# I pit the United States of America **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [December 13, 2011, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-united-states-of-america/606078 "2011-12-13T20:53:12Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![brewha](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/91b2a8/32.png) [@brewha](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brewha)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2011, 1:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-united-states-of-america/606078/41 "2011-12-14T13:38:25Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > But if you actually do ever try to emigrate, you’ll find that countries are like women - given a choice, none of them are going to want to have you inside of them. That was beautiful. I only hope I have the opportunity to steal this line at some point! ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2011, 2:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-united-states-of-america/606078/42 "2011-12-14T14:05:55Z")
> [@RTFirefly](#): > > Software engineers, as a group, sound like a bunch of people who think they’re too smart to need to belong in a union, but are really too stupid to realize that they should unionize. No, we… doesn’t! ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2011, 2:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-united-states-of-america/606078/43 "2011-12-14T14:16:31Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > But if you actually do ever try to emigrate, you’ll find that countries are like women - given a choice, none of them are going to want to have you inside of them. **Little Nemo** , I dry my laundry in the sun of your brilliance. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2011, 2:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-united-states-of-america/606078/44 "2011-12-14T14:26:49Z")
Well, I love this country. My parents came 7,000 miles for better opportunities here. As a woman, I have more freedom here in upstate NY than I ever would have had in India. I know we have problems, and they are the same problems everyone has. I would rather work to fix them than whine about them. Door, ass, OP. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2011, 2:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-united-states-of-america/606078/45 "2011-12-14T14:52:54Z")
> [@Hambil](#): > > I’m also in the process of going off meds that keep me from being able to hold complex structures in my head… Not very far along in that process, are you? ---
**Author:** ![howye](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a9adbd/32.png) [@howye](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/howye)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2011, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-united-states-of-america/606078/46 "2011-12-14T15:11:06Z")
Well, that about as well as could be expected, didn’t it? Dude, you OP would have been better served by telling us exactly what your problems are and what the government of the USA has failed to do to solve those problems, that it does for others with similar problems. As it is you come off, at best, as whiny mcdoucheirson. But I suspect you are intentionally on the bus to banville, enjoy your trip. Suicide by Mod as it were. ---
**Author:** ![Lemur866](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lemur866/32/434_2.png) [@Lemur866](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lemur866)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2011, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-united-states-of-america/606078/47 "2011-12-14T17:15:23Z")
I’ve worked several times as a contractor for a large multinational software company headquartered in Redmond Washington. Back in the olden days they did expect lots of overtime, but they always paid you time and a half for overtime. Then came the end of the olden days and they finally realized that for the same price you could pay one contractor to work 60 hours or you could pay two to work 40 hours. I’ve never been on a team that expected unpaid overtime for contractors, and never heard of a team that did. Maybe at other companies it happens all the time, but mandatory unpaid overtime for hourly workers is absolutely not an industry standard. ---
**Author:** ![Hambil](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/3be4f8/32.png) [@Hambil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hambil)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2011, 9:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-united-states-of-america/606078/48 "2011-12-14T21:38:26Z")
Of course not. In our industry mandatory overtime is almost never asked for. It’s volunteer. If you don’t volunteer, you will find yourself looking for another job soon enough though. ---
**Author:** ![Smeghead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f1d935/32.png) [@Smeghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smeghead)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2011, 11:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-united-states-of-america/606078/49 "2011-12-14T23:24:57Z")
> [@](#): > > I pit the United States of America Even Delaware? How could anyone have anything against cute lil’ Delaware? ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2011, 12:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-united-states-of-america/606078/50 "2011-12-15T00:02:52Z")
> [@Hambil](#): > > Of course not. In our industry mandatory overtime is almost never asked for. It’s volunteer. If you don’t volunteer, you will find yourself looking for another job soon enough though. Strange that companies are firing programmers when everyone is so desperate to hire them. ---
**Author:** ![Meyer6](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/cc9497/32.png) [@Meyer6](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meyer6)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2011, 12:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-united-states-of-america/606078/51 "2011-12-15T00:26:33Z")
> [@Hambil](#): > > As for Randroids that say “you made very good money, why didn’t you save, etc.” - I did, it was all lost do to medical bills. As for insurance, I didn’t have it Incidentally, if you were making very good money and were able to save, why didn’t you buy yourself health insurance? I get that your benefits were cut at work but what stopped you from buying your own? I’m usually the last person castigate someone for not having insurance, and I also happen to think that the US health care system is the stupidest sounding idea in the world, but living without insurance is a huge gamble, isn’t it? I have nothing but sympathy for those who can’t afford insurance and those who get screwed by insurance companies, but (according to you) you had lots of money and no insurance at all. Now I’m not an American, so perhaps there’s an obvious reason why someone would be in this situation, but I’m curious as to why that would be. ---
**Author:** ![Huerta88](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/82dd89/32.png) [@Huerta88](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Huerta88)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2011, 12:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-united-states-of-america/606078/52 "2011-12-15T00:30:11Z")
> [@Hambil](#): > > I haven’t gotten anything from the government. Why would you? > [@](#): > > I’m still fighting for my benefits. What makes them “yours?” > [@](#): > > In the meantime (unable to work for medical reason that are nobody else’s business really - by law), I have pressed hard to get back on my feet with or without government aid. Why not try “without?” The default presumption is that adults can and do take care of themselves and their family. “The government” is not around to be the go-to source of “benefits,” which can only come from taking taxes from those who (unlike you) are employed, productive members of society. Shorter version: have a little pride and act like a man. > [@](#): > > I’m on a very strict vegan diet for improving my heart health, and have lost 85lbs this year. What does this have to do with anything? > [@](#): > > I’m also in the process of going off meds that keep me from being able to hold complex structures in my head (critical to the level of work I do), and doing a number of other very hard things, Our first confirmation that the “unable to work” correlates with some character flaw that’s squarely down to you. > [@](#): > > because I simply do not believe the government will ever help me at this point. Again, where did you get the rather bizarre idea that they would, should, must? > [@](#): > > So, yeah, I’m getting better, and will get back on my feet. But, after what I’ve been through, the odds of my using the very indemand computer skills I have in this country, after being treated they way it treated me, are near zero. Too bad, so sad. But the demonstrated fact is that tons of people threaten to leave the U.S. and almost none carry through. Americans are some of the least likely people to emigrate, for reasons ranging from lack of multilingual skills to the fact that for most non-malingering, willing-to-work, grown ups, life can be pretty okay here. > [@](#): > > Most likely without major changes to our system, when I can work again it won’t be in the US. You don’t sound like any kind of prize employee, with the phantom health problems and toxic entitlement mentality. > [@](#): > > It’s called a[braindrain](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brain_drain), and the US is headed for a massive one. Yeah, no it’s not. 70% of Americans don’t even have a passport. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2011, 1:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-united-states-of-america/606078/53 "2011-12-15T01:03:07Z")
> [@Meyer6](#): > > Incidentally, if you were making very good money and were able to save, why didn’t you buy yourself health insurance? I get that your benefits were cut at work but what stopped you from buying your own? > > I’m usually the last person castigate someone for not having insurance, and I also happen to think that the US health care system is the stupidest sounding idea in the world, but living without insurance is a huge gamble, isn’t it? I have nothing but sympathy for those who can’t afford insurance and those who get screwed by insurance companies, but (according to you) you had lots of money and no insurance at all. > > Now I’m not an American, so perhaps there’s an obvious reason why someone would be in this situation, but I’m curious as to why that would be. It costs a lot of money. I’m a single guy with no significant health problems. I priced my health insurance plan a couple of years ago and it would cost me five hundred dollars a month if I paid it out of pocket. Yes, going without insurance is a gamble but some people decide they to take that chance. ---
**Author:** ![Huerta88](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/82dd89/32.png) [@Huerta88](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Huerta88)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2011, 1:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-united-states-of-america/606078/54 "2011-12-15T01:45:03Z")
> [@Hambil](#): > > As for Randroids that say “you made very good money, why didn’t you save, etc.” - I did, it was all lost do to medical bills. As for insurance, I didn’t have it - and here is why: **Little Nemo** is right that private insurance cover is not dirt cheap (his numbers gibe with what I’m paying for (very good) private health insurance). I can understand that might be tough for people in the lower middle/middle middle class. But then see above. If the OP’s skills were so “indemand” and he “made very good money,” whose fault is it that he did not, in addition to saving, invest $6k a year to make sure unexpected health problems did not become a catastrophic blow to his finances/life? Oh, he was kinda dumb about it? Never mind then, carry on. ---
**Author:** ![jz78817](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jz78817/32/1028_2.png) [@jz78817](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jz78817)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2011, 2:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-united-states-of-america/606078/55 "2011-12-15T02:03:38Z")
> [@Rhythmdvl](#): > > Lastly, wasn’t there a Cracked article a little while ago about the reality of being an expat? If findable, would help the Op > **[6 Reasons Your Plans to Move Abroad Might Not Work Out](https://www.cracked.com/article_19363_6-reasons-your-plans-to-move-abroad-might-not-work-out.html)** > > Every month or so, you probably know of someone who just gets fed up with America and wants to leave. Make sure you show them this first. ---
**Author:** ![Rhythmdvl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/85f322/32.png) [@Rhythmdvl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rhythmdvl)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2011, 2:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-united-states-of-america/606078/56 "2011-12-15T02:32:29Z")
Thats it, thanks. The OP should give it a read. … I’m ostensibly a glorified freelancer (have short-term and contract employees only). We pay about 900 per month for the low-end family plan. Does that jibe with other’s experience? ---
**Author:** ![Meyer6](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/cc9497/32.png) [@Meyer6](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meyer6)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2011, 2:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-united-states-of-america/606078/57 "2011-12-15T02:38:49Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > It costs a lot of money. I’m a single guy with no significant health problems. I priced my health insurance plan a couple of years ago and it would cost me five hundred dollars a month if I paid it out of pocket. Yes, going without insurance is a gamble but some people decide they to take that chance. Yeah, I get that insurance is a luxury for many people, but the OP makes it sound like he had lots of disposable income for luxuries. If someone wants to take a gamble with their health then they should expect the consequences. I’m not saying that the consequences of getting sick in the US are just, but surely the OP should have known what he was risking. ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2011, 3:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-united-states-of-america/606078/58 "2011-12-15T03:06:27Z")
> [@Huerta88](#): > > If the OP’s skills were so “indemand” and he “made very good money,” whose fault is it that he did not, in addition to saving, invest $6k a year to make sure unexpected health problems did not become a catastrophic blow to his finances/life? The largest single drain on my savings while I’m unemployed is not my rent, not my car payment, but my COBRA payment. Should I not find a job in the next two or three months, I’ve got to decide whether to keep my apartment and my car, or my health insurance. ---
**Author:** ![PunditLisa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/4af34b/32.png) [@PunditLisa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PunditLisa)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2011, 1:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-united-states-of-america/606078/59 "2011-12-15T13:14:38Z")
> [@Rhythmdvl](#): > > I’m ostensibly a glorified freelancer (have short-term and contract employees only). We pay about 900 per month for the low-end family plan. Does that jibe with other’s experience? We pay about $800/month IIRC, for the employee’s portion of our family health insurance coverage. My husband’s company picks up a portion of it, but I don’t know how much. Insurance is expensive. It’s one reason why I’m still driving an 8 year old minivan. ---
**Author:** ![Labrador\_Deceiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7c8e57/32.png) [@Labrador\_Deceiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Labrador_Deceiver)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2011, 2:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-united-states-of-america/606078/60 "2011-12-15T14:20:50Z")
> [@Smeghead](#): > > Even Delaware? How could anyone have anything against cute lil’ Delaware? You ever been to Wilmington? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-united-states-of-america/606078.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-the-united-states-of-america/606078.md?page=4)