# I Pit the ID-demanding GOP vote-suppressors (Part 1) **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [June 12, 2012, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943 "2012-06-12T19:15:52Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2012, 2:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/121 "2012-06-13T14:00:27Z")
> [@Ludovic](#): > > Similarly, if newer, more restrictive laws will not disenfranchise more Democratic voters than Republican, why is one side so gung ho about it? Because, confidence. You thought the confidence fairy only did markets? ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2012, 2:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/122 "2012-06-13T14:20:54Z")
> [@Ludovic](#): > > Similarly, if newer, more restrictive laws will not disenfranchise more Democratic voters than Republican, why is one side so gung ho about it? If the new laws won’t stop illegal aliens and convicted felons from casting their reliably Democratic votes, why is one side so gung ho to stop those laws? ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2012, 2:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/123 "2012-06-13T14:24:04Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > A [scientific study](http://www.bradblog.com/Docs/EAC_VoterFraud_DraftReport.pdf) which [the W Admin](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=418643) [tried hard to suppress](http://www.ucsusa.org/scientific_integrity/abuses_of_science/election-panel-delays-edits.html) not too long ago. This was the same Admin that spent two terms hunting for voter fraud, [fired USAGs who wouldn’t play along,](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dismissal_of_U.S._attorneys_controversy) and at the end still couldn’t come up with a dozen cases nationwide. What aspects of that make it a “scientific study?” ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2012, 2:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/124 "2012-06-13T14:25:24Z")
> [@DrumBum](#): > > This may be a bit off topic but would a compulsory voting law have any impact on the issue of alleged voter fraud ? It would compound the problem – we would have a wave of people who just got the standard “Vote next eday or else” notice in the mail, protesting, “Hey, WTF, this doesn’t apply to me, I’m a noncitizen/convicted felon/etc.” The only complete solution would be a national database which keeps track of the vital records, citizenship status, vital status, and current address of every person in the country. Which is not technically impossible, but it would require that you have to give notice to the authorities every time you change your address, and it would be at least a misdemeanor to fail to do so, or to reside at any unregistered address. Which is the case in some countries, but Americans would have a hard time getting it down. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2012, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/125 "2012-06-13T14:28:12Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > By the way, has anyone come up with a plausible reason for prohibiting Sunday voting? Which had been available, popular amongst black voters, but is now illegal? Surely one of you guys must have some sort of rationale, however tenuous? Not even for its effect on the confidence of the electorate? Is it tough love? Voting is work. God doesn’t like us to work on Sunday. Or was that Saturday? Or Friday? This can be very confusing, so maybe we should stop early voting on all 3 days, just to cover our bases. ---
**Author:** ![gravitycrash](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/977dab/32.png) [@gravitycrash](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gravitycrash)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2012, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/126 "2012-06-13T15:06:56Z")
> [@Loach](#): > > This is the most infuriating subject I can think of. I have no idea what kind of utopia you all live in but to say that voter fraud does not exist or isn’t a problem is ridiculous. I grew up hearing stories of Boss Frank Hague running the state from his throne in Jersey City. The election night mantra was “Hudson County has not been heard from” as he held back the results to wait to see how many corpses needed to get to the polls to sway the statewide or national elections. Things have improved slightly since. I welcome anything that cuts down on the fraud and corruption that is absolutely happening every fucking election. I mentioned it jokingly earlier but fuck it. Getting an ID is not an onerous task. The only people I run into that don’t currently have an form of ID are illegal immigrants. Even they have ID, but usually from their home country. Its nearly impossible to live in this state without a government ID. It certainly makes things difficult. To say that having to present an ID that nearly 100% of the adults already have is an insurmountable obstacle is so far out of the realm of reality it makes my head spin. Its as if some people want to vilify a simple ID check to promote their own agenda. I hope that they are just misguided and not in favor of voter fraud. Yeah but people who find getting an ID a challenge have been held back by the man their entire life so this is just unfair and probably racist. Actually fuck that, I would think that it would be more of a challenge functioning in modern society without an ID. How do you even qualify for food stamps and other government assistance without proof of who the hell you are anyway? How do you enroll your kid in school? How do you get a checking/debit account? How do you get a library card? I have no idea, which probably makes them smarter than me, in which case getting an ID should be child’s play. Oops there I go picking on the disadvantaged/disenfranchised again. I’m so mean. One good thing about this topic is that if you’re new to this message board and were curious as to the political leanings of some of the members posting in it, the hard core lefties are easy to pick out. They are the ones where personal responsibility is an unknown concept. ---
**Author:** ![Algher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Algher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Algher)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2012, 3:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/127 "2012-06-13T15:18:36Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > How about this: > > 1. You require some form of official voter ID. > > While at the same time: > > 1. You make Election Day a national holiday. > > 2. You allow felons to vote. > > Seems like a decent compromise to me. Careful, there are some around here that get really testy if you imply that felons are a dependable voting bloc for the Democrats. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2012, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/128 "2012-06-13T15:36:29Z")
Out of curiosity, would Americans see it as horribly intrusive and privacy-shattering and oppressive if the identification information they put on their tax returns was passed onto a national election database, thus registering them every year? What if it was optional? ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2012, 3:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/129 "2012-06-13T15:38:43Z")
> [@Algher](#): > > Careful, there are some around here that get really testy if you imply that felons are a dependable voting bloc for the Democrats. On a side note, I’ve never understood why felons lose their right to vote. Are they afraid they’ll all vote to make bank robbery legal or something? ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2012, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/130 "2012-06-13T15:40:23Z")
I agree. You do your time, they clean the slate. Frankly, I don’t see how it’s constitutional. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2012, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/131 "2012-06-13T15:50:53Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > Out of curiosity, would Americans see it as horribly intrusive and privacy-shattering and oppressive if the identification information they put on their tax returns was passed onto a national election database, thus registering them every year? > > What if it was optional? Many people don’t file tax returns. ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2012, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/132 "2012-06-13T15:51:26Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > Yes, but the point is that the specific polling place you’re assigned to is in a location that’s **geographically quite close to your residence**. > > **That** is why it’s easier for many people to get to the polls on Election Day than to get to the DMV for an identity card beforehand. Frankly, I’m quite surprised that anybody needs this spelled out for them. Well, with all those thousands of polling places all around, it’s impossible to keep an eye on all of them to prevent any hanky-panky. Best to consolidate them. Fortunately, some communities that already have gates and guardposts; putting the polls there would enhance security at relatively low cost… ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2012, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/133 "2012-06-13T16:07:06Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Many people don’t file tax returns. Really? Not even simple cursory ones? The poor should be encouraged to do so, I suggest, since even if they have a minimal income there are tax credits and such they could explore. Or at least I assume there are - I’m not familiar with American income-tax forms. Besides, if you link taxation to registration, you can suppress the votes of stereotypical right-wing nuts who think taxation _and_ registration are massively intrusive abuses of an illegitimate government, like being told to fill out census forms and whatnot. Thus, it’ll balance. ---
**Author:** ![EddyTeddyFreddy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eddyteddyfreddy/32/18796_2.png) [@EddyTeddyFreddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EddyTeddyFreddy)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2012, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/134 "2012-06-13T16:11:29Z")
> [@Chefguy](#): > > I’ve always had to show some sort of ID. Usually, it was the voter registration card, which was then checked against the register. I then had to sign the register. This was in Alaska, but are there really places where you can just walk in off the street and not be checked for registration against some sort of ID? Here in exurban Massachusetts, I don’t have to show ID. I just drive to/walk into the local YMCA where they’ve set up the rows of voting machines (one row per ward) in the big gym and give my name and address to one of the nice grayhaired volunteer ladies at the table flanking my ward’s row. She looks me up in one of the big printout books full of registered voters’ names and addresses. She checks me off, we smile, she gives me a ballot, and I move down the row to a vacant machine; ink in my choice of little ovals; and move on, completed ballot in hand, to the table at the other end of the row. There I give my name and address to another nice grayhaired lady; she checks me off in her book; we smile; and I move on to the final station, the ballot-inhaler machine (please insert face-down), usually overseen by a nice grayhaired gentleman. ---
**Author:** ![Farmer\_Jane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Farmer\_Jane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Farmer_Jane)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2012, 4:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/135 "2012-06-13T16:12:48Z")
Well, non citizens also pay taxes. But they can get Drivers Licenses in some states as well. It depends how you want to look at it. I still think a voter ID card with photo is the best way to go. Make them available at all county registering locations. Then if you lose your voter reg card, you show ID. If you can’t do that, well hell, don’t be so damned irresponsible. (: ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2012, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/136 "2012-06-13T16:26:22Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > If the new laws won’t stop illegal aliens and convicted felons from casting their reliably Democratic votes, why is one side so gung ho to stop those laws? I’ll tell you the flat out truth, here, **Bricker**. I was actually surprised to see you spew such low rent Freeper crap. Thought better of you. Well, live and learn. ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2012, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/137 "2012-06-13T16:30:51Z")
> [@EddyTeddyFreddy](#): > > Here in exurban Massachusetts, I don’t have to show ID. I just drive to/walk into the local YMCA where they’ve set up the rows of voting machines (one row per ward) in the big gym and give my name and address to one of the nice grayhaired volunteer ladies at the table flanking my ward’s row. She looks me up in one of the big printout books full of registered voters’ names and addresses. She checks me off, we smile, she gives me a ballot, and I move down the row to a vacant machine; ink in my choice of little ovals; and move on, completed ballot in hand, to the table at the other end of the row. There I give my name and address to another nice grayhaired lady; she checks me off in her book; we smile; and I move on to the final station, the ballot-inhaler machine (please insert face-down), usually overseen by a nice grayhaired gentleman. So they’re actually bouncing who you say you are against some sort of registration. Is there anyplace that doesn’t do that? I’m pretty sure that if you’re not registered, you can’t get a ballot, right? ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2012, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/138 "2012-06-13T16:33:43Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > I’ll tell you the flat out truth, here, **Bricker**. I was actually surprised to see you spew such low rent Freeper crap. Thought better of you. Well, live and learn. Friend Bricker has a veneer of civility, but underneath… well you don’t want to look directly at it. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2012, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/139 "2012-06-13T16:33:55Z")
> [@EddyTeddyFreddy](#): > > Here in exurban Massachusetts, I don’t have to show ID. I just drive to/walk into the local YMCA where they’ve set up the rows of voting machines (one row per ward) in the big gym and give my name and address to one of the nice grayhaired volunteer ladies at the table flanking my ward’s row. She looks me up in one of the big printout books full of registered voters’ names and addresses. She checks me off, we smile, she gives me a ballot, and I move down the row to a vacant machine; ink in my choice of little ovals; and move on, completed ballot in hand, to the table at the other end of the row. There I give my name and address to another nice grayhaired lady; she checks me off in her book; we smile; and I move on to the final station, the ballot-inhaler machine (please insert face-down), usually overseen by a nice grayhaired gentleman. Same here in suburban Massachusetts. Since the name gets ticked off twice, it’d be hard to believe someone voting again at that site. And I’ve never heard of a case where someone came in and voted in someone else’s place. It’s _really_ hard to imagine someone doing this as part of some election-throwing strategy. You’d have to line up hordes of willing scofflaws who can convincingly present themselves as the real voters, right down to giving the correct information to the nice greyhaired people (who often know the people). And if more than one person tried to do this, they’d know something was up. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2012, 4:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943/140 "2012-06-13T16:38:31Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Voting is work. God doesn’t like us to work on Sunday. Or was that Saturday? Or Friday? > > This can be very confusing, so maybe we should stop early voting on all 3 days, just to cover our bases. Looks like that’s as much of an answer as I’m gonna get. Thought at least they’d try, but I reckon they ain’t _that_ stupid. Because there isn’t anything, is there? These people voted on Sunday before, nobody had any problem. Early voting is not that unusual. I don’t know but gotta wonder: did the people who wrote this law offer any explanation? Any rationale at all? Bet that boosts the living heck out of voter confidence of black people, they now have lots of confidence that the Republicans don’t want them to vote. If they didn’t already know. But hey, just ignore it! Maybe it’ll go away, its only black people anyway. Though I’ll probably bring it up again. I can be kind of a dick, that way, sometimes. Often. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-id-demanding-gop-vote-suppressors-part-1/624943.md?page=8)