# I pit the SovCit movement... For a different reason **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [February 26, 2023, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-sovcit-movement-for-a-different-reason/980412 "2023-02-26T22:47:24Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2023, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-sovcit-movement-for-a-different-reason/980412/41 "2023-02-27T18:37:19Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > As pointed out by others above, many of these folks start out by sucking at adulting then get in minor trouble with the law or creditors or both. Again disagree. These are people that saw online or were told by a friend, “Hey you don’t have to register your car or pay taxes.” to which they reply, “That’s exactly what I want reality to be.” ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2023, 6:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-sovcit-movement-for-a-different-reason/980412/42 "2023-02-27T18:56:17Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > ??? Sorry, that’s imprecise language on my part. I was responding to people talking about anarchists, but I wasn’t really talking about them myself. Sometimes what I’m thinking doesn’t translate properly in my posts, especially when I’m going over complicated concepts and editing myself multiple times before submitting. Sometimes I will put in a word in a Freudian way or forget to change something. I myself did not **mean** anarchists, I definitely don’t equate the anarchists I see protesting on streets with mountain folk hiding in log cabins and wanting the government to leave them alone. Actually, they seem so far apart from each other they might as well be on opposite sides of a spectrum. Sorry about the mixup there. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2023, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-sovcit-movement-for-a-different-reason/980412/43 "2023-02-27T19:07:29Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > Peasant cosplay is all well and good if that’s your kink, but it’s not actual independence. Way to call out Thoreau there, pal. I might quibble with you on anarchist gatekeeping–there are rightwingers whom I think are both idiots and anarchists–but I definitely agree that the SovCIt folks don’t qualify as anarchists. They’re a bit like the Puritans who fled England not because they wanted religious liberty, but because they wanted a theocratic tyranny that favored their own beliefs. SovCits don’t want liberty, they want a tyranny that backs them up. With kids who argue with me, I often say something like, “What do you expect to happen next?” Like, do they think I’m going to say, “Oh, Frank called your mom bald-headed? Then absolutely it’s okay for you to knock him down, jolly good show, carry on!” or “You were listening to Taylor Swift, and that’s why you didn’t come set the table? Fair enough, let’s make a new rule that Taylor Swift fans don’t have to do chores!” When I ask them what they think is going to happen, they generally realize that they hadn’t thought that far ahead, and then we can move forward with, “Okay, whatever you say next, I want you to think about what will probably happen as a result of your words. I’m going to assume that you’ve thought about that, and chosen your words to get that result.” With SovCits, I want to ask them the same thing. Do they think that they’re going to argue enough with the cops so the cops will say, “Y’know, I guess you really DON’T need a driver’s license if you’re just traveling, good job, carry on!” ---
**Author:** ![Frodo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/frodo/32/302_2.png) [@Frodo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frodo)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2023, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-sovcit-movement-for-a-different-reason/980412/44 "2023-02-27T19:25:53Z")
> [@Cheesesteak](#): > > For all their supposed independence, they’re bigger mooches than anyone. It’s like a guy lecturing me about living free off the land while he’s crashing on my couch, that I bought with my sucker corporate job. I don’t think that follows, obviously the anarchist _wants_ to work, what he doesn’t want is to be exploited, neither him/her self or others. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2023, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-sovcit-movement-for-a-different-reason/980412/45 "2023-02-27T19:26:38Z")
Yes they do, because the lying shitheels that write the books and pamphlets and run the websites say it works for them. ---
**Author:** ![Frodo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/frodo/32/302_2.png) [@Frodo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frodo)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2023, 7:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-sovcit-movement-for-a-different-reason/980412/46 "2023-02-27T19:28:32Z")
Are we talking about anarchists or sovcits? ---
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2023, 7:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-sovcit-movement-for-a-different-reason/980412/47 "2023-02-27T19:39:52Z")
> [@Saint\_Cad](#): > > Again disagree. These are people that saw online or were told by a friend, “Hey you don’t have to register your car or pay taxes.” to which they reply, “That’s exactly what I want reality to be.” It really is a mixed bag. Some are just lazy grifters, some are people who get caught up in legal troubles, and end up victimized even further by people who peddle this crap to them, knowing they’re vulnerable. Some are just regular old crazy. Some get bent out of shape when they see how much they pay in taxes, and go down the rabbit hole trying to save money (See Wesley Snipes, and a disturbing large number of dentists, for some reason). ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2023, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-sovcit-movement-for-a-different-reason/980412/48 "2023-02-27T19:53:52Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > Way to call out Thoreau there, pal. Actually, that specific callout was Tolstoy. > **[Tolstoy Dressed In Peasant Clothing by Ilya Repin](https://artpaintingartist.org/tolstoy-dressed-peasant-clothing-ilya-repin/)** > > Tolstoy Dressed In Peasant Clothing by Ilya Repin > [@Frodo](#): > > I came to realize what they want is a world without _coercion_, organization would still exist but without forcing anyone to participate (@MrDibble please correct me if I’m wrong). It really does depend on what flavour of anarchist you are (there are soooo many) but this holds for me. Anarchism to me means “no rulers”, not “chaos” . ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2023, 8:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-sovcit-movement-for-a-different-reason/980412/49 "2023-02-27T20:16:33Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > Do they think that they’re going to argue enough with the cops so the cops will say, “Y’know, I guess you really DON’T need a driver’s license if you’re just traveling, good job, carry on!” > [@Czarcasm](#): > > Yes they do, because the lying shitheels that write the books and pamphlets and run the websites say it works for them. I’ve watched a few videos of these encounters, and I think the cops are misunderstanding how to handle it. Arguing with the SovCits that they’re not interpreting the Constitution correctly is a lost cause. Instead, they should approach it from the angle I suggested: “You think you’re going to persuade me and that I’m not going to handcuff you, but your choices have resulted in these handcuffs going on your wrists. You might think that’s unconstitutional, and I won’t argue that point, but I will put the handcuffs on. If you don’t want the handcuffs next time, you’ll need to make different choices. Whether I’m violating the constitution or not, according to your interpretation, doesn’t affect where the handcuffs go. Choose your actions not according to what some research told you, but according to the predictable results.” ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2023, 8:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-sovcit-movement-for-a-different-reason/980412/50 "2023-02-27T20:22:51Z")
What they will hear is “Burbity burbity blah blah blah”. I’ve seen videos in the past where the police have tried that approach, and it was about as effective as if they had read off the menu from Jack In The Box. ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2023, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-sovcit-movement-for-a-different-reason/980412/51 "2023-02-27T20:25:00Z")
Too much verbiage. “I’m going to do you a favor. I’m going to arrest you (or alternatively issue you this ticket) so that you will have the opportunity to go in front of the Judge and present your legal theories. If you are correct and I’m wrong, then you go free.” ---
**Author:** ![Mighty\_Mouse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mighty_mouse/32/7776_2.png) [@Mighty\_Mouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mighty_Mouse)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2023, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-sovcit-movement-for-a-different-reason/980412/52 "2023-02-27T20:25:43Z")
Yes, but it would be quicker and look fine on the videos to 90+% of the population. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2023, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-sovcit-movement-for-a-different-reason/980412/53 "2023-02-27T20:28:55Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > With SovCits, I want to ask them the same thing. Do they think that they’re going to argue enough with the cops so the cops will say, “Y’know, I guess you really DON’T need a driver’s license if you’re just traveling, good job, carry on!” Well, sort of. Remember, you are dealing with people with a lot of low grade desperation who don’t know how to get their shit together. This isn’t a political philosophy. It’s a Hail Mary play. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2023, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-sovcit-movement-for-a-different-reason/980412/54 "2023-02-27T20:29:08Z")
> [@Atamasama](#): > > You know those clickbait links where they say something like, “This one weird weight-loss trick your doctor doesn’t want you to know about!” It’s **just the legal version of that** , and instead it’s the government that “doesn’t want you to know about it”. _Pseudo_legal, actually, but your points are well-made, and well-taken. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2023, 8:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-sovcit-movement-for-a-different-reason/980412/55 "2023-02-27T20:31:45Z")
> [@kaylasdad99](#): > > _Pseudo_legal, actually I meant “legal in their minds” but I get what you’re saying. It’s legal the way that homeopathy is scientific. ---
**Author:** ![EddyTeddyFreddy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eddyteddyfreddy/32/18796_2.png) [@EddyTeddyFreddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EddyTeddyFreddy)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2023, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-sovcit-movement-for-a-different-reason/980412/56 "2023-02-27T20:35:51Z")
The essence of the mindset to me boils down to: “You’re not the boss of ME!” ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2023, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-sovcit-movement-for-a-different-reason/980412/57 "2023-02-27T20:53:03Z")
They don’t recognize it as an arrest, they do not recognize the man behind the desk as a judge, and in their minds they are already the winner. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2023, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-sovcit-movement-for-a-different-reason/980412/58 "2023-02-27T20:53:53Z")
“Maybe not, but whoever _IS_ the boss of you is gonna be pissed when I do the paperwork on this interaction. Because I’m a _HUGE_ tattletale.” ---
**Author:** ![griffin1977](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/977dab/32.png) [@griffin1977](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/griffin1977)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2023, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-sovcit-movement-for-a-different-reason/980412/59 "2023-02-27T21:37:05Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > They don’t recognize it as an arrest, they do not recognize the man behind the desk as a judge, and in their minds they are already the winner. This brings it back to the OP. this what an anarchist would say. The only reason the policeman is arresting people and judge is behind the desk sentencing people is because they have the power of state violence behind them, not because they have some inherent moral authority. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2023, 9:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-sovcit-movement-for-a-different-reason/980412/60 "2023-02-27T21:55:18Z")
> [@griffin1977](#): > > This brings it back to the OP. this what an anarchist would say. Have you ever talked with an anarchist? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-sovcit-movement-for-a-different-reason/980412.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-sovcit-movement-for-a-different-reason/980412.md?page=4)