# I pit the President of the New York Police Benevolent Association **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [November 8, 2015, 12:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-president-of-the-new-york-police-benevolent-association/736971 "2015-11-08T00:10:22Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![nicky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f0a364/32.png) [@nicky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nicky)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2015, 8:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-president-of-the-new-york-police-benevolent-association/736971/41 "2015-11-11T08:19:26Z")
Or: gee Mr Pasco, thanks. I was struggling to think of a name for the vilest character in my next movie… ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2015, 8:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-president-of-the-new-york-police-benevolent-association/736971/42 "2015-11-11T08:52:20Z")
> [@russian\_heel](#): > > I love how both you and **Andros** completely did not react to the first half of my post where I stated I did not support cops intimidating Quentin Tarantino or any other cop protester in any way. > > Obviously, I support cops but want them to act professionally. But, I get not everyone comprehends second level thinking. We understand your first paragraph. You just undermined it in the second paragraph, by calling complaining about police brutality “whining” and claiming that all the protesters are insincere kiss ups. You say you support protesters, but then denigrate them in the very next paragraph. Which one do you think people are going to take more seriously? ---
**Author:** ![andros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@andros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andros)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2015, 3:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-president-of-the-new-york-police-benevolent-association/736971/43 "2015-11-11T15:00:45Z")
> [@russian\_heel](#): > > I love how both you and **Andros** completely did not react to the first half of my post where I stated I did not support cops intimidating Quentin Tarantino or any other cop protester in any way. Trolololol! You stated nothing of the sort. You know people can read your posts, right? ---
**Author:** ![russian\_heel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f05b48/32.png) [@russian\_heel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/russian_heel)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2015, 3:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-president-of-the-new-york-police-benevolent-association/736971/44 "2015-11-12T03:01:34Z")
> [@andros](#): > > Trolololol! > > You stated nothing of the sort. You know people can read your posts, right? Actually, that’s EXACTLY what I said. I get people can read my posts. It’s not my job to make them comprehend what they just read, however. ---
**Author:** ![russian\_heel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f05b48/32.png) [@russian\_heel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/russian_heel)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2015, 3:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-president-of-the-new-york-police-benevolent-association/736971/45 "2015-11-12T03:04:17Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > We understand your first paragraph. You just undermined it in the second paragraph, by calling complaining about police brutality “whining” and claiming that all the protesters are insincere kiss ups. > > You say you support protesters, but then denigrate them in the very next paragraph. Which one do you think people are going to take more seriously? Your putting words in my mouth. I never said I supported the protesters, and yes, I assert in a dangerous situation they would kiss the feet of any cop who bailed them out. What I SAID was I don’t think cops should try to hassle or intimidate protesters or Quentin Tarantino because of their views. ---
**Author:** ![andros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@andros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andros)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2015, 4:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-president-of-the-new-york-police-benevolent-association/736971/46 "2015-11-12T04:28:51Z")
> [@russian\_heel](#): > > Actually, that’s EXACTLY what I said. Let’s go to the tape: > [@russian\_heel](#): > > I 100% percent support cops, but they do themselves no favors when they do things like turn their backs to the Mayor of New York, or stuff like this. No matter what, you have to bite your lip, and do your job by the book. > > At the end of the day, the public will support cops because the same people who whine about the police are the same ones who would be one their knees kissing their feet when they showed up to save them from a dangerous situation. Well golly. Nowhere in there do you say you “[do] not support cops intimidating Quentin Tarantino or any other cop protester in any way.” You say they “do themselves no favors” by doing so, and you say they should do their jobs by the book. But you also say you support them “100%” and you characterize people with legitimate concerns about how they do their work as whiners. If you had meant to say that police intimidation is never justified for any reason, you could easily have said so. Instead, you chose to couch your opinion in inflammatory and well-poisoning language. Perhaps you truly do not support police intimidation…but you make it clear you do not oppose it. ---
**Author:** ![russian\_heel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f05b48/32.png) [@russian\_heel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/russian_heel)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2015, 6:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-president-of-the-new-york-police-benevolent-association/736971/47 "2015-11-13T06:05:24Z")
> [@andros](#): > > Let’s go to the tape: > > Well golly. Nowhere in there do you say you “[do] not support cops intimidating Quentin Tarantino or any other cop protester in any way.” You say they “do themselves no favors” by doing so, and you say they should do their jobs by the book. But you also say you support them “100%” and you characterize people with legitimate concerns about how they do their work as whiners. > > If you had meant to say that police intimidation is never justified for any reason, you could easily have said so. Instead, you chose to couch your opinion in inflammatory and well-poisoning language. Perhaps you truly do not support police intimidation…but you make it clear you do not oppose it. Oh, my GOD with this. Let me diagram this sentence for you then (I cant believe Im wasting my time with this BTW): \*\*I 100% percent support cops, but they do themselves no favors when they do things like turn their backs to the Mayor of New York, _ **or stuff like this** _. No matter what, you have to bite your lip, and do your job by the book. \*\* _ **or stuff like this** _ refers to the ORIGINAL POST which states: _Jim Pasco, the head of the Fraternal Order of Police of New York City, has long been known for his … less than politick comments. But now he may have gone too far. He is promising a “surprise” for Quentin Tarantino between now and the premiere of Tarantino’s new movie._ You are right, I don’t support police intimidation. I don’t get how I couched anything. All Im am doing, like another poster who condescendingly said, was expressing independent non-conflicting opinions on the same topic: I don’t think cops should intimidate protesters, meanwhile anti-cop protesters (BTW, many of whom ARE PROTECTED BY cops during their protests) should consider the good cops do and remember they might need one the next time they are in trouble. Why is this so hard to grasp??? ---
**Author:** ![Peremensoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ce7236/32.png) [@Peremensoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peremensoe)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2015, 6:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-president-of-the-new-york-police-benevolent-association/736971/48 "2015-11-13T06:15:46Z")
> [@russian\_heel](#): > > I don’t support police intimidation. So, not “100% percent support cops” then, after all. I think that’s the crux of the hangup here. ---
**Author:** ![russian\_heel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f05b48/32.png) [@russian\_heel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/russian_heel)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2015, 2:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-president-of-the-new-york-police-benevolent-association/736971/49 "2015-11-13T14:05:05Z")
OK I’ll reduce that to 96.87% if that will get these people off my back. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2015, 2:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-president-of-the-new-york-police-benevolent-association/736971/50 "2015-11-13T14:13:00Z")
I’m not sure “I don’t support them when they do things like this” could have been more clear. ---
**Author:** ![lance\_strongarm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/87869e/32.png) [@lance\_strongarm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lance_strongarm)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2015, 2:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-president-of-the-new-york-police-benevolent-association/736971/51 "2015-11-13T14:33:09Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > I’m not one who is normally for union busting, but this is one I want completely destroyed. Don’t hold the union, and all its members, responsible for what one guy said. ---
**Author:** ![lance\_strongarm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/87869e/32.png) [@lance\_strongarm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lance_strongarm)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2015, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-president-of-the-new-york-police-benevolent-association/736971/52 "2015-11-13T14:35:12Z")
> [@andros](#): > > There’s this new thing, we humans just invented it, it’s called “holding two separate, nonconflicting opinions at the same time.” > > Here’s an example: I support good cops, while \*simultaneously \*opposing bad cops. > > Another: I appreciate having an effective police force, while \*simultaneously \*seeking institutional changes that reduce racial and economic bias in policing. > > One more: I am grateful when police officers help protect me from danger, while \*simultaneously \*decrying the fact that I receive more and better protection from them because I am White and middle-class. > > Not that difficult. No, not that difficult, yet it seems so difficult for so many people. ---
**Author:** ![lance\_strongarm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/87869e/32.png) [@lance\_strongarm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lance_strongarm)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2015, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-president-of-the-new-york-police-benevolent-association/736971/53 "2015-11-13T14:38:27Z")
> [@russian\_heel](#): > > Actually, that’s EXACTLY what I said. > > I get people can read my posts. It’s not my job to make them comprehend what they just read, however. Your second paragraph seems to conflict with your first. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2015, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-president-of-the-new-york-police-benevolent-association/736971/54 "2015-11-13T15:51:32Z")
> [@russian\_heel](#): > > I don’t think cops should intimidate protesters, meanwhile anti-cop protesters (BTW, many of whom ARE PROTECTED BY cops during their protests) should consider the good cops do and remember they might need one the next time they are in trouble. They’re protesting police abuses. They don’t need to be reminded like children that policing in general is a public good. Unless they were protesting in favor of the elimination of police altogether, your condescending reminder serves a straw man argument. ---
**Author:** ![russian\_heel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f05b48/32.png) [@russian\_heel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/russian_heel)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2015, 9:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-president-of-the-new-york-police-benevolent-association/736971/55 "2015-11-14T09:45:38Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > They’re protesting police abuses. They don’t need to be reminded like children that policing in general is a public good. Unless they were protesting in favor of the elimination of police altogether, your condescending reminder serves a straw man argument. OHHHHNOOOZ!!!1111 NOT teh stroll man!!!V:(:(:(☹ You know your winning the debate when someone pulls the straw man or troll cards. ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2015, 10:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-president-of-the-new-york-police-benevolent-association/736971/56 "2015-11-14T10:26:41Z")
> [@russian\_heel](#): > > OHHHHNOOOZ!!!1111 NOT teh stroll man!!!V:(:(:(☹ > > You know your winning the debate when someone pulls the straw man or troll cards. I’d call it the “excluded middle” myself. You’re implying that people who oppose bad police must therefore oppose all police. If that’s not what you’re attempting to imply, please make your view more clear. ---
**Author:** ![VarlosZ](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/d78d45/32.png) [@VarlosZ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VarlosZ)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2015, 11:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-president-of-the-new-york-police-benevolent-association/736971/57 "2015-11-14T11:53:00Z")
Man, orthodoxy is strictly enforced around here; **russian heel** getting piled on because he agreed with everyone else, but not aggressively enough. Pay Lynch, since he was mentioned, is preposterous: a neanderthal with the touchiness of a particularly self-obsessed 12-year old girl. You want to talk about whiners, he rivals [Bill Donahue](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_Donohue) in his ability to be offended by the merest whiff of criticism. (Come to think of it, I don’t think I’ve ever once been satisfied with a statement from the head of a police union. I know it’s their job to advocate for their members’ interests and reputations, but couldn’t they just once take the high road?) ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2015, 3:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-president-of-the-new-york-police-benevolent-association/736971/58 "2015-11-14T15:09:33Z")
> [@russian\_heel](#): > > OHHHHNOOOZ!!!1111 NOT teh stroll man!!!V:(:(:(☹ > > You know your winning the debate when someone pulls the straw man or troll cards. I note you chose to avoid the substantive question: Why do you think that people protesting excessive use of violence and unequal treatment of racial minorities need to be reminded of what you suggest they need to be reminded of? ---
**Author:** ![russian\_heel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f05b48/32.png) [@russian\_heel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/russian_heel)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2015, 2:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-president-of-the-new-york-police-benevolent-association/736971/59 "2015-11-16T02:19:27Z")
I MIGHT answer your less than substantive question. What’s your point? ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2015, 3:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-president-of-the-new-york-police-benevolent-association/736971/60 "2015-11-16T03:02:17Z")
> [@russian\_heel](#): > > I MIGHT answer your less than substantive question. Oh, please, I beg you, grace me with your generous answer, O wise one. > [@](#): > > What’s your point? My point is that they _don’t_ need to be reminded, and no one in this thread does either, and, depending on what your answer is to that question, that you think they do need to be reminded based on some kind of misunderstanding or intentional mischaracterization on your part. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-president-of-the-new-york-police-benevolent-association/736971.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-president-of-the-new-york-police-benevolent-association/736971.md?page=4)