# I pit Verizon for being a douche instead of doing the right thing **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [May 25, 2009, 4:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-verizon-for-being-a-douche-instead-of-doing-the-right-thing/497536 "2009-05-25T04:56:50Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![WarmNPrickly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/d78d45/32.png) [@WarmNPrickly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WarmNPrickly)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2009, 10:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-verizon-for-being-a-douche-instead-of-doing-the-right-thing/497536/21 "2009-05-25T22:50:32Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > The meme that corporations are somehow more trustworthy than democracy is about as stupid and ignorant as it can possibly fucking get. Amen ---
**Author:** ![billfish678](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@billfish678](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/billfish678)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2009, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-verizon-for-being-a-douche-instead-of-doing-the-right-thing/497536/22 "2009-05-25T23:44:26Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > Yeah they didn’t start building them this way until after 2001, when the US Gov’t wanted the ability to listen to everything. At least, that’s when it was more or less mandated that they be constructed this way, AFAIK. > > Still, a lot of people have no idea that even with your phone off, even without the battery in it, someone could be listening to you or tracking you. If you wrap in aluminum foil when not using it, will that keep you safe? Maybe the tin foil hats guys were closer than we think 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Shalmanese](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/45deac/32.png) [@Shalmanese](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shalmanese)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2009, 7:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-verizon-for-being-a-douche-instead-of-doing-the-right-thing/497536/23 "2009-05-26T07:09:22Z")
It seems like the much simpler explanation was that there was no available override in the system and the only way to have the phone turned on was to have the payment removed from the account. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2009, 7:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-verizon-for-being-a-douche-instead-of-doing-the-right-thing/497536/24 "2009-05-26T07:21:29Z")
> [@Shalmanese](#): > > It seems like the much simpler explanation was that there was no available override in the system and the only way to have the phone turned on was to have the payment removed from the account. Which they should have done and allowed the police to foot the bill. There’s really no excuse for this. ---
**Author:** ![Rigamarole](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/77aa72/32.png) [@Rigamarole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rigamarole)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2009, 8:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-verizon-for-being-a-douche-instead-of-doing-the-right-thing/497536/25 "2009-05-26T08:16:03Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > If the fire department is called to a burning apartment building, do you think the firefighters should be able to go door to door searching apartments to evacuate the building and to search for injured or unconscious victims, or would that be too much of an invasion or privacy? Totally different scenario and not really at all relevant here. But yes they should be able to. ---
**Author:** ![Rolken](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/df788c/32.png) [@Rolken](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rolken)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2009, 8:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-verizon-for-being-a-douche-instead-of-doing-the-right-thing/497536/26 "2009-05-26T08:33:29Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > What “power” was the government “abusing,” and what kind of moron trusts souless, faceless, unaccountable, unelected, unfireable, inaccessible corporate vampire cocksuckers over a government that they elect and can hold accountable and can even be a part of. The meme that corporations are somehow more trustworthy than democracy is about as stupid and ignorant as it can possibly fucking get. There is a notable distinction here: you personally can choose which corporations you deal with, whereas governments are chosen collectively. (And to state the obvious, you can be a part of a corporation too.) I won’t defend the comment you were responding to, but I think the conversation ought not be framed in its terms. There isn’t as much need to trust a company because you don’t have to move to Canada to stop dealing with them. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2009, 12:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-verizon-for-being-a-douche-instead-of-doing-the-right-thing/497536/27 "2009-05-26T12:42:58Z")
> [@Rigamarole](#): > > Totally different scenario and not really at all relevant here. But yes they should be able to. What’s the difference? ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2009, 12:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-verizon-for-being-a-douche-instead-of-doing-the-right-thing/497536/28 "2009-05-26T12:44:36Z")
> [@Rolken](#): > > There is a notable distinction here: you personally can choose which corporations you deal with, whereas governments are chosen collectively. (And to state the obvious, you can be a part of a corporation too.) I won’t defend the comment you were responding to, but I think the conversation ought not be framed in its terms. There isn’t as much need to trust a company because you don’t have to move to Canada to stop dealing with them. All corporations are the same…sometimes literally. Consumer choice is a complete illusion. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2009, 1:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-verizon-for-being-a-douche-instead-of-doing-the-right-thing/497536/29 "2009-05-26T13:18:25Z")
> [@cwthree](#): > > The phone still has to have the battery installed for any of these to work, because the phone still has to have a source of power. > > “Turning the phone off” is not the same as completely powering the phone down. It’s kind of like being asleep versus being dead. If you’re asleep, your brain is still receiving information about your body and its surroundings - that’s why you’ll wake up when you smell smoke or your bladder is full. If you’re dead, no amount of smoke or bladder fullness will rouse you. A “turned off” phone is similar to a sleeping person. A phone without a battery is more like a corpse. You are correct. I was mistaken. I thought I read in one article that there was sufficient power from the Li-Ion battery to activate the mic, but now I can’t find it. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2009, 1:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-verizon-for-being-a-douche-instead-of-doing-the-right-thing/497536/30 "2009-05-26T13:58:04Z")
Why didn’t they just call Jeff Goldblum? ---
**Author:** ![Words\_on\_the\_Interweb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b19c9b/32.png) [@Words\_on\_the\_Interweb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Words_on_the_Interweb)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2009, 4:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-verizon-for-being-a-douche-instead-of-doing-the-right-thing/497536/31 "2009-05-26T16:08:23Z")
If the $20 is so meaningless, why did it take the sheriff’s department 11 hours to agree to pay it? According to the article, deputies found the missing man just as the sheriff’s office was making arrangements to pay the bill. Seriously, they argued for 11 hours? Or perhaps the sheriff didn’t even contact Verizon until just prior to the man being found. As to the issue of Verizon’s actions, the article implies only a single operator was spoken to, and makes no mention of manager involvement. So a Verizon operator risks their job by violating policy and overriding a customer’s unpaid bill status\*, or a sheriff shells out $20 to avoid the issue. Sure, Verizon’s corporate policy could use some revamping for situations like this, but I don’t see how Verizon is a “villain” in this case. Hell, for all we know, the corporate policy does allow for emergency phone activation, and the individual operator was ignorant of the policy, or just being a jerk that day. I just don’t see enough information about the timeline or the official Verizon policy to label Verizon a “douche” or even hold them responsible for the situation. - ETA: assuming they even have the authority or means to override the bill status. The phone’s activation status may be tied directly to the billing system, which will not update unless a credit card transaction is processed. ---
**Author:** ![buttonjockey308](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/bcef8e/32.png) [@buttonjockey308](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/buttonjockey308)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2009, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-verizon-for-being-a-douche-instead-of-doing-the-right-thing/497536/32 "2009-05-26T17:02:02Z")
Allow me to provide some insight; Law enforcement agencies typically have an agreement with cellphone companies that will allow them in "exigent circumstances’’ to get not only the location, but the name, address and account information of a phone account holder. In order for this to happen, the LEA has to fax to the network ops center a form outlining what they need and why. That form is signed, legal and binding on both ends. There have been (and I don’t know if Verizon does this) cases where the company through their security departments CAN activate and locate a handset. The problem is that if the location software permissions are turned off, that has to be overridden, typically by folks higher up on the food chain than the ones in the NOC. The idea that Verizon wouldn’t do this speaks more to their backward system of money first THEN service than it does to their at-the-time refusal to turn this phone on. Re: Tracking. You can purchase and install tracking software on any phone you can have in your possession. In 15 minutes and for about $300 you can have a spy phone of fair to excellent quality that allows you to GPS track, read email/SMS, listen to the what’s happening around the phone and some of the systems will install using bluetooth so you don’t even have to wait around to install it just get the process going and the only way to stop it is to pull the battery. Should they have? Yes. But they’re not in the ‘doing the right thing’ business, they’re in the cell phone business, if there’s not only no money but in fact a potential liability with activating a turned off phone for “safety reasons” they’re not going to do it. For them, that’s a slippery slope. ---
**Author:** ![Rigamarole](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/77aa72/32.png) [@Rigamarole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rigamarole)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2009, 7:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-verizon-for-being-a-douche-instead-of-doing-the-right-thing/497536/33 "2009-05-26T19:35:20Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > What’s the difference? You really don’t see any difference between “old man runs away from home” and “building is on fire”? I don’t think I could explain it in any way you would understand. ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2009, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-verizon-for-being-a-douche-instead-of-doing-the-right-thing/497536/34 "2009-05-26T20:08:56Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > The meme that corporations are somehow more trustworthy than democracy is about as stupid and ignorant as it can possibly fucking get. I mean, we all remember that evil corporation that interned thousands of citizens because of their ancestry, right? ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2009, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-verizon-for-being-a-douche-instead-of-doing-the-right-thing/497536/35 "2009-05-26T20:12:53Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > All corporations are the same…sometimes literally. Consumer choice is a complete illusion. And this differs from the political establishment? ---
**Author:** ![gigi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a587f6/32.png) [@gigi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gigi)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2009, 10:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-verizon-for-being-a-douche-instead-of-doing-the-right-thing/497536/36 "2009-05-26T22:29:49Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > Which they should have done and allowed the police to foot the bill. There’s really no excuse for this. Which they were in the process of doing when the man was located. ---
**Author:** ![WarmNPrickly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/d78d45/32.png) [@WarmNPrickly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WarmNPrickly)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2009, 11:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-verizon-for-being-a-douche-instead-of-doing-the-right-thing/497536/37 "2009-05-26T23:56:13Z")
> [@Steve\_MB](#): > > I mean, we all remember that evil corporation that interned thousands of citizens because of their ancestry, right? Oh I know this one! They made cotton right? ---
**Author:** ![BellRungBookShut-CandleSnuffed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/bcef8e/32.png) [@BellRungBookShut-CandleSnuffed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BellRungBookShut-CandleSnuffed)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2009, 12:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-verizon-for-being-a-douche-instead-of-doing-the-right-thing/497536/38 "2009-05-27T00:16:18Z")
> [@WarmNPrickly](#): > > Oh I know this one! They made cotton right? Nice one. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2009, 1:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-verizon-for-being-a-douche-instead-of-doing-the-right-thing/497536/39 "2009-05-27T01:41:13Z")
> [@Tom\_Tildrum](#): > > I think your first instinct is correct. It’s not clear to me why they expected the man’s handset to be on if his account had been suspended. I’ve had a suspended account before, and I would sometimes still have the phone on so I could look up phone numbers in my contacts list. ---
**Author:** ![Casserole](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/b77776/32.png) [@Casserole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Casserole)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2009, 1:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-verizon-for-being-a-douche-instead-of-doing-the-right-thing/497536/40 "2009-05-27T01:48:14Z")
> [@Words\_on\_the\_Interweb](#): > > As to the issue of Verizon’s actions, the article implies only a single operator was spoken to, and makes no mention of manager involvement. I don’t know about you, but if I were a CSR, and the police were on the line, the **first** thing I would do would be to transfer the call to my manager, no questions asked. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-verizon-for-being-a-douche-instead-of-doing-the-right-thing/497536.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-verizon-for-being-a-douche-instead-of-doing-the-right-thing/497536.md?page=3)