“why should I have to pay for other people to have safe food?”) so an appeal to emotion is what is necessary there. > > Then there are those who are stubborn, and will hold to a position even after it has been shown to be irrational, and even after it has been shown to be cruel and inhumane. > > We call them republicans. Not at all. Democrats adhere to essentially the most cruel and inhumane practice imaginable, the slaughter of unborn children in the womb. But they don’t let me decide that for them! They insist on defining “cruel and inhumane” themselves, and their definition is what they use. But you feel that I should be forced to accept your definition in this argument, eh? I decline your implicit, but no doubt kind, invitation. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2018, 8:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/10994 "2018-11-08T20:57:35Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Not at all. Democrats adhere to essentially the most cruel and inhumane practice imaginable, the slaughter of unborn children in the womb. We disagree that that is cruel and inhumane. Maybe you could convince me to change my mind that ending the existence of a clump of cells that has no nervous system is cruel and inhumane. But it shouldn’t be that hard to convince you that a fully formed human, child or adult dying of preventable or treatable conditions due to simply not being able to afford it should be. I really don’t see how anyone can come to a different conclusion, but well, there you are. > [@](#): > > But they don’t let me decide that for them! They insist on defining “cruel and inhumane” themselves, and their definition is what they use. No, we don’t let you interfere in medical decisions between a woman and her doctor. You want to prevent people from seeing a doctor. That’s the difference. > [@](#): > > But you feel that I should be forced to accept your definition in this argument, eh? No, just putting it out there. You are welcome to watch people suffering and dying in ways that are preventable and be part of what prevents them from getting treatment, and hold the opinion that what you are doing is not inhumane, just as we disagree when we see a woman removing a clump of cells from her body as to whether that is inhumane. > [@](#): > > I decline your implicit, but no doubt kind, invitation. It wasn’t an invitation. It was an insult. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Tooth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c67d28/32.png) [@The\_Tooth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tooth)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2018, 11:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/10995 "2018-11-08T23:47:37Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > The question isn’t fair because it uses the fallacy of _argumentum ad passiones_, an appeal to emotion, to advance your purpose. Any safety standard, for example, carries with it a calculation of acceptable risk. We balance costs against safety in car design and food inspection. But if a rhetor eager for the adoption of stricter food inspection standards demanded to know the names of the people that were acceptable candidates for botulism or salmonella, we should rightly disregard the tactic: food inspection is important, but it must be balanced against costs that might make food unaffordable. > > Did you not know this? But I’m not trying to convince you of anything; I’m not making an argument. Your position is ideological and not practical, so all I could do to change your mind is unRepublican you and that would be a waste of time. As the saying goes, all it does is annoy the pig. I was, however, making a point. I was trying to get you to admit straight up that you would be fine with reducing the amount of health care available to children for ideological reasons despite claiming to be pro-life, but I wasn’t trying to change your mind. Not everything is a debate, y’know. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Tooth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c67d28/32.png) [@The\_Tooth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tooth)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2018, 11:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/10996 "2018-11-08T23:52:42Z")
I mean, this thread isn’t called " I _Debate_ the ID-demanding GOP vote-suppressors" is it? ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2018, 12:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/10997 "2018-11-09T00:28:26Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Not at all. Democrats adhere to essentially the most cruel and inhumane practice imaginable, the slaughter of unborn children in the womb. > > But they don’t let me decide that for them! They insist on defining “cruel and inhumane” themselves, and their definition is what they use. No, we insist on defining “children” or “persons” for ourselves. “Slaughter”, too, speaking of deploring emotional arguments, which you were just doing. > [@](#): > > But you feel that I should be forced to accept your definition in this argument, eh? You feel we should accept yours, eh? Unfortunately, most of Americans have voted against yours, therefore it is illegal, and by your definition, immoral, and to claim otherwise is to undermine democracy itself. IOW, fuck you and your pathetic hypocrisies that fool no one but yourself. > [@](#): > > I decline your implicit, but no doubt kind, invitation. You don’t even know how to cut the shit, do you? ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2018, 4:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/10998 "2018-11-09T04:40:41Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Not at all. Democrats adhere to essentially the most cruel and inhumane practice imaginable, the slaughter of unborn children in the womb. Just figured I would pick a nit and mention that we don’t adhere to the practice of abortion, but rather oppose the idea that government’s realm is to decide for a female whether she should be forced to allow another being to use her own body for its survival. We also acknowledge that there are complex moral issues involved that cannot be easily dismissed out of hand. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2018, 7:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/10999 "2018-11-09T07:46:16Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > Just figured I would pick a nit and mention that we don’t adhere to the practice of abortion, but rather oppose the idea that government’s realm is to decide for a female whether she should be forced to allow another being to use her own body for its survival. We also acknowledge that there are complex moral issues involved that cannot be easily dismissed out of hand. After which, you dismiss them out of hand. ---
**Author:** ![Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/budget_player_cadet/32/205_2.png) [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Budget_Player_Cadet)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2018, 7:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/11000 "2018-11-09T07:49:48Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > After which, you dismiss them out of hand. Nah. Some of us have gone through the moral and legal calculus and came out the other side with an answer that isn’t yours. Also, defending the fact that you oppose universal health care with “WELL I’M PRO-LIFE” might be the most absurd and stupid non-sequitur I’ve heard in a long fucking time, congratulations. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943.md?page=549) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943.md?page=551)